The end time has different physics?

[dad2]

12 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

I'm not sure that is during the millinium.It could be but the water flowing out of the house of the Lord sounds a lot like the river of life that flows out of new Jerusalem after the millinium.

During the millinium I could see those in the kingdom of heaven being blessed ,but I don't see them that are not in the kingdom of heaven being blessed.I wouldn't think there would be any change at all outside the borders of the promised land.I understand no one will be able to live in Egypt for 40 years but other than that I don't see where anything changes.

What kingdom? You mean already in eternal bodies? In that time we rule with Him and all the kingdoms of the world become His kingdoms! The folks in the world kingdoms will be blessed if they obey and if any rebel, they will face swift justice. The promised land is just a little area of Israel. We will rule the world with Him

 

So the issue of what laws and nature will be in place for them is what we are looking at. Those raptured and in eternal bodies do not need to worry about lifespans or food etc.

[Shilohsfoal]

38 minutes ago, dad2 said:

What kingdom? You mean already in eternal bodies? In that time we rule with Him and all the kingdoms of the world become His kingdoms! The folks in the world kingdoms will be blessed if they obey and if any rebel, they will face swift justice. The promised land is just a little area of Israel. We will rule the world with Him

 

So the issue of what laws and nature will be in place for them is what we are looking at. Those raptured and in eternal bodies do not need to worry about lifespans or food etc.

Your going to rule with Christ?

For some reason I don't believe you are one of those who partake in the first resurection of those who are killed for their testimony of Christ and for the word of God.

 

 

 

⁴ And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

⁵ But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

⁶ Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[dad2]

16 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

Your going to rule with Christ?

You bet.

Dan 7:18 But the holy people of the Most High will receive the kingdom and will possess it forever—yes, for ever and ever

Daniel 7:27

Then the sovereignty, the dominion and the greatness of all the kingdoms under the whole heaven will be given to the people of the saints of the Highest One; His kingdom will be an everlasting kingdom, and all the dominions will serve and obey Him

Revelation 22:5

And there will no longer be any night; and they will not have need of the light of a lamp nor the light of the sun, because the Lord God will illumine them; and they will reign forever and ever.

 

We will rule forever, including the 1000 years. So if gravity were a little less or if the strong nuclear force was  different or other fundamental realities of today, it would not be affecting molecules in our bodies, or lifespans etc etc.

 Looking at a few differences before and after the flood, we see trees grew in weeks then. Probably the same in the future millennium. People lived 900+ years. The same will be true in the future. Looking at the great variety and diversity of life in the past it seems reasonable to conclude that adapting probably was super fast. Lions and wolves will eat grass in the 1000 years, so they will change fast in the future also. etc etc etc etc

 

 

 

[Shilohsfoal]

9 minutes ago, dad2 said:

You bet.

Dan 7:18 But the holy people of the Most High will receive the kingdom and will possess it forever—yes, for ever and ever

Daniel 7:27

Then the sovereignty, the dominion and the greatness of all the kingdoms under the whole heaven will be given to the people of the saints of the Highest One; His kingdom will be an everlasting kingdom, and all the dominions will serve and obey Him

Revelation 22:5

And there will no longer be any night; and they will not have need of the light of a lamp nor the light of the sun, because the Lord God will illumine them; and they will reign forever and ever.

 

We will rule forever, including the 1000 years. So if gravity were a little less or if the strong nuclear force was  different or other fundamental realities of today, it would not be affecting molecules in our bodies, or lifespans etc etc.

 Looking at a few differences before and after the flood, we see trees grew in weeks then. Probably the same in the future millennium. People lived 900+ years. The same will be true in the future. Looking at the great variety and diversity of life in the past it seems reasonable to conclude that adapting probably was super fast. Lions and wolves will eat grass in the 1000 years, so they will change fast in the future also. etc etc etc etc

 

 

 

So your a citizen of the little horns kingdom and you being persecuted so you believe you will reign .

I don't believe you are in that kingdom.amd I don't believe you are persecuted.

Daniel 7:25

He will speak against the Most High and oppress his holy people and try to change the set times and the laws. The holy people will be delivered into his hands for a time, times and half a time.

 

Do you have any way of proving you are one of these holy people who is given into the hand of the little horn for a time,times and a half?

[dad2]

17 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

So your a citizen of the little horns kingdom and you being persecuted so you believe you will reign .

I don't believe you are in that kingdom.amd I don't believe you are persecuted.

Daniel 7:25

He will speak against the Most High and oppress his holy people and try to change the set times and the laws. The holy people will be delivered into his hands for a time, times and half a time.

 

Do you have any way of proving you are one of these holy people who is given into the hand of the little horn for a time,times and a half?

Explain how you thought Dan 7 was limited to believers from the tribulation?

[Shilohsfoal]

12 minutes ago, dad2 said:

Explain how you thought Dan 7 was limited to believers from the tribulation?

Daniel 7 is about the saints of the tribulation.

Daniel 7

²³ Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.

²⁴ And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

²⁵ And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

²⁶ But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end.

²⁷ And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

 

First,-I don't even live in that kingdom

Second-The persecution of the saints mentioned here has not even started yet.

Third-The kingdom is going to be destroyed and then given to those saints that are persecuted.

 

None of this has anything to do with me unless I somehow end up living in israel in a few years from now which I don't see happening.

[Shilohsfoal]

The saints in Daniel 7 are the same saints in revelation 20.

They reign with Christ.

 

I don't live in that kingdom.I would like to go there in the future but I will not be reigning in that land.The saints who are persecuted for their testimony of Christ will be.

 

⁴ And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

⁵ But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

⁶ Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[dad2]

2 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

Daniel 7 is about the saints of the tribulation.

Daniel 7

²³ Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.

²⁴ And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

²⁵ And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

²⁶ But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end.

²⁷ And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

 

First,-I don't even live in that kingdom

Second-The persecution of the saints mentioned here has not even started yet.

Third-The kingdom is going to be destroyed and then given to those saints that are persecuted.

 

None of this has anything to do with me unless I somehow end up living in israel in a few years from now which I don't see happening.

Let's have a look and see

 

Daniel 7:3

And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another.

 

Those kingdoms (as correspond with chapter two) span a lot of the history of the world. Not a few years in the end only.

 

Daniel 7:9

I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.

 

So it goes right up till Jesus returns.

 

Daniel 7:11

I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.

Daniel 7:12

As concerning the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away: yet their lives were prolonged for a season and time.

 

So here we have Jesus taking over.

 

Daniel 7:18

But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.

 

That kingdom is the one Jesus sets up when He returns. We rule with Him.  There is no shadow of a hint here that this only means the saints who happened to live in the tribulation!

 

 

 

[Shilohsfoal]

5 hours ago, dad2 said:

Let's have a look and see

 

Daniel 7:3

And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another.

 

Those kingdoms (as correspond with chapter two) span a lot of the history of the world. Not a few years in the end only.

 

Daniel 7:9

I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.

 

So it goes right up till Jesus returns.

 

Daniel 7:11

I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.

Daniel 7:12

As concerning the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away: yet their lives were prolonged for a season and time.

 

So here we have Jesus taking over.

 

Daniel 7:18

But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.

 

That kingdom is the one Jesus sets up when He returns. We rule with Him.  There is no shadow of a hint here that this only means the saints who happened to live in the tribulation!

 

 

 

So you claim that you will be murdered for your testimony of Jesus and that you will be resurected in the first resurection and that you will reign with Christ.

Those are some bold claims.Do you have any proof that you are one on of these saints and not just a regular ordinary Christian?

 

⁴ And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

⁵ But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

⁶ Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[dad2]

6 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

So you claim that you will be murdered for your testimony of Jesus and that you will be resurected in the first resurection and that you will reign with Christ.

Those are some bold claims.Do you have any proof that you are one on of these saints and not just a regular ordinary Christian?

 

⁴ And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

⁵ But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

⁶ Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

The chapter covers Rome, Greece, Medo Persia, and Babylon, as well as the final manifestation of the Roman kingdom.  

Daniel 7:17

These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.

Daniel 7:18

But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.

 

It spans all those empires and times and then mentions that His saints will rule.

 

Later it focuses in on the end time, and points out that those folks in the tribulation period who believe will be included, and also rule.

 

Jesus returns with His saints. That is when Jesus takes all the kingdoms and gives them to us to rule. We who were Raptured and returning with Him also of course rule with Him. So will the folks either killed in the tribulation or who are delivered when we return.

 

 I am not sure why you try to stuff it all together to omit believers of all ages, and imagine that only the left behind/tribulation new believers will help Jesus rule here. You have no case. Stop embarrassing yourself with  brash and truly out to lunch cultish pet doctrines here and address the topic.