Daniel 2:34 - Stone striking the feet of the image.

[Retrobyter]

On 2/27/2024 at 12:34 AM, Charlie744 said:

Okay, does 2:34 reflect His first coming or His return and how have you determined it?

 

Shalom, Charlie744.

I'm going to keep this brief so my text editor works for a while.

It happens at His Second Coming. Do you see the Messiah reigning anywhere on earth right now? His Kingdom will be a LITERAL Kingdom, not just some "spiritual" thing. (MY! How I hate the misuse of that word "spiritual!")

[Charlie744]

1 hour ago, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, Charlie744.

I'm going to keep this brief so my text editor works for a while.

It happens at His Second Coming. Do you see the Messiah reigning anywhere on earth right now? His Kingdom will be a LITERAL Kingdom, not just some "spiritual" thing. (MY! How I hate the misuse of that word "spiritual!")

Nice to hear from you!

Jesus came to “set up” His kingdom. He fulfilled all 6 of His God given requirements or mission (9:24). 
 

The stone strikes the feet only, not the toes, and breaks apart the iron and the clay. 
 

Symbolically, the clay (Jews, His people) were encased or under the control of pagan Rome, the 4th beast kingdom. The Jews were indeed expecting their Messiah to come around the time that He did AND destroy pagan Rome and establish His kingdom on earth and rule forever - a “King David” like king. But He came as a suffering servant, not to destroy, but to divide. 
 

The cross would divide those of His people that would come to accept Him as their Messiah- He was the”Potter” (Isaiah 64, Jeremiah 18). The hardened or ceramic Clay represent this of His people that would reject Him - those He could not use or mold with His hands. 
 

Verses 2:41-43 speak about the results of His striking or breaking apart the two elements in 2:34. These things did happen after the cross - these verses speak of this separation where there is the “divided” kingdom. Pagan Rome would still continue but His church would also come into being. He provides the characteristics of this “divided” church (which will become known as RCC headed by the little horn of Daniel 7, 8. 
 

Without the stone striking the feet, His church would never have been “established or set up” on earth. Chapter 2 is the “blueprint” for all of Daniel. In chapter 7, God not only used very different symbols to refer to the 4 kingdoms, but now, the 4th kingdom, which had been symbolically struck and separated, are presented differently: the indescribable beast is pagan Rome after the cross, the 10 toes that were kept at the end of the feet of pagan Rome and could / were not able/allowed to escape, are shown as 10 horns (powers). They are described as “coming out of the 4th beast kingdom.” And ONLY as a result of the symbolic “breaking apart” of the iron and the clay would / could the little horn come into being. He was NOT mentioned in chapter 2 but he would begin his life after the cross. 
 
 Symbolically, he represents those Gentiles that will accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior AND, unlike Paul, Matthew, etc., they would become the dominant number of Christians in this new movement AND they would seek to gain control and power over this church. 
 

After the cross, he “little horn” was small and sitting at the bottom of this movement, but in the later verses of chapter 7 he is seen siting atop the 4th beast kingdom (but only after the 4th beast kingdom of pagan Rome was slain and its body destroyed. ALL of these things literally took place after the cross- after Jesus separated or broke apart the iron and the clay. 
 

There is no other event that is mentioned in Daniel that would cause the results found in chapters 7,8,9 and 11, or 12. 
 

Clearly, the 4 kingdoms are alive and well after chapter 2 and were not destroyed by 2:34. If 2:34 is an end time event then the 10 toes would still be found at the end of the feet of pagan Rome, His church would not have the “pottery clay” released to be sent out to preach the Good News, the little horn (papacy) would not also have “come out of the 4th beast kingdom” (BEFORE PAGAN ROME WAS SLAIN- 467AD). 

But 2:35 is truly reflecting the end times, when, now, God will address ALL 5 of the individual elements. 
 

Chapters 7,8,9 11 and 12 all speak of the events that take place (4th kingdom) after the cross. 
 

Of course, it is impossible to provide all the comments and thoughts surrounding this most important verse and the rest of Daniel in this response, but it is a start. 

Thanks, Charlie 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 29 by Charlie744

[Diaste]

On 2/28/2024 at 5:48 AM, Charlie744 said:

 unless the Messiah came and broke apart the clay from the iron, His Word and the Testimony of Jesus would not have been able to be spread around the world.

I have no idea what this means.

 

On 2/28/2024 at 5:48 AM, Charlie744 said:

Just because the two verses follow one another does not mean they take place at the same place time.

"As you watched, a stone was cut out,d but not by human hands. It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay, and crushed them."

I don't see a long time period between the stone being cut out and striking the statue. I think if there was some passing of time it would be between these two prophetic occurrences. 

"Then the iron, clay, bronze, silver, and gold were shattered and became like chaff on the threshing floor in summer. "

Upon striking the statue the entire statue is destroyed. Certainly there is no great time period between the striking and the destroying. 

"The wind carried them away, and not a trace of them could be found"

If not a trace could be found the prophecy hasn't happened yet. We very obviously have traces of Babylon, [the city is out in the desert], the Persians [Iran is the biggest terror sponsor in the world, after the USA], and Greece [that country is in turmoil]. 

 

On 2/28/2024 at 5:48 AM, Charlie744 said:

You do not need verse 2:34 if 2:35 happen at the same time. In 2:34, the Jews and His Word are separated from each their symbolic containment of pagan Rome. 

As shown a time gap would more likely exist between this "As you watched, a stone was cut out,d but not by human hands." and this, "It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay, and crushed them"

And not between the striking of verse 34 and the destruction of verse 35. 

On 2/28/2024 at 5:48 AM, Charlie744 said:

But in 2:35, He destroys ALL 5 elements (end time6. 
 

 

[Charlie744]

10 hours ago, Diaste said:

I have no idea what this means.

 
 

It means the stone ((Messiah) that strikes the feet of the image is symbolizing the breaking apart of the Romans the clay found within the 4th kingdom of pagan Rome. 

The clay (Jews) and the 10 toes were encased  / under the oppression of pagan Rome (as all other nations they would conquer) and were unable to fulfill their God given mission of revealing the one true God if Abraham, Isaac and Jacob to the world. Even when they were not under pagan Rome they kept that knowledge to themselves. They disobeyed their Gid and turned to idolatry so many times. 
 

But God would use the cross (their rejection of Him and His crucifixion) to break apart those of His people that He could use (pottery clay) from those who would reject Him (ceramic or hardened- hardened heart). He is the “Potter” who could choose those He wants to preach His Word and the Testimony of the Messiah. 
 

Symbolically, they would be broken away from within pagan Rome, broken away from those that rejected Him, and begin His earthly church. 
 

The “Stone” was part of the Great Mountain,” it (He) was sent to earth for this reason- 2:34 is the Messiah- the Stone. The Stone is not God the Father. Verse 2:35 represents the end of time when He will destroy all the 5 elements. 
 

The Messiah came to provide the only way for out salvation. If He did not “divide” (cross) those of His people that would preach the cross, His Word and the knowledge of the one true God would symbolically stay WITHIN the feet of pagan Rome.

10 hours ago, Diaste said:

 

"As you watched, a stone was cut out,d but not by human hands. It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay, and crushed them."

The “Stone” was “cut out” - again, this is purposeful language. The Mountain (God)  did not strike the feet, but the “Stone” (Messiah). Verse 2:34 does not say “it crushed them.” But it “broke apart the iron and the clay IN PIECES.” The “Stone” separated / divided / freed / released / broke apart these two elements ONLY. Jesus did not come to destroy but to divide. This is why this verse mentions the two elements only… it is His first coming. (However, I was / am well aware that ALL commentators treat 2:34 and 2:35 as occurring at the same time- His second coming. But as I was attempting to unpack, not only verses 2:41-43, but those in chapters 7, 8,9 and 11, unless 2:34 represented the cross and the ONLY CAUSE in establishing / setting up His church on earth, most of the prophecies would be (and are) thrown far into the future / end times. 
 

10 hours ago, Diaste said:

I don't see a long time period between the stone being cut out and striking the statue. I think if there was some passing of time it would be between these two prophetic occurrences.

I DO understand! EVERYONE treats these two verses as end time events. But these are two very different events and times when they occur. 

10 hours ago, Diaste said:

"Then the iron, clay, bronze, silver, and gold were shattered and became like chaff on the threshing floor in summer. "

The only time these 5 elements are found / spoken of is at the end of time. In the 4th kingdom period of pagan Rome, the iron and the clay are NOT separate elements… the are found to be mixed with the iron. They are symbolically “kept or held” within the iron and not free to break away from it. Also, 2:35 not 2:34 references the scene of the “threshing floor.” This speaks to the “harvest” when God will separate the wheat from the shaft. The Messiah did not come for this event but to break apart or separate/ divide those that would follow Him .. and go out into the world preaching His Word and His Testimony. And this is exactly what happened!

10 hours ago, Diaste said:

Upon striking the statue the entire statue is destroyed. Certainly there is no great time period between the striking and the destroying. 

"The wind carried them away, and not a trace of them could be found"

If not a trace could be found the prophecy hasn't happened yet.

Exactly, His first coming was not to destroy but to divide. The second coming WILL BE TO DESTROY. 

 

10 hours ago, Diaste said:

We very obviously have traces of Babylon, [the city is out in the desert], the Persians [Iran is the biggest terror sponsor in the world, after the USA], and Greece [that country is in turmoil]. 

 

As shown a time gap would more likely exist between this "As you watched, a stone was cut out,d but not by human hands." and this, "It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay, and crushed them"

And not between the striking of verse 34 and the destruction of verse 35. 

 

I would ask that you might consider these two verses as representing His first and second coming. Most of Daniel (7,8,9, and 11) represent those events that will take place before and at the time of His FIRST COMING, not end time events as most have placed them. 
 

Chapter 7 reveals the details of the “divided” 4th kingdom from pagan to papal Rome and the results that take place as a direct result of the cross. These occur AFTER 2:34. 
 

Chapter 7 also speaks more of the details of the little horn AFTER the cross. Now, as a result of the “breaking apart” the iron and the clay within the feet (obviously, the 4 kingdom image has not been destroyed). 

AFTER the cross, in chapter 7, the iron (pagan Rome), the clay (Jews who would accept Jesus as well as those Gentiles) would become His church, the 10 toes (now referred to as 10 horns) are all shown separately. They all have been broken apart or away from pagan Rome. 
 

None of these events would have happened if the Messiah had not “broken apart” the iron from the clay. 
 

Hope this makes sense… again, it is not what had been or is being taught today. 

[Diaste]

13 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

It means the stone ((Messiah) that strikes the feet of the image is symbolizing the breaking apart of the Romans the clay found within the 4th kingdom of pagan Rome. 

The clay (Jews) and the 10 toes were encased  / under the oppression of pagan Rome (as all other nations they would conquer) and were unable to fulfill their God given mission of revealing the one true God if Abraham, Isaac and Jacob to the world. Even when they were not under pagan Rome they kept that knowledge to themselves. They disobeyed their Gid and turned to idolatry so many times. 
 

But God would use the cross (their rejection of Him and His crucifixion) to break apart those of His people that He could use (pottery clay) from those who would reject Him (ceramic or hardened- hardened heart). He is the “Potter” who could choose those He wants to preach His Word and the Testimony of the Messiah. 
 

Symbolically, they would be broken away from within pagan Rome, broken away from those that rejected Him, and begin His earthly church. 

The “Stone” was part of the Great Mountain,” it (He) was sent to earth for this reason- 2:34 is the Messiah- the Stone. The Stone is not God the Father. Verse 2:35 represents the end of time when He will destroy all the 5 elements. 
 

The Messiah came to provide the only way for out salvation. If He did not “divide” (cross) those of His people that would preach the cross, His Word and the knowledge of the one true God would symbolically stay WITHIN the feet of pagan Rome.

Since the gold, silver and bronze are known empires that replaced one another, I have to stay within that theme and consider the Iron replaced the bronze and the clay and iron mixed is a weaker iteration of the pure iron. 

I don't see the justification in evidence to move from what is a clear succession of empires to a captivity. I have to reject this interpretation. 

13 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

 

The “Stone” was “cut out” - again, this is purposeful language. The Mountain (God)  did not strike the feet, but the “Stone” (Messiah). Verse 2:34 does not say “it crushed them.” But it “broke apart the iron and the clay IN PIECES.”

Yeah, but that's not really different, is it? Crushed, shattered, broken in pieces, all the same thing, they are no more. 

The mistake here is thinking the crushing of the feet is the only effect of the striking of the stone. When the feet are 'broken in pieces' then the whole statue is shattered. This is about the entire statue, not just the feet. 
"It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay, and crushed them. 35Then the iron, clay, bronze, silver, and gold were shattered"

All destroyed together, at the same time. 

13 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

 

The “Stone” separated / divided / freed / released / broke apart these two elements ONLY.

Not according to scripture:

"It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay, and crushed them. 35Then the iron, clay, bronze, silver, and gold were shattered"

 

 

13 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

I would ask that you might consider these two verses as representing His first and second coming. Most of Daniel (7,8,9, and 11) represent those events that will take place before and at the time of His FIRST COMING, not end time events as most have placed them. 

Even if that were true, it's not, but if it was, it's not proof of any time stamp for any other prophecy. It's like saying a front end loader is equivalent to a car because both have 4 wheels. There are many other consideration that make them very different. 

13 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

 

 

Chapter 7 reveals the details of the “divided” 4th kingdom from pagan to papal Rome and the results that take place as a direct result of the cross. These occur AFTER 2:34. 

I think this is where it's all thrown into doubt. The legs of iron and the feet of iron and clay are not Rome. 

Rome did not replace Greece. The Diadochi did, which is clear from Dan 8 and 11

 

13 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

 

Chapter 7 also speaks more of the details of the little horn AFTER the cross. Now, as a result of the “breaking apart” the iron and the clay within the feet (obviously, the 4 kingdom image has not been destroyed). 

That's not correct. The direct result of the stone striking the feet of iron and clay is;

"It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay, and crushed them. 35Then the iron, clay, bronze, silver, and gold were shattered"

It's not a release of anything from the feet and the feet alone, the entire structure is destroyed. 

 

[Dennis1209]

Another view from the bunker:

Daniel 2:34 talks about the Gentile image and history being toppled by striking the feet, becoming residue, and ending Gentile empires and kingdoms. It all applies and centers around Israel. The British and Ottoman empires are not explicitly mentioned, even though they impacted Israel positively and negatively.

The rock-cut without human hands is the Lord Jesus, and yet future in Daniel’s and our time. It strikes the feet (a mediocre, short-lived empire), turning all the previous and successive Gentile empires to dust and have dominion no more. It is permanently replaced with the everlasting kingdom of heaven.

We all observe the materials used in the colossus of Nebuchadnezzar as degrading in value, density, and malleability from top to bottom.

Historically, we know the empires represented by gold, silver, brass, and iron, but what about the feet and toes, a mixture of iron and miry clay, partially strong and partially weak?

The metals symbolize empires or kingdoms, as do trees, animals, lead (a toxic metal), and clay if we identify the symbolic iron with the traditional historical view of the empire of Rome in the two legs, possibly representing the two legs of the Roman empire. The eastern leg of the Roman Empire outlasted the western leg by 1,000 years, which turned into the Ottoman Empire, primarily Islam.

The western leg in the 4^th century A.D. under Constantine turned Christianity into a mixture of church-state, still with us today, passed down through the centuries in the form of the ROMAN Catholic Church, with paganism and idol worship.

I submit all the different materials symbolized in the colossus represent global empires (nations), including the clay as an independent empire associated with and mixed with the iron.

Clay is mainly an impure metal composed of iron oxide and silvery aluminum. The clay mixed with iron represents the final Gentile world empire to be dashed to pieces and blown away as chaff, in my fallible opinion.

 

[Charlie744]

3 hours ago, Diaste said:

Since the gold, silver and bronze are known empires that replaced one another, I have to stay within that theme and consider the Iron replaced the bronze and the clay and iron mixed is a weaker iteration of the pure iron. 

I don't see the justification in evidence to move from what is a clear succession of empires to a captivity. I have to reject this interpretation. 

Yeah, but that's not really different, is it? Crushed, shattered, broken in pieces, all the same thing, they are no more. 

The mistake here is thinking the crushing of the feet is the only effect of the striking of the stone. When the feet are 'broken in pieces' then the whole statue is shattered. This is about the entire statue, not just the feet. 
"It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay, and crushed them. 35Then the iron, clay, bronze, silver, and gold were shattered"

All destroyed together, at the same time. 

Not according to scripture:

"It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay, and crushed them. 35Then the iron, clay, bronze, silver, and gold were shattered"

 

 

Even if that were true, it's not, but if it was, it's not proof of any time stamp for any other prophecy. It's like saying a front end loader is equivalent to a car because both have 4 wheels. There are many other consideration that make them very different. 

I think this is where it's all thrown into doubt. The legs of iron and the feet of iron and clay are not Rome. 

Rome did not replace Greece. The Diadochi did, which is clear from Dan 8 and 11

 

That's not correct. The direct result of the stone striking the feet of iron and clay is;

"It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay, and crushed them. 35Then the iron, clay, bronze, silver, and gold were shattered"

It's not a release of anything from the feet and the feet alone, the entire structure is destroyed. 

 

Okay, nice talking with you, Charlie 

[tatwo]

Greetings all

I have resisted this conversation for a time…and only now…being inspired by you…my brothers who are pressing into the Spirit of understanding…will I engage.

Overall…I am not of the opinion that this conversation is of much importance as it has played out here in this forum. I say that because it seems to me that there are things that have been mentioned that are given vastly more importance than is reasonable…while that which plays a major part has been relegated to a limited portion. This in my mind…is producing an incomplete or unclear outcome…a sort of “hiding the mystery revealed” which was not the point of the subject if I am correct? Man does this consistently to build their pride…I see it as something like turning the wine into water.

Charlie you mention the following a few times in this forum…”The stone strikes the feet only, not the toes, and breaks apart the iron and the clay.” I think this is a significant overreach bro…which leads you on a trail that regardless of how much time in reading and study I put forth…I find it’s a trail not worth walking…likely a dead end.

Verse 42 literally says “as the toes of the feet” the “toes are on the feet” that are said to be crushed. In the application of what’s common…if a “stone” capable of “crushing the feet” is thrust upon the “feet”…how you think it not likely to have crushed the “toes” is beyond me…it seems that you are reading that into the picture Daniel has painted here.

I understand that for you…my “common” approach is a reality that does not fit your structure…or the path you are pioneering here…which from what I can see…will not bring you the light you need…to go where you need to go…with any of this. Additionally you have not convinced me as of yet…that any of this has import in the age we now are living.

 Again…another statement you make a number of times and is related to your “toes” thinking is “He came as a suffering servant, not to destroy, but to divide.” Divide…yes…however the effect of His dividing is…He separates from Himself…that which is to be destroyed…Charlie.

Surly you are aware of several mentions of “God the Father/Yahshua the Son” having come to destroy…right? There is the destruction of the wisdom and understanding of the unrighteous…the destruction of anyone who defiles the temple of God…the destruction of him who had the power of death…to destroy those who destroy the earth…

And probably more to the point…”for this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil.” Clearly He came to separate and destroy Charlie.

I think your understanding of the eternal is lacking here Charlie…when the thing that God has created for His purposes has fulfilled His purposes it can be and will be done away with…utterly.

I am referring to all that is in the created heavens and earth and creation itself…this includes humanity…one must realize that the only value God has for humanity is when men are reconciled to Him and His purpose...all else is destroyed friend.

You need light as to both God’s final judgment of “Israel” and the truth about who Christ is Charlie…I discern that you do not see Him as He is…more on that…next time.

Tatwo…

[tatwo]

 Ok so this is in part my own exegesis coupled in part with a “sort” of response to what I have read from you…of these verses.

“You, O king, were watching; and behold, a great image! This great image, whose splendor was excellent, stood before you; and its form was awesome.  (32)  This image's head was of fine gold, its chest and arms of silver, its belly and thighs of bronze,  (33)  its legs of iron, its feet partly of iron and partly of clay.” Dan 2:31-33 NKJV

The vision of a statue…awesome…and then its description…I am sure the toes were included here.

 “You watched while a stone was cut out without hands, which struck the image on its feet of iron and clay, and broke them in pieces.” Dan 2:34 NKJV 

While Nebuchadnezzar was “watching” in the dream…he saw the “Stone – Rock – kingdom of God…cut out” separated…divided…”without hands”…in other words by the Spirit of God…from the “mountain”…2:45

It is very likely that we are being presented with the revealing of the separating of the two covenants here. The reference to “without hands” is a direct reference to the seed of the Father…Spirit…in regards to the conception of the Lord Yahshua Christ…without doubt.

A firm understanding of what is in view for the term “mountain”…is helpful…the question to be asked is…from what “mountain” is this “stone” being cut? It is perhaps portraying the rejection of Christ Yahshua by Israel…and Gods kingdom emerges as a result…and as such I am going to suggest that it appears to be in reference to “Mount Sinai”…here is my reasoning.

Paul tells us in Galatians 4:24b - 25 [Emphasis mine]…”For these are the two covenants: the one from Mount Sinai which gives birth to bondage, [Ishmael] which is Hagar— (25) for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children” [likening Jerusalem/Israel to the slave Hagar and her slave son Ishmael…yet in Paul’s day]

What I am suggesting here…simply put is…the “mountain” specified in Daniel 2:45…from which the “stone” of Daniel 2:34 was “cut out…without hands”…is…in the days of the fulfillment of “this prophecy”…which was occurring during the days of Paul…[early/mid first century]…”Mount Sinai.”

Which is likely why we see the corresponding reference to the “Jerusalem which now is”…at that time. Meaning in the days of “this prophecies” fulfillment…it looks to be presenting us with the separation or dividing of the two Covenants at that time…which we know is a fact.

Jerusalem being the “centerpiece” of Israel…makes Israel the “mountain” as in “Mt Sinai” from which the “stone – kingdom of God” was “cut”…separated from…”without hands”…which speaks of the work of the Spirit of God.

This looks like the separation of Christ (Spirit) and Israel (Natural) to me…the fulfillment of the “Old Covenant” and the implementation of the “New Covenant” in the Lord Yahshua’s’ blood and Spirit. The kingdom of God on the earth goes from “natural nation and people…Israel only”…to the initiating of the ”spiritual nation and people…every tribe, tongue, people and nation…in the kingdom of God or in Christ”…which as we know only increases from there.

The scourge and subsequent crucifixion of our Lord was never to be seen as a defeat…but rather an initiating victory in that…it brought the outpouring of the Holy Spirit upon humanity…and from that came the initial emergence on the earth of the “Body of Christ…and the kingdom of God” which will one day be the only kingdom left as Nebuchadnezzar and Daniel “saw.” 

This is something that if understood by the god behind or inspiring those “dark kingdoms”…the ones represented in that “statue”…would have caused him to refrain from crucifying the Lord of glory as we are told.

A Further thought in this line of thinking is…the “without hands” reference…which is reminiscent of the fact that God dwells only in a temple made “without hands”…and the separation or removal of the body of the sin by a “circumcision” made “without hands”…both of these indicating references to the unilateral work of the Spirit of God.

This stone then…strikes the feet of this “image”…breaking them in pieces. Simply put…the Lord Yahshua Christ brings “His Spirit kingdom into creation in Himself”…and initiates the process of His ever expanding kingdom in the heavens and on the earth…thereby initiating the destruction of the “natural, fleshly, carnal” kingdoms of Satan and man…including Israel which is in bondage with her slave children.

End part 1

[tatwo]

Part 2

“You watched while a stone was cut out without hands, which struck the image on its feet of iron and clay, and broke them in pieces. Then the iron, the clay, the bronze, the silver, and the gold were crushed together, and became like chaff from the summer threshing floors; the wind carried them away so that no trace of them was found. And the stone that struck the image became a great mountain and filled the whole earth.” (Dan 2:34-35 NKJV)

I see a process if you will…that begins with a “mountain” in which a “stone” is cut out of (vs.45) so it is a “rock” that at one time was…a “part” of an existing “mountain”…and then after the “cutting out” from the “mountain” is complete…a kingdom…now being totally “separated” from the original “mountain”…it is then hurled at the statue…a kingdom…hitting it precisely at its feet…breaking them in pieces.

Of course vs. 35 is pointing to the “ultimate and final” outcome of the stone [the kingdom of God] that hits the feet of the statue [the kingdom of Satan] where the statue is ultimately obliterated.

This is a picture of the utter vanquishing of darkness…from which emerges the rule of Christ in creation…which now in itself has become a “great mountain”…Mount Zion. I would suggest…this a process over time…as I stated earlier…in view.

The “stone” which struck the feet of the statue thereby crushing “them to dust” and then emerging victorious…all occurs over a time frame, from…well…Daniel and Nebuchadnezzar’s day…rolling out until the Lord Yahshua steps out behind the veil and crushes everything evil but the devil…whom gets locked up for a spell.  

Charlie…the concept of the “stone” which is cut out without hands coming from “one mountain”…then proceeds to grow into a “second mountain” and that one becomes a “great mountain” that fills the whole earth…figures into this scenario maybe more than you have accounted for…I would suggest.

Moving on…"You continued looking until a stone was cut out without hands, and it struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay and crushed them.” (Dan 2:34 NASB)

The actual wording there is more along the lines of “crushing, smashing, pulverizing” those feet into dust Charlie…don’t you think it is an unnecessary stretch to see this as a “separating”…like the “iron” is over there and the “clay” is over here…neatly separated…if that is what you are saying? It does not appear that this is the language used there.

Here is why I am suggesting this…the word “crushed, broke…break into pieces” used in Daniel 2:34 and in Daniel typically I might add…is the Hebrew word…H1855 “deqaq” denoting “to be shattered…fall to pieces…crush.” It is also referenced by its root word H1854 “daqaq” which means to “crush…pulverize…ground to powder…to make very fine.”

An example of this idea is found in Exodus 32:20 where Moses “ground the molten or golden calf to powder.” The same can be seen in Deuteronomy 9:21…”grinding it very small until it was as fine as dust.”

The “Separating or dividing” of the iron and clay verses the “pulverizing or powderizing” of the same…does not seem to relay the integrity of the passage in vs. 34 and it seems that a more accurate definition…is similar to the one found in vs. 35 which actually references that which is being entirely reduced to the place where it can at some point be carried away by the wind…

The “feet” which commonly includes the “toes” as I see it…are both a stabilizer and transport mechanism…for this “image.”  It makes sense that the Lord targets this “image…statue…beast” at its point of stability and transport…think “tackle”…in football. In His successful disabling of this image in some fashion…or perhaps better said the “power” that this dark kingdom wields, ability to continue as it has…He has forced Satan’s kingdom to have to take an alternative route to maintain and continue on…which it will.

So no…I do not agree that vs. 34 is a mere “separating of iron and clay”…I see it as a “grinding to a fine dust or powder” like it says…presenting us with what begins as an attack upon the power of Satan culminating ultimately in an utterly devastating destruction upon the image or better stated…the plan of the devil. That “stone” took the devils ultimate power and authority…forcefully and without question…remember?

End of part 2