Let's discuss Revelation 17

[Shilohsfoal]

3 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

The two witnesses of Revelation chapter 11 doesn't join the antichrist as you suggest, they represent the Lord God Of Heaven and Earth

That's what you claim.

But during their stay in Babylon,the occupants of Babylon will receive the mark of the king of Babylon

[truth7t7]

5 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

Well, those in Babylon will worship the king of Babylon.The nations around him just want to kill him and eventually will.

I Disagree

The future (man of sin) (the beast) will be worshipped by the entire unsaved world, and he will be destroyed by the Lord at the second coming

[Shilohsfoal]

15 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

I Disagree

The future (man of sin) (the beast) will be worshipped by the entire unsaved world, and he will be destroyed by the Lord at the second coming

No,according to scripture the man of sin worships himself.Scripture does not say anyone else worships him.

Your confusing the beast with the king of the north who gives the beast a host.

It's the son of perdition who gives the beast a host to practice the authority of the beast on its behalf.Thats when the two witnesses arive in Jerusalem.

But I will say this,the Babylonians are not the only ones who worship the beast from the sea.Evangelicals do as well.Thats why the king of the north supports the beast.

Edited June 20, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[truth7t7]

10 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

That's what you claim.

But during their stay in Babylon,the occupants of Babylon will receive the mark of the king of Babylon

 

The Two Witnesses Will Dominate The Entire Tribulation, Something Many Disregard As Non-Existent

Try Reading Exodus And The Plagues Upon Pharaoh And Egypt, It's Going To Be A Complete Replay

God's Divine Protection, "Open Your Ears"

(Revelation) 13:9-10KJV

9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.

10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

God's Divine Protection During The Final Hour Of Earth's Temptation, Just Like The Passover In Egypt, "Open Your Ears"

Isaiah 26:20-21KJV

20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.

21 For, behold, the Lord cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.

The Great Trib Will Be Upon The Antichrist And Wicked, The Church Is Protected, Dont Be Deceived

There's Going To Be An End Times Persecution, The Beast And His Kingdom Are The Target Of God's Empowered (Two Witnesses)

The Great Tribulation Will Come Upon The Wicked World, While The (Sealed Church) Is Protected

The (Sealed Church) will be present on earth and protected, when wicked men are tormented 5 months, desiring to die as death flees

All saved believers are (Sealed) by God, Eph 1:13, 4:30

Ephesians 1:13KJV

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Ephesians 4:30KJV

30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

It Was Commanded, Only Those Without God's Seal Will Be Tormented, The Sealed Church Is Protected

Revelation 9:3-6KJV

3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.

4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.

5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.

6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.

Plagues upon The Beast and his Kingdom, a remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

Revelation 11:3-6

3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.

6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

Revelation 16:1-11KJV

1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.

2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.

3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.

4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.

5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus.

6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.

7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments.

8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.

9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.

10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,

11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.

[truth7t7]

4 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

No,according to scripture the man of sin worships himself.Scripture does not say anyone else worships him.

Your confusing the beast with the king of the north who gives the beast a host.

It's the son of perdition who gives the beast a host to practice the authority of the beast on its behalf.Thats when the two witnesses arive in Jerusalem.

But I will say this,the Babylonians are not the only ones who worship the beast from the sea.Evangelicals do as well.Thats why the king of the north supports the beast.

Daniel's (Little Horn), Paul's (Man Of Sin), And John's (The Beast) Are All The Same Literal Human Man,, That Will Be Present On This Earth At The Second Coming Of Jesus Christ

The figure mentioned above will be a "Future" literal human man, and he will be present on earth in a living human body to witness the "Future" second coming and final judgment as scripture clearly teaches below

Daniel's (Little Horn) Present On Earth At The Second Coming

Daniel 7:8-11KJV

8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.

10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.

11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.

Paul's (Man Of Sin) Present On Earth At The Second Coming

2 Thessalonians 2:3-8KJV

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

John's (The Beast) Present On Earth At The Second Coming

Revelation 19:19-20KJV

19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

[Shilohsfoal]

2 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

Daniel's (Little Horn), Paul's (Man Of Sin), And John's (The Beast) Are All The Same Literal Human Man,, That Will Be Present On This Earth At The Second Coming Of Jesus Christ

The figure mentioned above will be a "Future" literal human man, and he will be present on earth in a living human body to witness the "Future" second coming and final judgment as scripture clearly teaches below

Daniel's (Little Horn) Present On Earth At The Second Coming

Daniel 7:8-11KJV

8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.

10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.

11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.

Paul's (Man Of Sin) Present On Earth At The Second Coming

2 Thessalonians 2:3-8KJV

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

John's (The Beast) Present On Earth At The Second Coming

Revelation 19:19-20KJV

19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

The man of sin is not the little horn.

There is nothing little about the man of sin.He is big and his country is big.

The little horn has a very little country.Very very little.

The man of sin gives the little horn a host.

 

Daniel 8

⁹ And out of one of them came forth a little horn,which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

¹⁰ And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.

¹¹ Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down.

¹² And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

 

The king of the north(United States)is far more powerful than the little horn(Israel)and will give the little horn(a host).

They are not the same thing.

[truth7t7]

11 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

The man of sin is not the little horn.

There is nothing little about the man of sin.He is big and his country is big.

The little horn has a very little country.Very very little.

The man of sin gives the little horn a host.

 

Daniel 8

⁹ And out of one of them came forth a little horn,which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

¹⁰ And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.

¹¹ Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down.

¹² And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

 

The king of the north(United States)is far more powerful than the little horn(Israel)and will give the little horn(a host).

They are not the same thing.

I Strongly Disagree

Daniel's (Little Horn), Paul's (Man Of Sin), And John's (The Beast) Will Be The Very Same Literal Human Man

Edited June 20, 2023 by truth7t7

[Shilohsfoal]

27 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

I Strongly Disagree

Daniel's (Little Horn), Paul's (Man Of Sin), And John's (The Beast) Will Be The Very Same Literal Human Man

That's like saying the two separate beasts in revelation 13 are the same beast.

The second beast is given to the first beast and will practice the authority of the first beast on its behalf.

They are still said to be two separate beasts and you need to understand the difference between the two.

The little horn is already in the pleasant land before the host is given to him by the king of the north.

 

Daniel 8

⁹ And out of one of them came forth a little horn,which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

¹⁰ And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.

¹¹ Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down.

¹² And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

 

The little horn is already there.The host arrives 42 months before the time of the end.

[truth7t7]

28 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

That's like saying the two separate beasts in revelation 13 are the same beast.

The second beast is given to the first beast and will practice the authority of the first beast on its behalf.

They are still said to be two separate beasts and you need to understand the difference between the two.

The little horn is already in the pleasant land before the host is given to him by the king of the north.

 

Daniel 8

⁹ And out of one of them came forth a little horn,which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

¹⁰ And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.

¹¹ Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down.

¹² And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

 

The little horn is already there.The host arrives 42 months before the time of the end.

At no time did I state the beast of the sea and of the earth are the same, that's your false claim

The beast of the sea is (The Beast) and the beast of the earth is (The False Prophet) both literal individual human men

Edited June 20, 2023 by truth7t7

[douggg]

43 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

That's like saying the two separate beasts in revelation 13 are the same beast.

The second beast is given to the first beast and will practice the authority of the first beast on its behalf.

No, I don't think that's what truth7t7 is saying.

There are two beast persons in Revelation 13.

The beast king (the mortally wounded but healed head) and the false prophet (the beast out of the earth).

Both will be cast alive into the lake of fire in Revelation 19:20.

------------------------------------

truth7t7 wrote.....Daniel's (Little Horn), Paul's (Man Of Sin), And John's (The Beast) Will Be The Very Same Literal Human Man

I would package that slightly different, but agree in principle, it is the same person.

the little horn > becomes the prince who shall come > becomes the Antichrist (phony King of Israel) > becomes the revealed man of sin > becomes the beast king

--------------------------------

The beast coming out of the sea, as a whole, is the kingdom of the beast king and the ten horn kings.

The beast king and the ten horn kings make up the political leader structure of that kingdom.

The false prophet is a religious figure.

 

Edited June 20, 2023 by douggg