Can We Talk About The Trinity?

[steve morrow]

 HEARING  THE  LORD  JESUS  CHRIST  AND  TRUSTING  IN  HIM 

 

PROVERBS 24:1  be not thou envious against evil men neither desire to be with them 

--24:2--  for their heart studieth destruction and their lips talk of mischief 

 

2 PETER 2:17  these are wells without water clouds that are carried with a tempest to whom the mist of darkness is reserved forever 

--2:18--  for when they speak great swelling words of  --vanity--  they allure through the lusts of the flesh through much wantonness those that were clean escaped from them who lived in error 

--2:19--  while they promise them liberty they themselves --are the servants of corruption-- for of whom a man is overcome of the same is he brought in bondage 

--2:20--  for if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through  --THE  KNOWLEDGE  OF  THE  LORD  AND  SAVIOUR JESUS  CHRIST--  they are again entangled therein and overcome --the latter end is worse with them than the beginning--

 

JAMES 3:16 for where envying and strife is  --there is confusion and every evil work--

 

1 TIMOTHY 6:3  --if any man teach otherwise  --  and consent not to wholesome words   -- even the words of our    LORD  JESUS  CHRIST-- AND  TO  THE  DOCTRINE --  WHICH  IS  ACCORDING-- TO GODLINESS--

--6:4--  he is proud  --knowing nothing--  but doting about questions and strifes of words  ---  whereof cometh envy and strife  railings and evil surmisings--

 

PSALM 60:11  GIVE  US  HELP  FROM  TROUBLE  FOR  VAIN  IS  THE  HELP  OF  MAN

GALATIANS 1:10  FOR  DO  I  NOW  PERSUADE  MEN  OR  GOD  OR  DO  I  SEEK  TO  PLEASE  MEN  ---FOR  IF  I  YET  PLEASED  MEN   ---  I SHOULD  NOT  BE  THE  SERVANT  OF  CHRIST---

 

JOHN 8:43  why do you not understand my speech  --even because you cannot hear  MY  word--

2 TIMOTHY 2:7  consider what  --I say--  and  THE  LORD  give thee understanding in  --all things--

 

*******PROVERBS 21:16  THE  MAN  THAT  WANDERETH  OUT  OF  THE  WAY  OF  UNDERSTANDING  SHALL  REMAIN  IN  THE  CONGREGATION  OF  THE  DEAD*******

 

JOHN 14:13  AND  WHATSOEVER  YOU  SHALL  ASK  IN  MY  NAME  THAT  WILL  I  DO  THAT  THE  FATHER  MAY  BE  GLORIFIED  IN  THE  SON

 

LOVING  THE  LORD  JESUS  CHRIST  

 

[Starise]

25 minutes ago, Neighbor said:

It is also foreign (to me anyway) the whole idea of a kingship, a royal line, heritage, etc. So the wording of the Bible as it relates to mankind under  God leaves me with not one unfamiliar characteristic, but two.  

The idea of the wedding feast and of Kings and their powers requires a lot of me. That my Lord is off preparing a wedding cottage ( A honeymoon cottage )  for His bride takes a little, no a lot of work, for me to pick up on. But that is the never ending pleasure to be found in reading praying upon , thinking and reading yet again and again from the Bible. 

Then to find the Holy Spirit bringing forward that word at just the perfect timing for my own enlightenment always astounds me.

I know this isn't intentional, but I think a few who have a background in something like the Messianic traditions add a certain lingo that distances a few of us who are "Gentile".

In order for me to get some of it, I sometimes need to translate what they are saying. There absolutely IS a carry over of these ideas that bridges the gap between what we have chosen to divide and call testaments. Jesus was big on using a lot of that terminology in parable form.

I can 'get' most of it, but there are times when some will read more into something or give it a meaning maybe not intended, or maybe have a tendency to over complicate. This is when I need further study to see if the claims are really sticking or if it is an idea I can't embrace.

There is a long study over in the clubs area about the parable of the wedding. I bowed out for awhile over there. Admittedly a lot of my study takes me to a different place than a few others. 

The Holy Spirit, who seems to be the least understood and mentioned of the trinity, is who leads us as you say. And sometimes it is better to know and not share for me. I don't believe everything is open to everyone right away, including me.

The Holy Spirit part of the Godhead is nowhere near as overt in terms of the personal presence as the other two. Yes I see plenty of what He does, but He isn't on a podium introducing Himself.

[Marathoner]

2 minutes ago, Starise said:

I know this isn't intentional, but I think a few who have a background in something like the Messianic traditions add a certain lingo that distances a few of us who are "Gentile".

In order for me to get some of it, I sometimes need to translate what they are saying. There absolutely IS a carry over of these ideas that bridges the gap between what we have chosen to divide and call testaments. Jesus was big on using a lot of that terminology in parable form.

I can 'get' most of it, but there are times when some will read more into something or give it a meaning maybe not intended, or maybe have a tendency to over complicate. This is when I need further study to see if the claims are really sticking or if it is an idea I can't embrace.

There is a long study over in the clubs area about the parable of the wedding. I bowed out for awhile over there. Admittedly a lot of my study takes me to a different place than a few others. 

The Holy Spirit, who seems to be the least understood and mentioned of the trinity, is who leads us as you say. And sometimes it is better to know and not share for me. I don't believe everything is open to everyone right away, including me.

The Holy Spirit part of the Godhead is nowhere near as overt in terms of the personal presence as the other two. Yes I see plenty of what He does, but He isn't on a podium introducing Himself.

The Spirit of the Lord dwells with us, @Starise. We are the temple of the Holy Spirit after all (1 Corinthians 6:19).  

It is He whom the Son of God sent into the world when He ascended to sit with the Father upon His throne (explained in John 16). 

The Spirit of the Lord is referred to a number of times in Scripture; remember Acts 15 when the Holy Spirit declared His judgment regarding the matter recorded in that chapter. When we hear the Lord, we hear His Spirit. It's not mysterious at all. 

[Neighbor]

38 minutes ago, Starise said:

This is why I believe it is often easier for a person not trained in any persuasion to come to God.

Ha, funny thing is I was exposed to  most if not all "persuasions" and successfully rejected them all.

I dealt with them all  that exist at  Southern California anyway; doing so as a funeral director and cemeterian that absolutely had to know and work with them all, as I was  involved in several thousands of deaths, funerals, and final disposition of human remains annually for a  for a couple of decades.

God had to up and take me away from what I had thought was my business domain, my  career, and drop me clean across country in a field of endeavor I had absolutely no knowledge of- where he led me to the word of God the Bible, with soon understanding by the agency of the Holy Spirit, using a Gideon Bible to be exact and had me first read Job.

 It got complicated from there,  but God was always always in charge, the God I denied even existed was in charge and still is.

I think for God it is  never "easy" for the price that had to be paid to cover us is an awesome burden. But the victory  has been God's from the get go, near as I can figure. It is the always timely from a human  perspective  in acting out of His mercy from everlasting to everlasting.

[Starise]

10 minutes ago, Marathoner said:

The Spirit of the Lord dwells with us, @Starise. We are the temple of the Holy Spirit after all (1 Corinthians 6:19).  

It is He whom the Son of God sent into the world when He ascended to sit with the Father upon His throne (explained in John 16). 

The Spirit of the Lord is referred to a number of times in Scripture; remember Acts 15 when the Holy Spirit declared His judgment regarding the matter recorded in that chapter. When we hear the Lord, we hear His Spirit. It's not mysterious at all. 

Thanks @Marathoner, Yes the "Comforter" as He is called. A study on the HS is a deep one for me and certainly mysterious in some aspects, at least to me. 

Take that He is in us at salvation, yet we sometimes fail to be totally aware of this. How can God Himself reside in someone and they not be aware of it? While I have always been aware of Him, I don't always remember He is there. Does that make sense?

11 minutes ago, Neighbor said:

Ha, funny thing is I was exposed to  most if not all "persuasions" and successfully rejected them all.

I dealt with them all  that exist at  Southern California anyway; doing so as a funeral director and cemeterian that absolutely had to know and work with them all, as I was  involved in several thousands of deaths, funerals, and final disposition of human remains annually for a  for a couple of decades.

God had to up and take me away from what I had thought was my business domain, my  career, and drop me clean across country in a field of endeavor I had absolutely no knowledge of- where he led me to the word of God the Bible, with soon understanding by the agency of the Holy Spirit, using a Gideon Bible to be exact and had me first read Job.

 It got complicated from there,  but God was always always in charge, the God I denied even existed was in charge and still is.

I think for God it is  never "easy" for the price that had to be paid to cover us is an awesome burden. But the victory  has been God's from the get go, near as I can figure. It is the always timely from a human  perspective  in acting out of His mercy from everlasting to everlasting.

Interesting testimony there @Neighbor. I know a funeral family, the Wildes. They go back at least three generations in the funeral business. In fact I need to get oin there and pre pay for my eventual eventuality, but it isn't the kind of expense I like to think much about. You might be familiar with Caleb's book. He got out of the business recently. It looks like a VERY depressing business to me.

This is, I believe, a sure way to see the Spirit leading in our lives. Taking us to places and having us do things we would never have dreamed of.

I wonder what that says about me as a normal 7 to 3 person every day 

 

[Marathoner]

God the Father, whom no man has seen at any time, was revealed to us by His only begotten Son when He came in this flesh. As the Lord Himself said:

He does whatever He sees the Father doing, and speaks what He hears our Father saying. He explains the Father to us.

Further, the Spirit of the Lord testifies of the Father and the Son, for He was sent into this world as our Comforter, leading us into truth; He also reasons with and convicts all men and women of their ungodly deeds. 

I was ignorant of these matters when the Spirit of the Lord drew near and called my name, declaring that I belong to God alone. He said that the time had come for me to seek the Son of God, and that He would lead me to Him. He was faithful to do so.

With regard to the OP, I speak to the Lord. There are times when I say to our Father, "Father, You are so kind and merciful not only to me, but to all men and women on this earth. You are patient, bearing with our stubbornness and blindness, remembering that our frame is dust. You cause Your rain to fall upon the righteous and wicked alike!"

That is a declaration from my heart, not a formal prayer. I don't engage in ritual nor formulaic conduct of any kind as some do, speaking only to the Lord who surely hears my voice. His Spirit is the One who said, Stand upon your feet as the man I fashioned you to be. Your place is not upon your face in the dust. 

I'm not sure why this is an issue for some.

[Neighbor]

52 minutes ago, Starise said:

It looks like a VERY depressing business to me.

 Depressing? No,  least it wasn't. It was a really fine service to others to provide.  Though there are still a few very fine individuals in that field, it is a very different global corporate industry now  than what I was involved in way back when.  The global corporate conglomeration that has changed it all started right where I was. Oh the stories I know of it all.

Have thought to write on it one day, but can't get the  perhaps too offensive to some  title out of my head, "Putting The Fun In Funeral".

Why when I started we even had a complete funeral for $120 US dollars and a burial another $120. Long before the FTC came along and destroyed the ability to do such a thing as have a very affordable complete funeral service package. Anyway I digress-

The subject here is Trinity, isn't it!  When I read of man's rules for doing things rightly my mind goes to  a time early in the church where a response to the question about receiving the Holy Spirit, asked of new Christians, was Received? We haven't even heard of Holy Spirit! [Paraphrased from the opening of the Book of Acts in what we now call chapter 19]. These very people were called disciples.

From which I take away that  God reveals what He will reveal to whom he will reveal it when He so deems it proper and good.

God is not a trickster. 

 

[ayin jade]

56 minutes ago, Starise said:

Thanks @Marathoner, Yes the "Comforter" as He is called. A study on the HS is a deep one for me and certainly mysterious in some aspects, at least to me. 

Take that He is in us at salvation, yet we sometimes fail to be totally aware of this. How can God Himself reside in someone and they not be aware of it? While I have always been aware of Him, I don't always remember He is there. Does that make sense? @Neighbor. 

 

The voice of the Holy Spirit is a quiet still voice. Oftentimes we don't listen. I think that is why Christians are not always aware of Him.

[1to3]

On 1/6/2023 at 11:24 AM, Starise said:

When you worship God what part of Him do you focus on? 

My understanding is we can only worship the Father through the Son, or the Father only sees us through the Son.

Thoughts?

I pray to Father God and i begin to talk with Him about my concerns and finish  by mentioning through your plan of Mercy and Grace through  Your only begotten Son  or in the Holy Blood Name of Christ Jesus I pray ..... Thank You Father God, thank you Christ Jesus. Depending what I am speaking/praying  to God about, I mention of my prayer request also please Holy Spirit guide me, help me to overcome or help show me the way....please let this person know of Your divine plan of Mercy & Grace ....please bring healing to ....in the Holy Blood Name of Christ Jesus I pray, Please Father God bring a Blood hedge of protection  over my place over me, over my animals in the Blood Name of Christ Jesus I pray. Or Father God. please forgive my sins,please fill me complete with your Holy Spirit, let you Holy Blood flow through me and cleanse me and heal me... thank You Lord, thank You Father God for loving me and showing me Your way. Amen! Please Father God help me today to be a shining light to whomever I come into contact with,,, if they don't know you, help them to find you God and Your plan of Mercy & Grace in the holy Blood Name of Christ Jesus I pray .Amen!

Edited January 9, 2023 by 1to3
spelling

[other one]

1 hour ago, ayin jade said:

The voice of the Holy Spirit is a quiet still voice. Oftentimes we don't listen. I think that is why Christians are not always aware of Him.

i have had several experiences where it wasn't quite.  Was in emergencies.  Several times a very firm, "Don't do that".

In the mid 1980s I spent about ten months on a special project for my company in Rochester NY.    One morning about two am I was awaken from sleep speaking in tongues.  Growing up in the Church of Christ and studying on my own for several years I really never considered tongues as something real today.

Anyway that lasted about 5 minutes then I was literally thrown out of bed flat faced on the carpet nose buried into it praying in English for it had occurred to me that my family was in great danger.  That lasted about twenty minutes and i got a total relaxed feeling that all was OK.   And to call my wife and tell her it was OK.  Which  I did.

Turned out at the time I was awakened someone was behind out house making a lot of noise and my wife was getting up and putting on some clothes to go outside and see what the ruckus was all about.  That lasted the five minutes that I was speaking in tongues and the other 20 minutes was after she realized how dumb it was for her to go outside., the noise continued for that time.   It was a few minutes after the noise stopped that I called home.

I might add that for 7 or 8 years I would occasionally wake up praying for people who were in some kind of trouble.   When that happens it causes an adrenaline dump and you can't get back to sleep.  After my job changed and I was on call 24/7 sleep got to be important and the intercessory prayer requests faded out.

So, sometimes the spirit isn't a quite voice, when disasters are approaching.

Another time I was installing  a printer and before I plugged it in the spirit said very firmly, "No, don't do that."    Turned out the electrician had done something in the breaker box that would occasionally put several hundred volts on the frame of the Printer when their air conditioner compressor would start.