The End of this Age

[farouk]

15 minutes ago, FJK said:

I think that sometimes we have to develop in our understanding, like children becoming adults.

We have to understand a thing as children understand it and as we develop we understand that thing as adults do, then we end up understanding as old people with a lifetime of experience understand it.

None of those understandings are or were wrong, they just represent differing levels of development.

@FJK Peter says in 2 Peter 3.18: 'Grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ".

We should never cease to grow and learn.

[FreeGrace]

2 hours ago, kenny2212 said:

Are you now saying one is one's body? 

I clearly pointed out that in the OT the use of "soul" referred to the PERSON, not just the immaterial part of a person.

iow, to say "the SOUL shall die" meant the PERSON shall die.  Obviously a reference to physical death.

[FreeGrace]

2 hours ago, kenny2212 said:

Of what use is Jesus' sharing of this information if God is never going to do the information?

Uh, what information are you referring to?  Please include context so I can understand your question and answer.  Thanks.

2 hours ago, kenny2212 said:

John 12:49 (NKJV) - For I have not spoken on My own authority; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.

Are you saying God may waste words?

Why would you think such a thought?  God doesn't waste anything.  Silly idea.

[FreeGrace]

43 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

FreeGrace said: 

Rev 20 says plainly the trib martyrs will rise from the dead.  Pretty clear to me.  And notes there will be 1,000 years between the resurrection of the saved and the unsaved.

This doesn't say when they will rise from the dead. 

The context gives you that information.  At the end of Rev 19, all the saints already in heaven prepare to accompany King Jesus back to earth, which is the Second Advent.  In Rev 20 we have trib martyrs resurrected, which is exactly what 1 Thess 4:13-17 describes, along with 2 Thess 2:1.

Then, v.5-6 clearly shows 1,000 years between the 2 resurrections.

43 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

  You are presuming something which is not there.  Those of 1 Thes 4:17 - Those alive in Christ, those who meet Christ in the air are not resurrected. 

Yes they are.  Paul explained that those who remain are "changed" in 1 Cor 15:52.  Which is also indicated in 1 Thess 4.

43 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Those who come out from the 70th week alive also are not resurrected.  So the claim that all the saved are resurrected before the 1000 years is not founded in Scripture.

Of course it is.  Follow the dots.  There is just ONE resurrection of the saved.  Dan 12:2, John 5:29 and Acts 24:15.  All these verses also indicate ONE resurrection for the unsaved as well.

1 Cor 15:23 is very clear.  "those who belong to him" includes ALL the saved, obviously.  Or prove it cannot mean that.  And the verse tells us WHEN that singular resurrection will occur, which is "when He comes" a clear reference to the Second Advent.

Don't forget Col 3:20-21 which cleary connects the resurrection of believers with the Second Advent as well.

43 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

  This is where the harvest principle comes in to play.  Not all the resurrection of the Just happens at the same time.  Those mortals who are righteous at the end of the 1000 years are not resurrected, yet they are translated into a new spiritual body.  The same as those of 1 Thes 4:17.  Just at a different time.

In Christ

Montana Marv

I don't buy any "harvest" principle, since "harvest" isn't linked to any resurrection in the Bible.  1 Cor 15:23 isn't about any harvest, but the FACT that Jesus is the FIRST human to receive a glorified immortal body.  Also confirmed in Acts 26:23.

[kenny2212]

47 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

I clearly pointed out that in the OT the use of "soul" referred to the PERSON, not just the immaterial part of a person.

iow, to say "the SOUL shall die" meant the PERSON shall die.  Obviously a reference to physical death.

The body is just the "tent" one lives in.

2 Corinthians 5:1 (NKJV) - For we know that if our earthly house, this tent, is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

Is the person the body? Bro, you are confused!

Edited March 16, 2023 by kenny2212

[kenny2212]

23 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Uh, what information are you referring to?  Please include context so I can understand your question and answer.  Thanks.

This - Matthew 10:28 (NKJV) -  And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. BUT RATHER FEAR HIM WHO IS ABLE TO DESTROY BOTH SOUL AND BODY IN HELL.

You said Jesus said this (which is right) but you said there's no proof in the bible that God will do it. Of which I asked "Are you saying God may waste words?"

[DeighAnn]

Not marvel at this, for is coming an hour in which all those in the tombs will hear the voice of Him

and will come forth those good having done to resurrection of life and those evil having done to resurrection of judgment  John5

And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be A resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust. Acts 24
 

A SINGLE RESURRECTION of the dead that INCLUDES BOTH?

and/OR do not be deceived by persistence 

MULTIPLE RESURRECTIONS separated by time and 'TYPES'?


Acts 23:6 Having known then Paul that the one part consists of Sadducees but the other of Pharisees he began crying out in the council, Men, brothers, I a Pharisee am, son of a Pharisee; concerning hope and resurrection of [the] dead I am judged

[DeighAnn]

45 minutes ago, kenny2212 said:

This - Matthew 10:28 (NKJV) -  And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. BUT RATHER FEAR HIM WHO IS ABLE TO DESTROY BOTH SOUL AND BODY IN HELL.

You said Jesus said this (which is right) but you said there's no proof in the bible that God will do it. Of which I asked "Are you saying God may waste words?"

14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

11And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

12He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

13These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

No life, No torment



16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

 622. apollumi ►
Strong's Concordance
apollumi: to destroy, destroy utterly
Original Word: ἀπόλλυμι
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: apollumi
Phonetic Spelling: (ap-ol'-loo-mee)
Definition: to destroy, destroy utterly
Usage: (a) I kill, destroy, (b) I lose, mid: I am perishing (the resultant death being viewed as certain).
HELPS Word-studies
622 apóllymi (from 575 /apó, "away from," which intensifies ollymi, "to destroy") – properly, fully destroy, cutting off entirely (note the force of the prefix, 575 /apó).

622 /apóllymi ("violently/completely perish") implies permanent (absolute) destruction, i.e. to cancel out (remove); "to die, with the implication of ruin and destruction" (L & N, 1, 23.106); cause to be lost (utterly perish) by experiencing a miserable end.

 

[kenny2212]

26 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

11And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

12He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

13These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

No life, No torment



16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

 622. apollumi ►
Strong's Concordance
apollumi: to destroy, destroy utterly
Original Word: ἀπόλλυμι
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: apollumi
Phonetic Spelling: (ap-ol'-loo-mee)
Definition: to destroy, destroy utterly
Usage: (a) I kill, destroy, (b) I lose, mid: I am perishing (the resultant death being viewed as certain).
HELPS Word-studies
622 apóllymi (from 575 /apó, "away from," which intensifies ollymi, "to destroy") – properly, fully destroy, cutting off entirely (note the force of the prefix, 575 /apó).

622 /apóllymi ("violently/completely perish") implies permanent (absolute) destruction, i.e. to cancel out (remove); "to die, with the implication of ruin and destruction" (L & N, 1, 23.106); cause to be lost (utterly perish) by experiencing a miserable end.

 

Thank you DeighAnn. God bless you.

Edited March 16, 2023 by kenny2212

[FreeGrace]

1 hour ago, kenny2212 said:

The body is just the "tent" one lives in.

Yes, that's what I believe and indicated.

1 hour ago, kenny2212 said:

2 Corinthians 5:1 (NKJV) - For we know that if our earthly house, this tent, is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

Is the person the body? Bro, you are confused!

No, the person is the soul LIVING in a body, or tent, or house.  Take your pick.

Please  point out where I'm confused.  I don't want to be confused.  Thanks.