Why even care if another is Calvinistic, Arminian or Whatever?

[com7fy8]

If someone is holding to a wrong idea, this can be because of a wrong spirit. So, yes it can make a big difference what we think and say. So, I try to check how someone is becoming emotionally while he or she is holding to an idea. How much is a belief helping the person to become like Jesus? Or, might the person's idea keep his or her attention away to arguing and even isolate the person from sharing well with Christian brothers and sisters?

Pride can mess up a person, no matter what the person believes . . . even if he or she does have a correct belief.

A person holding to free will can be very dictatorial . . . demanding that you make some choice since you have "free will" to choose that. And a predestination person also might be dictatorial, and demand you choose some thing because that is what all "truly predestined" people will choose!

So, either way can be done the wrong way.

Plus, humans can limit a belief like free will or predestination to only what certain limited and imperfect people have said already; but God can bring us to more and better than what either human "side" of an issue have been insisting and fighting for.

But if God knows something is true, it is good to share with Him > God is able to communicate with us.

A number of issues have a way of keeping our attention away from how God's correction changes our character to become like Jesus so we love like Jesus and become pleasing to our Father, like Jesus. Hebrews 12:4-14.

But as we grow in Jesus, our maturing character has us able to get better understanding. But there are people still holding to things they were told while they were unsaved or immature. Ones who told them those things could be idols whom they hold above question; they can be in denial that their idols could be wrong.

So, then, it is good to become able to make sure with God, about things 

 

Edited May 21, 2023 by com7fy8

[Dennis1209]

I agree; love and the core essentials unite us unto Salvation. Systematic theology is more or less a denominational doctrine by scholars.

Scholar ~ SC̵HOL´AR, n. [Low L. scholaris, from schola, a school; Gr. σχολη, leisure, a school; Fr. ecolier; D. schoolier; G. schüler; Dan. skolelœrd. The Danish word signifies school-learned. See School.]

1. One who learns of a teacher; one who is under the tuition of a preceptor; a pupil; a disciple; hence, any member of a college, academy or school; applicable to the learner of any art, science or branch of literature.

2. A man of letters.^[1]

Those learned and with letters after their name disagree with secondary or non-Salvation issues.

Saul was well educated, a doctor-in-law, taught by the Pharisee Gamaliel himself. Paul was the late apostle, and I believe Paul was taught the Gospel for three years by the Lord Jesus Himself.

1 Peter 1:25 But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.

I believe God’s word, the Bible, is so in-depth. I think the Master Teacher Himself will personally teach us the truths of His word for eternity. Hidden and masked truths are still being discovered by Bible students even today. Example: The late Dr. Charles Missler found the first ten generations, Adam – Noah.

 

---

^[1] Webster, Noah. Noah Webster’s first edition of An American dictionary of the English language. 2006: n. pag. Print.

[Vine Abider]

14 hours ago, Arial said:

There are a number of doctrines that are essential in Christianity and some unique to it. The Trinity, person and work of Christ in His sinless, substitutionary atonement, imputation of righteousness, virgin birth---off the top of my head. Heck---read the Epistles, it's all in there including the imperatives of  Christian morals and behavior.  It is too much for me to parse at the moment, it is getting late.

We've had a little discussion on here before (I think I started a thread on this a few months ago), that is, what are the basic essentials of the faith. It comes down mainly to the person and work of Christ:

> He is God come in the flesh as a Man

> He lived, died and resurrected

> He is the one who made perfect atonement for man's sins on the cross

> Salvation is by faith in Him alone and what He's done

> Christ lives in His believers 

There may be one or two other "essentials," but much beyond that, at least in my mind, is where folks may say, "Yes, that's good, but I really think such & such has to be added."

[Vine Abider]

4 hours ago, com7fy8 said:

And > 

"that you all speak the same thing" (in 1 Corinthians 1:10).

Yes - and if we take that to mean regarding all the various doctrines, then we're in trouble! 

[Arial]

2 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

We've had a little discussion on here before (I think I started a thread on this a few months ago), that is, what are the basic essentials of the faith. It comes down mainly to the person and work of Christ:

> He is God come in the flesh as a Man

> He lived, died and resurrected

> He is the one who made perfect atonement for man's sins on the cross

> Salvation is by faith in Him alone and what He's done

> Christ lives in His believers 

There may be one or two other "essentials," but much beyond that, at least in my mind, is where folks may say, "Yes, that's good, but I really think such & such has to be added."

Yes. All the salvational issues are absolutes. There is also faith lone, scripture alone, for the glory of God alone. Which covers how we are saved and by whom, what is our only authority in the matter (which was dealing with the Roman church claiming itself the authority of whatever it said.) And the reason for our salvation and the purpose for our entire lives, which is always the case in God's economy and should be in ours as to how we live them.

[steve morrow]

AS  A  MATTER  OF  FACT  NOTHING  ON  THEOLOGY  OR  THEOLOGICAL

NOR  ANYTHING  ON  JOSEPH  SMITH ; CHARLES  SPURGEON ; TAZE RUSSEL ; JOHN CALVIN ; JOHN WESLEY ; JOHN KNOX ; CHERYL  WHITE ; etc  etc

 

1 CORINTHIANS 1:13  IS  CHRIST  DIVIDED  ---  was paul crucified for you or were you baptized in the name of paul 

1 JOHN 1:9  --IF-- we confess our sins  HE  is faithful and just to forgive us our sins  -- and to cleanse us from all unrighteousnes

PROVERBS 8:8  all the words of  MY  mouth are in righteousness there is nothing froward or perverse in them

 

JOHN 14:6  JESUS  saith I am the way --the truth -- and the life no man cometh unto  THE  FATHER  but by  --ME--

 

PROVERBS 8:20  I lead in the way of righteousness in the midst of the paths of judgement

 

PSALM 119:172  MY  TONGUE  SHALL  SPEAK  OF   THY  WORD   FOR  ALL  THY  COMMANDMENTS  ARE  RIGHTEOUSNESS 

PSALM 119:138  THY  TESTIMONIES  THAT  THOU  HAST  COMMANDED  ARE  RIGHTEOUS  AND  VERY  FAITHFUL

PSALM 119:86  ALL  THY  COMMANDMENTS  ARE  FAITHFUL  THEY  PERSECUTE  ME  WRONGFULLY  HELP  THOU  ME 

 

1 CORINTHIANS 4:2  MOREOVER  IT  IS  REQUIRED  IN  STEWARDS --THAT  A  MAN  BE  FOUND  FAITHFUL--

 

ISAIAH  55:2  wherefore do you spend money for that which is not bread and --YOUR  LABOR--  for that which sastisfieth not  --hearken diligently unto  ME  and eat you that which is good--  and let your soul delight itself in fatness

 

JOHN 6:48  I  AM  THE  BREAD  OF  LIFE 

 

COLOSSIANS 3:25  but he that doeth wrong shall receive for the wrong which he hath done and there is no respect of persons 

 

ECCLESIASTES 8:11  because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily  ---  therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil

 

PHILIPPIANS 2:21  for all seek their own --not the things which are  JESUS  CHRISTS--

 

EPHESIANS 5:6  let no man deceive you with  VAIN  WORDS  for because of these things cometh the wrath of  GOD  upon ---THE  CHILDREN  OF  DISOBEDIENCE ---

 

JEREMIAH 13:10  this evil people which refuse to hear  MY  words --which walk in the imagination of their heart-- and walk after other gods to serve them and to worship them ---shall even be as this girdle  ---  WHICH  IS  GOOD  FOR  NOTHING---

 

JOHN 2:16  and said unto them that sold doves  --take these things hence make not  MY  FATHERS  house an house of merchandise --

 

ACTS 19:19 many of them also which used curious arts brought their books together and burned them before all men and they counted the price of them and found it fifty thousand pieces of silver 

--19:20--  so mightily grew --THE  WORD  OF  GOD  AND  PREVAILED--

 

LOVING  THE  LORD  JESUS  CHRIST 

 

[Debp]

On 5/20/2023 at 12:57 PM, Neighbor said:

I appreciate the position taken at one local church I attend when in town that espouses "major on the major's and let the minor's be. Love God - love one another." 

Amen.

[Wayne222]

We can disagree on many things and still be in the faith. But all doctrines are not healthy to just ingnore. Like there are Christians who say we must worship on Saturday which is the 7 day sabbath. I can accept there worshiping on Saturday and that’s fine. But if they promote it for all others then I cannot accept that. And there are many doctrine that can stubble other believers. Th Bible also says to agree with one another. How can we do this? When there is so much disagreement about doctrine ?

[Neighbor]

8 hours ago, Wayne222 said:

We can disagree on many things and still be in the faith. But all doctrines are not healthy to just ingnore. Like there are Christians who say we must worship on Saturday which is the 7 day sabbath. I can accept there worshiping on Saturday and that’s fine. But if they promote it for all others then I cannot accept that. And there are many doctrine that can stubble other believers. Th Bible also says to agree with one another. How can we do this? When there is so much disagreement about doctrine ?

Hi, Seems to have been an issue among followers and believers since, well since creation itself. Doesn't much matter what is being followed or believed there are differences that are grabbed onto and held close becoming doctrine, core truths,  not to be messed with; so what core truths are legitimate and what are bastards of faith programs and programmers?

Paul seems to do a excellent job, one God inspired so I guess it would have to be excellent, as he answers those very questions asked of him.

What to do about disagreement is often thought of as  what to do about those Judaizers, but is it not  also a guide for all disagreement for all called to be within the faith of Jesus?

The counsel  given through Matthew for church discipline also directly addresses issues that divide  individuals within the local church body which is a slightly different issue or aspect of the greater divides which come into play, and always have even before Christianity was known as Christianity.

A secular term "cognitive dissonance" likely covers much  of what happens. At near 80 years old now I have suffered greatly from cognitive dissonance on oh so many issues in life, even down to which bar of soap is best. I accept that information that confirms what I already "know" about the soap, and dismiss all that refutes what I "know" about the soap.

I think that very principle of mankind's mind's operation is the why of the Holy Spirit having to indwell those called by the Spirit to their own salvation from the destruction  that comes to all that do not get turned about  to seeing Jesus is Lord, God, and personal savior. 

 

p.s. As to bars of soap, Palmolive is the best, the only one to use; but if another is selected be sure it is not that green one Irish Spring. There is acceptable difference  within soaps, but Irish Spring is a  step too far, have nothing to do with one that uses Irish Spring. Oatmeal soap is a bit out there too, but is still soap that cleanses.

[enoob57]

On 5/20/2023 at 6:48 PM, Alive said:

but its application is subject to man’s point of view.

This is blatantly incorrect.... a proper hermeneutic will take you to a place of waiting upon growth in Scripture but not dependent upon the abilities of man... The objective nature of written format rules out following anything other than the leading of Scripture!