There are 2 separate tribulations, the first is to the Jew

[Anne2]

32 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

Jesus Christ spoke of a symbolic destruction of the Temple seen, and the Temple destroyed was his literal body as scripture clearly teaches below

"Destroy This Temple" as Jesus and the Pharisees viewed the temple that took 46 years to build

Interpretation: But he spake of the temple of his body

"Yes" Reformed Preterist Eschatology in 66-70AD fulfillment, would be found in the court of the Pharisees literal interpretation

Once Again, 66-70AD Jerusalems destruction had absolutely "Nothing" to do with fulfillment of Matthew Chapter 24, Mark Chapter 13, or Luke Chapter 21

John 2:18-22KJV

18 Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?

19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?

21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

22 When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.

 

That was what John was talking about

As for matthew and the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem

So, what do you do with Moses prophesies of Judgement?

Mt 3:7  But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
Lu 3:7  Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
 

Lu 16:29  Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
Lu 16:31  And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Ministry of the apostles to the Jew's

BEGINNING WITH THE BAPTISM OF JOHN
Act 1:21  Wherefore of these men which have companied with us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us,
22  Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.
 

Edited June 18, 2023 by Anne2

[Stewardofthemystery]

1 hour ago, truth7t7 said:

Jesus Christ spoke of a symbolic destruction of the Temple seen, and the Temple destroyed was his literal body as scripture clearly teaches below

"Destroy This Temple" as Jesus and the Pharisees viewed the temple that took 46 years to build

Interpretation: But he spake of the temple of his body

"Yes" Reformed Preterist Eschatology in 66-70AD fulfillment, would be found in the court of the Pharisees literal interpretation

Once Again, 66-70AD Jerusalems destruction had absolutely "Nothing" to do with fulfillment of Matthew Chapter 24, Mark Chapter 13, or Luke Chapter 21

John 2:18-22KJV

18 Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?

19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?

21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

22 When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.

You and many others are ignoring the obvious because it goes against “the doctrines of men” you have been taught to believe.

The obvious is, both Jesus and the apostles were talking about the destruction of the Temple and the surrounding buildings THEY WERE LOOKING AT WITH THEIR OWN EYES!

Many claim the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel and Jesus has not been set up yet, and another Temple needs to be rebuilt in the future in Jerusalem to fulfill this prophecy in the future. This doctrine is false.

Jesus’ words below confirm both He, and the apostles, were speaking of the Temple and buildings they were looking at "with their own eyes." 

The words of God confirm this truth.....

Mark 13:1-413 And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!
2 And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives over against the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,
4 Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when all these things shall be fulfilled?

So Jesus was telling them about the destruction of the Temple they were looking at "with their own eyes."

Notice in Mark's account above there is only one question asked about when shall these buildings be destroyed, and what sign would there be prior to this event, concerning the abomination of desolation.

But in Matthew's account pay attention to the question and the prophecy, as 2 separate questions are asked of Jesus. 

Matthew 24:1-3
24 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

So in Matthews account not only was Jesus asked about the destruction of the Temple they were looking at "with their own eyes", but also about the signs of Christ’s second coming and also about “the end of the world.”

Now to Luke's account…..

Luke 21:5-7 5 And as some spake of the temple, how it was adorned with goodly stones and gifts, he said,
6 As for these things which ye behold, the days will come, in the which there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
7 And they asked him, saying, Master, but when shall these things be? and what sign will there be when these things shall come to pass?

Again notice they are speaking of the Temple and buildings they are looking at "with their own eyes." And so Jesus tells them "the signs" given before the temple is destroyed….

Luke 21:20 “And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.” ( This is the abomination of desolation event spoken of in Daniel)

This event concerning the destruction of the city of Jerusalem that Jesus and the apostles were looking at "with their own eyes "is also confirmed by Jesus in ....

Luke 19:41-44 “And when he was come near, he beheld the city, and wept over it. Saying, If thou hast known, even thou, at least in this day, the things which belong unto thy peace! But now they are hid from thine eyes. For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side. And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.”

So the common mistake here is to think that the abomination of desolation concerning the destruction of the Temple is yet future, and has anything to do with the second coming of Christ and the end of the world almost 2 thousand years later.

But when you understand the questions asked of Jesus was in two parts, then you will see these 2 events are separate from one another and are many, many years apart. 

And it is also very clear in all accounts given in Matthew, Mark, and Luke that Jesus and the apostles were talking about the Temple and surrounding buildings they were looking at "with their own eyes". 

There is no need for a future Temple to be built to fulfill this prophecy, as it has already been fulfilled in 70 a.d. when the Roman army surrounded, and then destroyed Jerusalem and the Temple.

Both the words of Jesus and history prove this to be true. With the abomination of desolation events already being fulfilled, we can now focus on the events of Christ's second coming, and on the signs concerning the end of this world.

Prove all things by the words of God. Peace and God bless

[truth7t7]

1 hour ago, Anne2 said:

 

That was what John was talking about

As for matthew and the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem

So, what do you do with Moses prophesies of Judgement?

Mt 3:7  But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
Lu 3:7  Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
 

Lu 16:29  Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
Lu 16:31  And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Ministry of the apostles to the Jew's

BEGINNING WITH THE BAPTISM OF JOHN
Act 1:21  Wherefore of these men which have companied with us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us,
22  Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.
 

I don't believe anything within Matthew 24, Mark 13, or Luke 21, was fulfilled in 66-70AD Jerusalem as reformed preterist eschatology teaches

You will closely note the fulfilling of the gentiles seen in the chapters described above, is also seen in Revelation 11:2, as this chapter is future, and will see the second coming at the 7th angel in Revelation 11:15 (The End)

Point Of Interest: The book of Revelation was written in 96AD while John was in prison on Patmos Island, under the Reign of Emperor Domitian 81-96AD

Yes the verse seen written in Revelation 11:2 wasn't fulfilled at the time of the writing, some 26 years "after 70AD" in Jerusalems destruction by Roman Armues

(Fulfilling Of The Gentiles (Future) Unfulfilled)

Luke 21:24KJV

24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Revelation 11:2KJV

2 but the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

Revelation 11:15KJV

15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

Edited June 18, 2023 by truth7t7

[truth7t7]

11 minutes ago, Stewardofthemystery said:

You and many others are ignoring the obvious because it goes against “the doctrines of men” you have been taught to believe.

The obvious is, both Jesus and the apostles were talking about the destruction of the Temple and the surrounding buildings THEY WERE LOOKING AT WITH THEIR OWN EYES!

It's my opinion that (reformed preterist eschatology) in 66-70AD fulfillment is the doctrine of men

Just as Jesus stood looking at a physical temple with the pharisees and stated "Destroy This Temple" as they looked at the literal temple in Jerusalem, that took 46 years to build, and the interpretation was it represented (The Lord's Body) to be destroyed, not a literal temple, it's that simple

Edited June 18, 2023 by truth7t7

[Stewardofthemystery]

2 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

It's my opinion that (reformed preterist eschatology) in 66-70AD fulfillment is the doctrine of men

Just as Jesus stood looking at a physical temple with the pharisees and stated "Destroy This Temple" as they looked at the literal temple in Jerusalem, that took 46 years to build, and the interpretation is it was (The Lord's Body) to be destroyed, it's that simple

The death of Jesus is not “the abomination of desolation” and the destruction of Jerusalem spoken of by Daniel, and by Jesus to the apostles.

[truth7t7]

1 minute ago, Stewardofthemystery said:

The death of Jesus is not “the abomination of desolation” and the destruction of Jerusalem spoken of by Daniel, and by Jesus to the apostles.

I never stated such, that would be your claim and it's false

Edited June 18, 2023 by truth7t7

[Anne2]

16 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

I never stated such, that would be your claim and it's false

I am asking about the wrath that John preached. What is your view of that? Jesus was preaching the kingdom of God, while his disciples continued the baptism of John. That is what was going on the whole time. Jesus baptism was distinct from John's baptism.

John's baptism was repentance for the remission of Sin, to escape the wrath that was coming. The pharisees rejected the counsel of God in rejecting John's baptism.

Edited June 18, 2023 by Anne2

[Alive]

15 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

It's my opinion that (reformed preterist eschatology) in 66-70AD fulfillment is the doctrine of men

Just as Jesus stood looking at a physical temple with the pharisees and stated "Destroy This Temple" as they looked at the literal temple in Jerusalem, that took 46 years to build, and the interpretation was it represented (The Lord's Body) to be destroyed, not a literal temple, it's that simple

Regardless of what else is thought about what Jesus said on that long day starting at Matt. 21:18 (if memory serves), not one stone remained on another. Those Romans did a job on it and looters, as well. He was talking about the temple as his disciples and he were looking at the sun shining on the temple across the valley. When the veil was rent by God top to bottom that signified it was rendered obsolete. Its not unreasonable to consider that the end of an age of sorts.

I mention this to suggest we need not go too far, when using scripture to support an eschatology.

Your position can still be held generally, while seeing that some of what He said that day has come to pass.

[Anne2]

9 minutes ago, Alive said:

Regardless of what else is thought about what Jesus said on that long day starting at Matt. 21:18 (if memory serves), not one stone remained on another. Those Romans did a job on it and looters, as well. He was talking about the temple as his disciples and he were looking at the sun shining on the temple across the valley. When the veil was rent by God top to bottom that signified it was rendered obsolete. Its not unreasonable to consider that the end of an age of sorts.

I mention this to suggest we need not go too far, when using scripture to support an eschatology.

Your position can still be held generally, while seeing that some of what He said that day has come to pass.

I don't know what go too far means to you but, I also think what has happened, can also be similarly what can happen as well. As a shadow or form to the Church. The anti-christ is a spirit, and his tactics applicable. So, I think it could be the Anti-Christ can apply to a specific event in time, but his sprit operates in future times likewise.

Edited June 18, 2023 by Anne2

[truth7t7]

33 minutes ago, Alive said:

He was talking about the temple as his disciples and he were looking at the sun shining on the temple across the valley. When the veil was rent by God top to bottom that signified it was rendered obsolete. Its not unreasonable to consider that the end of an age of sorts.

Your position can still be held generally, while seeing that some of what He said that day has come to pass.

Yes when Jesus "Died" on the cross of Calvary the temple in Jerusalem was removed in the Spiritual, when the veil was rent in twain not one stone upon another was left, symbolically "Gone"

I disagree with your "Suggestion" fulfillment was seen in 66-70AD Jerusalem's literal destruction

Just as Jesus stood looking at a physical temple with the pharisees and stated "Destroy This Temple" as they looked at the literal temple in Jerusalem, that took 46 years to build, and the interpretation was it represented (The Lord's Body) to be destroyed, not a literal temple, it's that simple

Edited June 18, 2023 by truth7t7