70 weeks of years prophecy

[Charlie744]

In chapter 9 of Daniel, Gabriel gives Daniel the 70 weeks of years prophecy which is broken into 3 separate time periods: 7 - 62 - 1 or 70 weeks.

what is the purpose of dividing this time period into these 3 sections and are they consecutive?

 

[AdHoc]

On 11/7/2023 at 4:41 AM, Charlie744 said:

In chapter 9 of Daniel, Gabriel gives Daniel the 70 weeks of years prophecy which is broken into 3 separate time periods: 7 - 62 - 1 or 70 weeks.

what is the purpose of dividing this time period into these 3 sections and are they consecutive?

 

I cannot answer the first question. God divided it and He rarely answers questions.

To the second I answer NO. The 70th week cannot follow directly on the 69th. Note the grammar.  

26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease,

Daniel languishes in Babylon. Solomon's Temple is destroyed. In verse 26 a "people" shall come (future) and destroy the sanctuary. That is, another, or second Temple must stand and be destroyed. History will show that from Messiah being cut off till this destruction was 40 years. Then, for the daily oblation to be slain, it needs a Temple. So before the 70th week a third Temple must stand. History will show that there has been no third Temple. WE must be in that gap right now.

Maybe Sir Robert Anderson will give more insight in "The Coming Prince"

[Charlie744]

2 hours ago, AdHoc said:

I cannot answer the first question. God divided it and He rarely answers questions.

To the second I answer NO. The 70th week cannot follow directly on the 69th. Note the grammar.  

26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease,

Daniel languishes in Babylon. Solomon's Temple is destroyed. In verse 26 a "people" shall come (future) and destroy the sanctuary. That is, another, or second Temple must stand and be destroyed. History will show that from Messiah being cut off till this destruction was 40 years. Then, for the daily oblation to be slain, it needs a Temple. So before the 70th week a third Temple must stand. History will show that there has been no third Temple. WE must be in that gap right now.

Maybe Sir Robert Anderson will give more insight in "The Coming Prince"

Thank you and I do believe you are in the majority here. 
 

However, there is nothing in the verses that even “hint” of a separation of the 70 weeks - that came from the Jesuits in the 16th century with their 7 year tribulation theory. 
 

The purpose of the distinct periods was for God to reveal to us those “things” that will and must be completed within this period. 
 

The entire 70 weeks speaks to the complete restoration and plan of salvation that God has designed after the complete destruction of Jerusalem by the Babylonians. 
 

There is a specific order and timing in His plan of restoration/salvation for the Jews and mankind. 
 

He first establishes the external time frame or borders at 70 weeks where EVERYTHING must be fulfilled. The first timed section restores not only ALL the physical “things” that must be restored, but He ensures the Sabbatical cycles are also restored beginning in 457BC. It is the Jews responsible for completing and fulfilling these “things. And this is mentioned in the 9:24-27 verses. 
 

Then, surprisingly, God reveals the “third” timed section of the last week. He does not comment on the largest timed section of the 62 weeks. 
 

He describes in 9:25, the “restorative” verse that He will come AFTER 7 and 62 weeks, or AFTER the combined 69 weeks are completed. He does NOT arrive during or before the END of these two consecutive weeks. 
 

In 9:24, He reveals ALL of the 6 God given mission His Father asked Him to do. And He is the ONLY ONE that can complete or fulfill them. The Jews have NO part or ability to complete/ fulfill / address these 6 requirements. This is His mission to fulfill. 
 

So, He has identified the total 70 weeks period where EVERYTHING must be fulfilled. The Jews have their mission within the first 7 weeks. The Messiah has His mission declared in the final week of the 70 weeks. His mission can not begin until the 69 weeks are completed/ fulfilled. 
 

Everything was ready for the coming Messiah and THE END OF THE 69th week. Everything that was destroyed by the Babylonians was completely restored in the exact reverse order they were taken. 
 

Finally, now the final piece of the furniture can be restored- it will represent the first piece of furniture that was taken. In 606BC, the Ark of the Covenant was removed from the sanctuary so Babylon would not take it away to their city. Consequently, this will be the last piece of furniture restored at the very beginning of the last week in the 70 weeks. The Ark of the Covenant in the form of the Messiah will be restored. 
 

Now, everything is once again restored as it was before Babylon destroyed everything. Now, the Messiah will arrive on the very first day of the 70th week to be baptized in the Jordan by John. 
God is once again with His people. 
 

In 9:25, Daniel reveals in this “restorative” verse Jesus will come AFTER 69 weeks. Then in 9:26, a “destructive” verse, he reveals the Messiah will be “cut off” AFTER the 62 weeks. Therefore, He arrives AFTER 69th week AND is “cut off” AFTER the 62 weeks. BOTH His arrival and death are revealed in these two verses, and they both can only occur AFTER THE completion of the 69 total time period . 
 

And NO ONE should have an issue with this since this is exactly what happened. He was crucified in the middle of the last week. 
 

The 70 weeks prophecy was completed and fulfilled by the Jews (their part or mission to restore Jerusalem), and the Messiah would fulfill His mission in the last week of the 70 weeks. These verses are messianic and speak about HIS PLAN OF SALVATION AND RESTORATION FOR THE JEWS AND MANKIND. 
 

The 70th week was purposely “set aside” for those restorative measures (9:24), that could only be fulfilled by Him (not the Jews). 
 

Despite being crucified, He fulfilled ALL 6 of His God given requirements DURING and at the end of His life. 

[Montana Marv]

12 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

The 70th week was purposely “set aside” for those restorative measures (9:24), that could only be fulfilled by Him (not the Jews). 
 

Despite being crucified, He fulfilled ALL 6 of His God given requirements DURING and at the end of His life. 

And yet Daniels people (Israel) and Daniels holy city (Jerusalem); Who Daniel 9:24 is addressed to, is for the receiving of their Salvation.  Nothing to do about Christ.  This is a prophetic time line when those of Israel will accept their Messiah.  It has not happened as yet.  But it will happen when they see the one who they have pierced, the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords at the Second Coming.  The fulfillment of the six tasks at the end 70th Week will then be complete.  Israel is now restored and grafted back into the Tree.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Charlie744]

24 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

And yet Daniels people (Israel) and Daniels holy city (Jerusalem); Who Daniel 9:24 is addressed to, is for the receiving of their Salvation.  Nothing to do about Christ.  This is a prophetic time line when those of Israel will accept their Messiah.  It has not happened as yet.  But it will happen when they see the one who they have pierced, the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords at the Second Coming.  The fulfillment of the six tasks at the end 70th Week will then be complete.  Israel is now restored and grafted back into the Tree.

In Christ

Montana Marv

I am not sure I am following you. The prophecy was all about the restoration and plan of salvation for the Jews and mankind. 
 

Only the Messiah could fulfill the 6 requirements in 9:24 - and He indeed fulfilled them. They were fulfilled not literally since they will not be consummated until His return.

However, all 6 were fulfilled in an “already, but not yet,” manner. Meaning, if you place your faith in Jesus then He will not see your sins at His second coming. 
 

You are certainly correct thst Gabriel told Daniel the prophecy was for his people and his holy city, but they rejected their own Messiah. 
 

Now, the Covenant would be offered to the Gentiles. At the end of time, the Gentiles will make the Jews jealous and they will realize the “One they have pierced.” This is the final measure right before His return - when the Jews will recognize Jesus as their Messiah and will go out into the world for 3.5 years and preach the Word of God and Jesus the Messiah. Then, the end will come. 
 

It will be God Himself who will remove the blindness from their eyes (a Damascus event to the Jews just as was given to Paul. This will also have to be a divine event - no one on earth will be able to restore their site (this does not mean that their are no Jewish people today that have accepted Jesus, but He will do a divine event at the appointed time). 
 

Jesus did fulfill ALL 6 requirements at His first coming and this is why Stephen was allowed to see Jesus at the right hand of the Father when he was being stoned. His sacrifice and all 6 requirements were fulfilled and accepted by the Father after He returned to God. 
 
This was our proof that He fulfilled the 6 requirements in only 3.5 years of the last week of the final 7 years of the prophecy. HIS MISSION WAS INDEED COMPLETED OR FULFILLED DESPITE THE CROSS. The 70 weeks prophecy is over. 
 

The ONLY remaining part of the 70 weeks that is still incomplete relates to the Jews. When the Lord removes their blindness, they will preach the Good News just as Paul did for the final 3.5 years. This is necessary since the Jews MUST complete the fourth and final Great Jubilee cycle. The fourth Great Jubilee cycle began in 457 BC and was supposed to be completed in 33/34 AD (exactly 490 years later which was also the exact end of the 70 weeks of years prophecy.  Because they rejected and crucified their Messiah, the “counting” of the fourth Great Jubilee cycle was stopped. It was therefore 3.5 years short of its fulfillment. Only when the Jews are in standing with their God will the counting continue. Thus, when God removes their blindness they will preach the Messiah for the final 3.5 years- they will complete THEIR time requirement (all 490 years) where they will be “reckoned” with their God and this will allow the return of God. 
 

Let me know what you think. 
 

 

[AdHoc]

18 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

Thank you and I do believe you are in the majority here. 
 

However, there is nothing in the verses that even “hint” of a separation of the 70 weeks - that came from the Jesuits in the 16th century with their 7 year tribulation theory. 
 

The purpose of the distinct periods was for God to reveal to us those “things” that will and must be completed within this period. 
 

The entire 70 weeks speaks to the complete restoration and plan of salvation that God has designed after the complete destruction of Jerusalem by the Babylonians. 
 

There is a specific order and timing in His plan of restoration/salvation for the Jews and mankind. 
 

He first establishes the external time frame or borders at 70 weeks where EVERYTHING must be fulfilled. The first timed section restores not only ALL the physical “things” that must be restored, but He ensures the Sabbatical cycles are also restored beginning in 457BC. It is the Jews responsible for completing and fulfilling these “things. And this is mentioned in the 9:24-27 verses. 
 

Then, surprisingly, God reveals the “third” timed section of the last week. He does not comment on the largest timed section of the 62 weeks. 
 

He describes in 9:25, the “restorative” verse that He will come AFTER 7 and 62 weeks, or AFTER the combined 69 weeks are completed. He does NOT arrive during or before the END of these two consecutive weeks. 
 

In 9:24, He reveals ALL of the 6 God given mission His Father asked Him to do. And He is the ONLY ONE that can complete or fulfill them. The Jews have NO part or ability to complete/ fulfill / address these 6 requirements. This is His mission to fulfill. 
 

So, He has identified the total 70 weeks period where EVERYTHING must be fulfilled. The Jews have their mission within the first 7 weeks. The Messiah has His mission declared in the final week of the 70 weeks. His mission can not begin until the 69 weeks are completed/ fulfilled. 
 

Everything was ready for the coming Messiah and THE END OF THE 69th week. Everything that was destroyed by the Babylonians was completely restored in the exact reverse order they were taken. 
 

Finally, now the final piece of the furniture can be restored- it will represent the first piece of furniture that was taken. In 606BC, the Ark of the Covenant was removed from the sanctuary so Babylon would not take it away to their city. Consequently, this will be the last piece of furniture restored at the very beginning of the last week in the 70 weeks. The Ark of the Covenant in the form of the Messiah will be restored. 
 

Now, everything is once again restored as it was before Babylon destroyed everything. Now, the Messiah will arrive on the very first day of the 70th week to be baptized in the Jordan by John. 
God is once again with His people. 
 

In 9:25, Daniel reveals in this “restorative” verse Jesus will come AFTER 69 weeks. Then in 9:26, a “destructive” verse, he reveals the Messiah will be “cut off” AFTER the 62 weeks. Therefore, He arrives AFTER 69th week AND is “cut off” AFTER the 62 weeks. BOTH His arrival and death are revealed in these two verses, and they both can only occur AFTER THE completion of the 69 total time period . 
 

And NO ONE should have an issue with this since this is exactly what happened. He was crucified in the middle of the last week. 
 

The 70 weeks prophecy was completed and fulfilled by the Jews (their part or mission to restore Jerusalem), and the Messiah would fulfill His mission in the last week of the 70 weeks. These verses are messianic and speak about HIS PLAN OF SALVATION AND RESTORATION FOR THE JEWS AND MANKIND. 
 

The 70th week was purposely “set aside” for those restorative measures (9:24), that could only be fulfilled by Him (not the Jews). 
 

Despite being crucified, He fulfilled ALL 6 of His God given requirements DURING and at the end of His life. 

Thank you for your reply. That we are far apart in our understanding is evident. It is my understanding that it was not given to Messiah to achieve the 6 goals. It is directed at "Thy People": Verse 24, written less elegantly, but true to the grammar, reads;

24
Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression,

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city to make an end of sins,

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city to make reconciliation for iniquity,

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city to bring in everlasting righteousness,

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city to seal up the vision and prophecy,

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city to anoint the most Holy.

It is at once clear that it was not Messiah's duty, but Daniel's People. And this, in itself, is emphatic since Jehovah had declared them "Lo-ammi"- you are not my people. The "and" at the beginning of every goal is decisive. The contrast between what the Messiah did and what Daniel's People must fulfill is pronounced. It would be totally untrue, for instance, to expect that Messiah would finish "THE Transgression". He did not begin the transgression, neither sustains it, nor finishes it. It is THY people and THY city.

However, I do understand that if you have held your view for any number of years, it will be a big step to embrace mine

[Montana Marv]

5 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

I am not sure I am following you. The prophecy was all about the restoration and plan of salvation for the Jews and mankind. 
 

Only the Messiah could fulfill the 6 requirements in 9:24 - and He indeed fulfilled them. They were fulfilled not literally since they will not be consummated until His return.

However, all 6 were fulfilled in an “already, but not yet,” manner. Meaning, if you place your faith in Jesus then He will not see your sins at His second coming. 
 

You are certainly correct thst Gabriel told Daniel the prophecy was for his people and his holy city, but they rejected their own Messiah. 

This letter of prophetic Weeks was written to Daniels People (Israel) and the holy city (Jerusalem).  And them only.   None of the six have been fulfilled by Israel. The Abrahamic Covenant is a covenant between God and Abraham, Issac and Jacob.  Not a covenant between Abraham, Issac and Jacob and God.  Abraham fell asleep.  No matter how many times Israel fails, the end product will be a restored Israel.  No more sin, transgressions, all forgiven in a single day.

And yes, this is a Salvation time line for Israel.  It happens at the Second Coming and after the end of the 70th Week.  The 70 Sevens are all about Israel and when they will be grafted back into the Tree.  When they see the one who they have pierced, they will mourn.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Charlie744]

1 hour ago, Montana Marv said:

This letter of prophetic Weeks was written to Daniels People (Israel) and the holy city (Jerusalem).  And them only.   None of the six have been fulfilled by Israel. The Abrahamic Covenant is a covenant between God and Abraham, Issac and Jacob.  Not a covenant between Abraham, Issac and Jacob and God.  Abraham fell asleep.  No matter how many times Israel fails, the end product will be a restored Israel.  No more sin, transgressions, all forgiven in a single day.

And yes, this is a Salvation time line for Israel.  It happens at the Second Coming and after the end of the 70th Week.  The 70 Sevens are all about Israel and when they will be grafted back into the Tree.  When they see the one who they have pierced, they will mourn.

In Christ

Montana Marv

Sorry again, I don’t understand. The Covenant is between God and His people  the Jews. 
 

The prophecy is for the Jews. It speaks to the coming of their Messiah and the things God have Him to accomplish during the last set aside week. 
 
What did the Messiah accomplish if not the 6 requirements?

Only God can fulfill those 6. 
 

 

[Charlie744]

1 hour ago, AdHoc said:

Thank you for your reply. That we are far apart in our understanding is evident. It is my understanding that it was not given to Messiah to achieve the 6 goals. It is directed at "Thy People": Verse 24, written less elegantly, but true to the grammar, reads;

24
Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression,

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city to make an end of sins,

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city to make reconciliation for iniquity,

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city to bring in everlasting righteousness,

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city to seal up the vision and prophecy,

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city to anoint the most Holy.

It is at once clear that it was not Messiah's duty, but Daniel's People. And this, in itself, is emphatic since Jehovah had declared them "Lo-ammi"- you are not my people. The "and" at the beginning of every goal is decisive. The contrast between what the Messiah did and what Daniel's People must fulfill is pronounced. It would be totally untrue, for instance, to expect that Messiah would finish "THE Transgression". He did not begin the transgression, neither sustains it, nor finishes it. It is THY people and THY city.

However, I do understand that if you have held your view for any number of years, it will be a big step to embrace mine

Yes, they are determined FOR your people. They will be the recipient of these 6 blessings. The Messiah’s mission was to fulfill these God given requirements. The Jews are on the receiving end of these, they could not possibly bring in righteousness, put an end to sin, seal up or fulfill the vision (chapter 8 vision and chapter 9 prophecy), to anoint the Most High, etc.

 

The Jews could not accomplish any of these- only His sacrifice on the Cross could fulfill these demands. If not, then why did the Messiah come? What tells us the reason He came for? What tells us was His mission to fulfill? 
 

This is all about Him not the Jews. It is His plan of salvation that was established from the beginning of the world. And the Jews rejected their Messiah- but that was also within His plan so the Gentiles could be saved. 

[Montana Marv]

1 hour ago, Charlie744 said:

What did the Messiah accomplish if not the 6 requirements?

Only God can fulfill those 6. 

Salvation for both the Jew and Gentile.

Dan 9:24 is only about Israel's salvation as a nation.  Not individually.

The Messiah did not put an end to Israel's transgressions (they continue to this day); Their sin continues to this day; Their wickedness continues to this day; No everlasting righteousness as yet; To seal up vision and prophecy (look at the N.T. especially Rev which is full of prophecy) no end in sight; They have yet to anoint the most holy who is their Messiah. They anointed him with a crown of thorns.

Only Israel can say "I accept those six"

In Christ

Montana Marv