IF 'the dead' DEAD are not resurrected, who are we to rule and reign over for the 1000 years.

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, TrueFollowerOfChrist said:

I don't believe that us ruling is limited to the existence of unbelievers. Just as there is a hierarchy of angels, I believe there will be some believers in Heaven or the eternal state that will have authority over others. There is nothing sinful about people having authority over others, so why wouldn't this occur in the next life too?

But we read

Mark 13:27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

Jesus comes to rule and reign, here on earth.  The armies of heaven are coming with Him.  There will be no 'unseen' Kingdom of GOD anymore.  

Remember when the two witnesses rise up HEAVEN is becoming  visible and audible, and once we are all are in spiritual bodies,  then there will be no separation of the two worlds left.  


11 And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.
12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.
13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,

If you think about the GREAT voice and the kingdoms of this world becoming the kingdoms of our Lord

(this next part came when trying to figure out how dead IN CHRIST could POSSIBLY rise up out of the corruption and become immortal when it is written, 'neither doth corruption inherit incorruption', making THAT whole resurrection of the DEAD being of the living impossible, but I digress that is not the subject)

but anyhow,

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first

the two witnesses - dead in Christ - AND not rising up out of the corruption!!!

(the two witnesses ARE NEVER BURIED, yea!!!, well to me anyhow, Please don't comment, I know, I stand all alone, I get it, everyone is gonna be resurrected on the last day out from the dead...)

anyway,  just somethings to give a little bit of thought to...

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.


And NO, I don't see any problem with ruling and reigning...

[Revelation Man]

On 10/12/2022 at 9:59 PM, DeighAnn said:

Where do you get these ideas from.  I CAN'T BE CONFLATING because I DON'T BELIVE IN PRE TRIB RAPTURE.  NOR DO I believe Christ will be on the earth for the 70th week.  

So none of that has any basis in any truth FROM MY END.  That is all in your own making.  

This is simply NOT TRUE, your BELIEF has nothing to do with you ACTULLY conflating issues. As a matter of facts it points toward that conflation with a REASON behind your conflation.

EXAMPLE:

If you did not believe Nebuchadnezzar ever existed, thus you staring speaking about things that happened under his rule as happening under his son Belshazzar's rule, you would be CONFLATING two different kings rule, regardless of your belief, that would be a TRUE FACT !!

You being wrong on the Rapture doesn't mean you do not conflate issues, it just means there is a REASON you conflate the issues, you are still conflating the issues because you are in error on the rapture, God isn't going to change His plans because you can't quite grasp them sister !!

So, ANYONE can CONFLATE, especially when they do not understand the facts. 

[Revelation Man]

On 10/12/2022 at 10:02 PM, DeighAnn said:

Again, do you just see what you want?  How do you come up with this stuff like it has anything to do with me?  That PRE TRIB got your eyes closed to everything.  You keep adding it in like I believe it to fit anywhere and I don't believe it at all.  

No, I see the facts, its EVIDENT you do not understand how Prophecy works, God CAN NOT LIE, He is not changing the 70th week to LESS TIME, He is not changing the Anti-Christs 1260 day rule to LESS TIME, you just can't grasp the fact that Jesus was speaking about A TRUE FACT, that when he shows up, he will INDEED shorten the "Natural Rule of the Anti-Christ" by KILLING HIM and casting him into HELLFIRE. Simple stuff tbh.

Seems to me, once you get an idea, you can't ever change that idea, even if that idea was wrong think. 

[Revelation Man]

On 10/12/2022 at 10:07 PM, DeighAnn said:

Revelation 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

Revelation 19:12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

Revelation 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.



DO YOU SEE THIS?  

Revelation 19:14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

Yes, that's my whole point ABOVE, you not understanding the TIMING of the Rapture makes you CONFLATE THESE THINGS, this is the Raptured Church in Heaven, BEFORE the 2nd Coming, we return with Jesus at the Second Coming, see verses 17-20, Armageddon happens AFTER we return from Heaven. 

On 10/12/2022 at 10:07 PM, DeighAnn said:

KEEP READING UNTIL YOU GET TO
 

Revelation 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Revelation 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

SO YOU MIGHT SEE THAT ERROR IN YOUR THINKING. 

The error is with you. I was called unto Prophecy 37 years ago, and actually understand it. You can't even get the timing of the Rapture right sister, and you cant be bothered to learn either. At the Rapture, in an INSTANT, all of your ideas on these thing will be proven wrong. 

Remember this, anytime we lead people in wrong directions, there will be some who never make it, because they heeded a wrong direction, it is imperative we do not do this !!

Edited October 14, 2022 by Revelation Man

[Revelation Man]

On 10/12/2022 at 10:09 PM, DeighAnn said:

1 Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Yes, we who are ALIVE, will be CHANGED (Die) and go to Heaven just like those raised from the dead WITHOUT CORRUPTION (Sin Flesh). All one has to do is read 1 Cor. 15, NO SIN FLESH can enter Heaven, thus the CORRUPTION is Sin Flesh, those raised from the dead have NO FLESH, thus they are raised as Spirit Men, doubt this? 

1 Cor. 15:44 It is sown a natural body(Sin Flesh); it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

 

1 Cor. 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption(Sin Flesh) inherit incorruption(Eternal Life in Heaven).

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, (We DIE, or leave our Sin Flesh body and go to be with the Lord in Heaven as SPIRIT MEN, there we will get our New Body signified as a White Robe in Revelation.)

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump(Which ALWAYS ended the Jewish Summer Harvest): for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

So, wee will be Raptured at the Last Trump (Feast of Trumps) and THEN Israel MUST REPENT (Atone) fulfilling the Feast of Atonement. Then Jesus DWELLS (Tabernacles) with Israel for 1000 years on this earth fulfilling the Feast of Tabernacles. 

We can't learn if we already know it all. Jesus told me that about 7 years ago as I prayed unto him one night asking why we the Church was so COINFUSED on the issues as per our 100s of interpretations, when there is really only ONE TRUTH. 

 

Edited October 14, 2022 by Revelation Man

[Revelation Man]

On 10/13/2022 at 9:33 AM, DeighAnn said:

When was it Satan and his angels were kicked out of heaven?

Has not happened yet, if you read the pasages on this the TIMELINE will become clear, how long does the Dragon chase The Woman? For 1260 days so we know he is kicked out at the VERY END. Another clue is seen in Rev. 12 Below, let me show you how to dig out these truths sister.

Rev. 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

So, WHEN is Satan CAST DOWN? Well it says he Persecutes Israel WHEN he is cast down, so how long does Israel get persecuted? For exactly 1260 days !!

Rev. 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

 

Rev. 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour (Short Time) with the beast.

Daniel chapter 12 agrees with Revelation 12 

Daniel 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people(Israel) shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

So John gave us both Daniel's reference AND the actual number of days so as not to confuse us.
 

Rev. 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

So, put it all together sister, Satan has NOT been cast down yet, that ONLY HAPPENS when there is 1260 days or so left or at the Midday Point of the 70th week when TIME IS SHORT !! All the references are there, DIG THEM OUT !!

Satan has yet to be kicked out, any answer but that is WRONG !!

On 10/13/2022 at 9:33 AM, DeighAnn said:

What 10 kingdoms did they rule over? 

The number 10 simply means COMPLETION. That is common knowledge to Prophecy wonks like me sister. Its not 10.

On 10/13/2022 at 9:33 AM, DeighAnn said:

What image was set up that the WHOLE WORLD had to worship to buy and sell? 

Firstly, this has not yet happened, secondly it will not be the Whole World, that's you not understanding it means the WHOLE EARTH (Land) being spoken about and the 7 Heads and 10 Horns has always been about the Kingdoms ruling over only the Mediterranean Sea Region. I will prove thus, but you still will not accept it. 

Dan. 2:36 This is the dream; and we will tell the interpretation thereof before the king. 37 Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for the God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory.

38 And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold. {{{ Wheresoever has to mean THE WHOLE EARTH right? Or does it simply mean the Whole Land Spoken of as in the Mediterranean Sea Region? The Latter of course. }}}

39 And after thee shall arise another kingdom(Persia) inferior to thee, and another third kingdom(Greece/Alex the Great) of brass, which shall bear rule over all the earth.

So, did Nebuchadnezzar and Alexander the Great rule over ALL THE WHOLE EARTH, or just over the whole landmass being spoken about, the Mediterranean Sea Region ? (7 Heads and 10 Horns) The Latter of course is the truth, likewise the Anti-Christ will only rule over this same 7 Headed 10 Horned Region also. God doesn't care if we grasp this or not as per unto His meanings. 

Might as well shed light on the Roman Beast and the Last Beast of the Anti-Christ also.

Dan. 2:40 And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron:(Rome) forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise.

41 And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided(Many nations make up a WHOLE, some strong and some weak, now go look at the E.U. this is a FACTOID); but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay.

42 And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken.

43 And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay.

So, the E.U. is a COLLECTIVE of different peoples (Seeds of Men) trying to form one nation, some are STRONG like Germany, England, Spain etc. and some are very weak like Estonia, Malta, Bulgaria, Luxembourg, Cypress etc. etc. And like Iron and Clay, these many nations will not cleave to one another as a Nation under ONE RULER would do, this is why in the very end they give all of their power over to this ONE MAN !! As Rev. 17:12-13 says.

12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

On 10/13/2022 at 9:33 AM, DeighAnn said:

Wasn't the ROMAN empire ruling the whole world?  OR who all way claiming CHRIST had returned?  When exactly did all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Future event but not meant as Literal, its prose, the whole world is just God telling us that when Jesus does return everyone in the whole world will understand he is the Lord. That's why those who have taken the Mark of the Beast will mourn. However the five million Jews who have already repented and have fled to the Petra/Bozrah area will not mourn, they will no doubt be very, very happy. 

On 10/13/2022 at 9:33 AM, DeighAnn said:

Seriously you THINK all THAT HAPPENED and what has been recorded in our History books since then IS THE RESULT OF CHRIST RULING WITH A ROD OF IRON?  I can't even put into words what that makes me think.

I am sorry, I can't engage with you in discussing the words of God.  I will make comments I'm sure, but not doing this.  

#1 I KNOW none of that has happened yet, nor have I ever stated it has happened, which just proves sister you have a reading comprehension problem. 

You are confusing your own self as unto what others are saying. If you conflate my words...........

God Bless

Edited October 14, 2022 by Revelation Man

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

Yes, that's my whole point ABOVE, you not understanding the TIMING of the Rapture makes you CONFLATE THESE THINGS, this is the Raptured Church in Heaven, BEFORE the 2nd Coming, we return with Jesus at the Second Coming, see verses 17-20, Armageddon happens AFTER we return from Heaven. 

I readily admit I WILL NEVER UNDERSTAND THE TIMING OF THE RAPTURE.  

I don't care HOW MANY TIMES YOU TELL ME I AM WRONG BECAUSE I DON'T BELIEVE IT.  

IF IT WERE TRUE, you COULD simply put it forth in GODS WORDS.  BUT you CAN'T because 

IT HAS NO BEGINNING AND IT HAS NO END AND IT HAS NO MIDDLE.  IT HAS NOTHING IN GODS WORDS

IT IS COMPLETLY FROM BEGINNING TO END WISDOM OF MAN

DO WHAT NONE HAS DONE BEFORE YOU AND GIVE ME THE FIRST VERSE THAT BEGINS THE THEORY.  

It can't be 1 THESS 4 because JESUS IS BRINGING THOSE WHO HAD RISEN WITH HIM.  HE IS COMING TO RULE AND REIGN.  

THE DEAD ARE RISING SO NO ONE IS GOING BACK TO HEAVEN

THOSE ARE THE FACTS.  

ALL YOU CAN DO IS TALK AROUND IT. 

GET GOD TO SAY A SINGLE WORD ON IT,   IF   YOU    CAN.  

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

Yes, that's my whole point ABOVE, you not understanding the TIMING of the Rapture makes you CONFLATE THESE THINGS, this is the Raptured Church in Heaven, BEFORE the 2nd Coming, we return with Jesus at the Second Coming, see verses 17-20, Armageddon happens AFTER we return from Heaven. 

The error is with you. I was called unto Prophecy 37 years ago, and actually understand it. You can't even can't the timing of the Rapture right sister, and you cant be bothered to learn either. At the Rapture, in an INSTANT, al of your ideas on these thing will be proved wrong. 

Remember this, anytime we lead people in wrong directions, there will be some who never make it, because they heeded a wrong direction, it is imperative we do not do this !!

BY CALLING ME SISTER AT THE SAME TIME YOU SAY THE THINGS YOU DO, MAKES YOU LOOK EVEN LESS BELIEVABLE. 

[DeighAnn]

3 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

On 10/13/2022 at 7:33 AM, DeighAnn said:

When was it Satan and his angels were kicked out of heaven?

Has not happened yet, if you read the pasages on this the TIMELINE will become clear, how long does the Dragon chase The Woman? Fir 1260 days so we know he is kicked out at the VERY END. Another clue is seen in Rev. 12 Below, let me show you how to dig out these truths sister.

Wow, way to put a spin on it and make it appear as if I believe something YOU KNOW very well that I don't.  That would be like me saying something like 'IF only you were capable of understanding'.  That is just sooo easy to do,  isn't it?  That's why it's hard to be good and easy to be evil, isn't it?  Those be rhetorical. 

And with that, I will bow out of these conversations with you.  

But thank you, I MUST BE DOING A GOOD JOB. 


 

[DeighAnn]

On 10/13/2022 at 5:04 PM, TrueFollowerOfChrist said:

I don't believe that us ruling is limited to the existence of unbelievers. Just as there is a hierarchy of angels, I believe there will be some believers in Heaven or the eternal state that will have authority over others. There is nothing sinful about people having authority over others, so why wouldn't this occur in the next life too?

I can't quit thinking about this,  and it has been on my mind ever since I read and answered it the first time but I have gone back and forth so many times on the yes there would be to the  no there wont,  and I think  I like your thoughts on this.  Certainly opened up new areas to explore.  

One side is when Christ returns for the Lords Day,  GOD isn't going to be dwelling until the New Heaven and earth or at least not  UNTIL 26The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. 27For He hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. 28And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all. 

So UNTIL that point, there will remain the Kingdom of GOD with Him on His throne,  while the Kingdom of Heaven is here on earth with Christ sitting on the thone of David.  

Then I thought well then Israel the 'bloodline' would remain in heaven and then I thought no, cause of the Millennial temple and the Levites doing priestly duties and the encampments around it.  Then I thought I dont recall the elders or the living creatures being here during that time.

Then I thought about the angels that left their habitation and I thought maybe there is a group who stay in heaven while the rest come back to earth with Christ. I know many do but maybe not all.   

But in the end, I still am going to have to wait but till then I am thinking yes, there will be the two kingdoms for that Day.  I am really hoping this will help me to let it go for a while.  But right now it is a song stuck in my head...

What are your thoughts and do you have any Scripture yet on a yes or no? 

Anyway, thank you again.