The end time has different physics?

[Shilohsfoal]

34 minutes ago, TrueFollowerOfChrist said:

Where do you get that belief from? I've studied ever verse of Revelation and I don't see any support for a viewpoint like that. There is no "cloud" of abomination of desolation or updraft. Can you please tell me where you got such a view?

Revelation.

The abomination of desolation which is placed in Jerusalem by the armed forces of the north is described by John as

 

¹² And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

¹³ And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

¹⁴ And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

¹⁵ And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

¹⁶ And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb

 

 

 

You can see the heaven departing as a scroll being rolled together in the video.

It's what the people in Jerusalem flee from on the day of the Lord.

It is the cloud that ascends into heaven from Jerusalem that the two witnesses are taken up in.

revelation 11

¹² And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.

 

It is also accompanied by the earthquake seen in revelation 6:12 and revelation 11:13.

 

The earthquakes and the signs in the heavens are a result of nation to rising against nation and kingdom.ahainst kingdom.

 

Luke 21

 

¹⁰ Then said he unto them, Nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom:

¹¹ And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.

 

It's all describing modern warfare and the abomination that causes desolation .

[TrueFollowerOfChrist]

2 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

Revelation.

The abomination of desolation which is placed in Jerusalem by the armed forces of the north is described by John as

 

¹² And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

¹³ And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

¹⁴ And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

¹⁵ And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

¹⁶ And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb

 

 

 

You can see the heaven departing as a scroll being rolled together in the video.

It's what the people in Jerusalem flee from on the day of the Lord.

It is the cloud that ascends into heaven from Jerusalem that the two witnesses are taken up in.

revelation 11

¹² And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.

 

It is also accompanied by the earthquake seen in revelation 6:12 and revelation 11:13.

 

The earthquakes and the signs in the heavens are a result of nation to rising against nation and kingdom.ahainst kingdom.

 

Luke 21

 

¹⁰ Then said he unto them, Nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom:

¹¹ And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.

 

It's all describing modern warfare and the abomination that causes desolation .

Yes the sky recedes and there is smoke. But there is no connection of this to the abomination of desolation. That occurs in the temple by Anti-Christ. The great earthquake is a judgement of God that has no relation to the abomination. The Luke passage you quote is already happening and is not limited to Revelation. The 2 witnesses ascend after 3 days at the midpoint of the tribulation. That cloud is of God and is not related to the abomination. 

[Shilohsfoal]

1 hour ago, TrueFollowerOfChrist said:

Yes the sky recedes and there is smoke. But there is no connection of this to the abomination of desolation. That occurs in the temple by Anti-Christ. The great earthquake is a judgement of God that has no relation to the abomination. The Luke passage you quote is already happening and is not limited to Revelation. The 2 witnesses ascend after 3 days at the midpoint of the tribulation. That cloud is of God and is not related to the abomination. 

 

????? WHAT YEAR?

 

What year are you claiming Luke 21:10-11,Mathew 24:7 and Mark 13:8 took place ?????????????

Because all three of these accounts is from the same discussion Jesus had with the disciples referd to as the Oliver discourse 

 

 

Luke 21

¹⁰ Then said he unto them, Nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom:

¹¹ And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.

 

Mathew 24

⁷ For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

 

Mark 13:8

Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be earthquakes in various places, and famines. These are the beginning of birth pains.

 

Now that you have claimed these events have been fulfilled ,you shouldn't have any problem showing proof of your claim.
 

Edited July 30, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[Shilohsfoal]

28 minutes ago, TrueFollowerOfChrist said:

Yes the sky recedes and there is smoke. But there is no connection of this to the abomination of desolation. That occurs in the temple by Anti-Christ. The great earthquake is a judgement of God that has no relation to the abomination. The Luke passage you quote is already happening and is not limited to Revelation. The 2 witnesses ascend after 3 days at the midpoint of the tribulation. That cloud is of God and is not related to the abomination. 

PS

It's not one man who places the abomination that causes Jerusalem desolation.It is the armed forces who put it in Jerusalem.

Daniel 11:31

³¹ “His armed forces will rise up to desecrate the temple fortress and will abolish the daily sacrifice. Then they will set up the abomination that causes desolation.

 

And just so you know.I have relatives who served in the armed for es of the north.I know what they use desolate a city.And yes,it causes the earth to quake and the heavens depart as a scroll rolling together.

I also understand Israeli government policy of the nuclear option called the Samson option in which Israel itself and all the nations which have attacked it are to be destroyed with nuclear weapons. This takes place three days after Jerusalem is taken.

 

Edited July 30, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[dad2]

7 hours ago, Diaste said:

Pretty sure sure the one who created atoms can manipulate matter in any way, seemingly impossible to mankind. The wisdom of man is foolishness to God.

Limiting God to man made wisdom...lol

How would God be limited in changing the nature on earth? No one said He does it by man's science.

7 hours ago, Diaste said:

God is beyond such trivial imaginations. 

But bound to His word which tells us the islands and mountains will move.

7 hours ago, Diaste said:

Jesus violated 'physical laws' several times, demonstrating immense supernatural power.

Yes, but earth itself went on under the laws of physics in general. That means miracles are the exception. In a change of nature it is the rule.

7 hours ago, Diaste said:

Zech 14

"4On that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley, with half the mountain moving to the north and half to the south. 5You will flee by My mountain valley, for it will extend to Azal. You will flee as you fled from the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah."

I don't think those fleeing are waiting for the rocks to cool.

Great, so then they never got that hot because probably nature in that day is different. If we shoved continents around fast today heat would be involved.

[dad2]

5 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

All the wicked people will flee.

The saints will be gatherd to Christ at the same time the wicked in Judea are fleeing.

Zech 14

⁵ And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

 

I guess you believe it's the wicked that are with the Lord and the saints in Judea are fleeing.

That does not say or suggest that all people fleeing as commanded by God are wicked.

[dad2]

5 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

Yes and we know that great tribulation that takes place at the time the abomination of desolation is placed in Jerusalem by the armed forces.

That is when there is a great earthquake in Jerusalem and the two witnesses ascend into heaven in the cloud from the abomination of desolation.

It takes place on the day of the Lord when the resurrection takes place.You claim the saints will flee so I'm assuming you believe the dead that are raised will flee as well.

 

Whenever it takes place we know how long it lasts and a lot else about it.

 

One of those things we know is that every island will move. For that to happen, we need different laws to avoid the great heat it would cause in this nature. Your solution seems to be not believing they will actually move. We get it.

[dad2]

5 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

If you saw a giant mushroom cloud ascending into heaven from Jerusalem,and you were close enough to see it, you would flee too without hesitation.Go to the nearest mountain and hide in a cave.

If you were alive. The problem is Jerusalem will never be nuked like that. Neither did God tell us to look for a nuke and then flee. He told us that when we see that abomination in the holy place then we are to flee immediately.

5 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

But of course you believe a statue causes all this.Something like the stay puff marshmallow man from ghost busters.

No. The idol set up marks the time it all starts. Then we have the countdown.

 

 

[dad2]

Quote

Physics will not be changed until the Millennium.

Fair enough. Now support it by eliminating the end of the tribulation as an option?

 

Quote

The supernatural acts, like the change of the earth, and the great hailstones, and other terrifying judgments in Revelation are miraculous acts of God, but not a change in physics. The laws will change in the millenium and definitely in the eternal state, because God gets to decide what those laws are.

He doesn't get to change it if needed in the Tribulation? Why? Why is every mountain on earth and every island fleeing away and moving happening in this current nature? Says who? How about the changes in the universe and sun? How about angels and demons then being able to live among men and be seen and heard in the world? That doesn't happen today. If an angel appears to men it is an exception and isolated event today.

[Shilohsfoal]

26 minutes ago, dad2 said:

That does not say or suggest that all people fleeing as commanded by God are wicked.

If they were good ,they would be gatherd to the Lord at his coming like Paul said.

Instead the are fleeing when the Lord comes. They certainly don't belong to Christ or they would be with him.

 

Zech 14

⁵ And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.