Daniel 9:26, 27 explained through New Test verses? YES? or no

[Charlie744]

3 minutes ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

This makes no sense.

 

Jesus comes at the end of the 70th week not the begining

Where do you see that? Doesn't verse 25 tell us that "until the Messiah there shall be seven and 62 weeks (69 weeks completed)? Meaning after the 69th week ends is the beginning of the 70th week...

3 minutes ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

Jesus said when you see the abomination of desolation in the holy place… This is done by He of verse 27, not christ.  

As for vs 27, Gabriel told Daniel he will confirm a covenant for 1 week (7 years) did gabriel get it wrong?   

 

As for not responding to the 2nd part of my question. You prety much have to if you are going to try to convince me the HE of vs 27 (which commits the abomination of desolation) is Christ.. you can not seperate the two. 

I understand how frustrating it is to only respond to some of the questions, but I am in the middle of putting together a commentary on Daniel and this and many more in chapter 9 include interpretations that are NOT "out there". Once again, I apologize but there are at least another 34 MAJOR misinterpretations or missing interpretations that are found today as "currently accepted interpretations".

But regarding the Covenant time element of 1 week... it is NOT a 7 year covenant but the Jeremiah 31 Covenant that will be CONFIRMED by the Messiah DURING the last week in Daniel's 70 weeks. This IS ONE OF THE MOST CORRUPTED INTERPRETATIONS CREATED AND PROMOTED BY THE RCC. The only thing I would ask is for you to focus just on this particular verse and its history  / interpretations ...Charlie

 

 

 

[Eternally Gratefull]

1 hour ago, Charlie744 said:

Sorry DeighAnn, I left something out... The destruction of the Temple by Titus in 70 AD was NOT to take place WITHIN THE LAST WEEK OF DANIEL'S 70TH WEEK. This most important week belonged to the Messiah ONLY and would include ONLY those 6 requirements He was given to fulfill by His Father. The physical Temple, AFTER THE CROSS, was no longer important and would never again hold any value to God... the Messiah would be our Holy Temple. But that did not mean the physical Temple would not be predicted to be destroyed...as it is clearly predicted in verse 26... but again, it is predicted in these same verses but it DOES NOT mean it had to be fulfilled within the last week. 

Charlie

Dan 9 was not about the messiah

 

Daniel prayed about his people and their sin, the holy city and the sanctuary. That is the context of daniel 9

 

Messiah is only mentioned as a piece of the puzzle to fill in the gaps of the time which Israel will have to wait for the things to be fulfilled

[Eternally Gratefull]

46 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

The prayer was not about the coming Messiah and the city and its people --- at least not in the way you MAY think it (and I apologize for assuming how I think you are thinking it).

The prayer is absolutely REQUIRED to take place after the Jews spent the last 70 years in captivity. Although they completed their "punishment" period of 70 years, God demands they offer a sincere prayer and seek His f0rgiveness... In Leviticus there is a blessing and a curse for disobeying God, but even though God may / will punish someone, they MUST  still show Him they are deeply sorry for their disobedience an ask His forgiveness. Without this prayer, the Jews would not have been forgiven and allowed to return home. The interesting thing here is Daniel was not a priest and only the priest could offer up a prayer for the forgiveness of their sins (both collectively and for the priest individually). But because of Daniel's holiness, God would allow him to offer that prayer for him and the Jews.

Charlie

Read again

Dan 9: 

¹⁶ “O Lord, according to all Your righteousness, I pray, let Your anger and Your fury be turned away from Your city Jerusalem, Your holy mountain; because for our sins, and for the iniquities of our fathers, Jerusalem and Your people are a reproach to all those around us. ¹⁷ Now therefore, our God, hear the prayer of Your servant, and his supplications, and for the Lord’s sake ^[a]cause Your face to shine on ^[b]Your sanctuary, which is desolate. ¹⁸ O my God, incline Your ear and hear; open Your eyes and see our desolations, and the city which is called by Your name; for we do not present our supplications before You because of our righteous deeds, but because of Your great mercies. ¹⁹ O Lord, hear! O Lord, forgive! O Lord, listen and act! Do not delay for Your own sake, my God, for Your city and Your people are called by Your name.”

Gabriel even states, it is about the people and the sanctuary and holy city nothing about messiah is mentioned

Vs 24: “Seventy ^[e]weeks are determined For your people and for your holy city,

 

 

[Eternally Gratefull]

Can someone tell me how to split quotes.. I will be back in a few

Edited June 21, 2022 by Eternally Gratefull

[Charlie744]

6 minutes ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

It does not fit.

 

Messiah does not come till the end of the 69th week.

He showed up exactly on time

he is cut off after..

We agree completely. He arrived on day 1 of the 70th week (after the end of the 69th week) and began His ministry. You may be confusing this.... perhaps this way. The 70th week (1st day) Jesus BEGAN HIS MINISTRY. He could not begin HIS MINISTRY UNTIL HE WAS 30 YEARS OLD. You may be c0nfusing the start of His ministry with His birth?  No, they are 30 years apart.

6 minutes ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

Messiah did not come at his baptism as many think.. no one would have recognized that as the time of messiah because that was nto prophesied.

Again, I think you may be confusing His birth time with the start of His ministry. Jesus certainly was baptized when He was a baby, but we are talking about His baptism by John in the Jordan river to start His ministry.

6 minutes ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

and the cross is not the abomination of desolation.. An abomination that causes desolation is an unclean thing placed in a holy place rendering it unclean or desolate.

 

Antiochus epiphanies slaughtered a pig in the holy place. It was called an abomination that makes desolate.

this is wat the jews would have looked for..

Jesus also spoke of it. As occuring right before the great tribulation. Which would be ended with his return. Which prophecy states will be the time Israel repents.

The things which were to come true at the end of the 70th week have not yet happened.  Israel is still in sin, she has not repented. 

Sure they have. If you look at them in a spiritual view. Jesus fulfilled all 6 of His requirements. It is up to each one of us to believe He is the Messiah and to place our  faith and trust in Him.

Regarding the Jews... the Jews are no different than any other people of the world that have not accepted Jesus as their Messiah. However, God does tell us He will use the Jews as a "marker" ... that He will return when the Jews do come to accept Him as the One they pierced.  But after the Cross, there is neither Jew nor Gentile, male of female, etc., EVERYONE is the same in God's eyes - either you accept Jesus  as your Lord and Savior or you do not - it is that simple....  you can be born in the US, Russia, China, Brazil or in Israel - it doesn't not matter... the only thing that matters is your faith in Christ.

Charlie

[Charlie744]

14 minutes ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

Dan 9 was not about the messiah

 

Daniel prayed about his people and their sin, the holy city and the sanctuary. That is the context of daniel 9

 

Messiah is only mentioned as a piece of the puzzle to fill in the gaps of the time which Israel will have to wait for the things to be fulfilled

We will simple have to disagree but I will tell you that you are in the majority of Christians that also believe the way you do.... almost 2.3 BILLION.

Charlie

[Charlie744]

11 minutes ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

Read again

Dan 9: 

¹⁶ “O Lord, according to all Your righteousness, I pray, let Your anger and Your fury be turned away from Your city Jerusalem, Your holy mountain; because for our sins, and for the iniquities of our fathers, Jerusalem and Your people are a reproach to all those around us. ¹⁷ Now therefore, our God, hear the prayer of Your servant, and his supplications, and for the Lord’s sake ^[a]cause Your face to shine on ^[b]Your sanctuary, which is desolate. ¹⁸ O my God, incline Your ear and hear; open Your eyes and see our desolations, and the city which is called by Your name; for we do not present our supplications before You because of our righteous deeds, but because of Your great mercies. ¹⁹ O Lord, hear! O Lord, forgive! O Lord, listen and act! Do not delay for Your own sake, my God, for Your city and Your people are called by Your name.”

Gabriel even states, it is about the people and the sanctuary and holy city nothing about messiah is mentioned

Vs 24: “Seventy ^[e]weeks are determined For your people and for your holy city,

 

 

There are two major sections in chapter 9 -the first section is Daniel's prayer for forgiveness for their disobedience that caused their 70 punishment in captivity in Babylon.

Then the rest of chapter 9 speaks of the coming Messiah and His requirements He must fulfill during the last week of Daniel's 70th week.

Once again, you are in the majority of Christians.... Charlie

[Eternally Gratefull]

30 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

Where do you see that? Doesn't verse 25 tell us that "until the Messiah there shall be seven and 62 weeks (69 weeks completed)? Meaning after the 69th week ends is the beginning of the 70th week...

all it says is at the end of the 7 plus 62 weeks shall be messiah the prince. This occuired when he rode into jerusalem on the donkey as prophesied.

 

After that it says

1. He will be killed

2. The city and sanctuary will be destroyed

3. They will lay desolate until war desolations are determined (think what jesus said in matt 24. wars and rumers of ward. nation against nation kingdom against kingdom. but the end is not yet)

4. Then a prince will confirm a covenant for 1 week (here is the beginning of the 70th week.)

everything that happened inbetween is fill material. Jesus said, Now it willbe hidden from you.. Israel and that age had ended temporarily,

34 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

I understand how frustrating it is to only respond to some of the questions, but I am in the middle of putting together a commentary on Daniel and this and many more in chapter 9 include interpretations that are NOT "out there". Once again, I apologize but there are at least another 34 MAJOR misinterpretations or missing interpretations that are found today as "currently accepted interpretations".

But regarding the Covenant time element of 1 week... it is NOT a 7 year covenant but the Jeremiah 31 Covenant that will be CONFIRMED by the Messiah DURING the last week in Daniel's 70 weeks. This IS ONE OF THE MOST CORRUPTED INTERPRETATIONS CREATED AND PROMOTED BY THE RCC. The only thing I would ask is for you to focus just on this particular verse and its history  / interpretations ...Charlie

again, I can not agree. Gabriel said 1 week. The context is 70 week. we know from context it is week of years.

 

Before you start telling people how they have misinterpreted something. Maybe you should sit and make sure you are not doing that yourself. that is not helping our discussion..

I have done a study on the beasts of daniel..That does not mean I am going to say I would rather not show you how dan 9 fits because it is not done yet, and then say so many have misinterpreted it. That would make me appear proud..

 

 

[Eternally Gratefull]

25 minutes ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

Can someone tell me how to split quotes.. I will be back in a few

As you can see I figured it out..lolol

[Eternally Gratefull]

22 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

We agree completely. He arrived on day 1 of the 70th week (after the end of the 69th week) and began His ministry. perhaps this way. The 70th week (1st day) Jesus BEGAN HIS MINISTRY. He could not begin HIS MINISTRY UNTIL HE WAS 30 YEARS OLD. You may be c0nfusing the start of His ministry with His birth?  No, they are 30 years apart.

we do not agree, He started his ministry during the 69th week. not the first day of the 70th

23 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

Again, I think you may be confusing His birth time with the start of His ministry. Jesus certainly was baptized when He was a baby, but we are talking about His baptism by John in the Jordan river to start His ministry.

no, I am showing when the messiah was introduced. Not at his birth or his baptism. He was introduced as the prophet said he would be, Riding into town on a donkey. Until then Jesus declared. My time is not yet..

It says from the time of the command to restore until messiah shall be 7 plus 62 weeks (69 weeks)

it then says after the 62nd week (in the Hebrew, this means immediately following, directly after) messiah is cut off.

it does not say in the middle of the week messiah will be cut off

27 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

Sure they have. If you look at them in a spiritual view. Jesus fulfilled all 6 of His requirements. It is up to each one of us to believe He is the Messiah and to place our  faith and trust in Him.

 

this is not about us, or the messiah.. And we do not spiritualise prophecy that removes its purpose and ability to do what it was meant to do.

Gabriel told us flat out. Concerning your people, your holy city. That is the context. to take it outside of what Gabriel said is to take it out of context and leads to misinterpretation

30 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

Regarding the Jews... the Jews are no different than any other people of the world that have not accepted Jesus as their Messiah. However, God does tell us He will use the Jews as a "marker" ... that He will return when the Jews do come to accept Him as the One they pierced.  But after the Cross, there is neither Jew nor Gentile, male of female, etc., EVERYONE is the same in God's eyes - either you accept Jesus  as your Lord and Savior or you do not - it is that simple....  you can be born in the US, Russia, China, Brazil or in Israel - it doesn't not matter... the only thing that matters is your faith in Christ.

Charlie

Sure they have. If you look at them in a spiritual view. Jesus fulfilled all 6 of His requirements. It is up to each one of us to believe He is the Messiah and to place our  faith and trust in Him.

30 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

Regarding the Jews... the Jews are no different than any other people of the world that have not accepted Jesus as their Messiah. However, God does tell us He will use the Jews as a "marker" ... that He will return when the Jews do come to accept Him as the One they pierced.  But after the Cross, there is neither Jew nor Gentile, male of female, etc., EVERYONE is the same in God's eyes - either you accept Jesus  as your Lord and Savior or you do not - it is that simple....  you can be born in the US, Russia, China, Brazil or in Israel - it doesn't not matter... the only thing that matters is your faith in Christ.

Charlie

 

again, Look at verse 24. This is about daniel, his city and people