Why does Iran hate Jewish Israel?

[Luther]

1 hour ago, Keras said:

Earnestly compare?  The Prophesies about the Day of the Lords wrath and the glorious Day of Jesus Return, are as different as chalk and cheese. 

Two Days of the Lord:

1 Thessalonians 4:16  When the Command is given, when the Archangels voice is heard, when God’s Trumpet sounds, then the Lord Himself will descend from heaven...

This prophesies the glorious Return of Jesus to gather His faithful Christian peoples to where He is; in Jerusalem.  Matthew 24:30-31, 1 Thessalonians 4:17

 

1 Thessalonians 5:1-3 About dates and times, my friends, there is no need to write to you. For you know perfectly well that the Day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night.

While other people are saying: Now we have peace and safety, then; sudden destruction will come upon them.... and there will be no escape.

 

Are these prophesies talking about the same event?  

The Book of Revelation is where we can find a sequence of the end times events.

In Revelation 6:12-17, the terrible Day of the Lord’s vengeance and wrath, by fire, storms, earthquakes and tsunamis is described, plus over 100 other prophesies also describe this Day of vengeance, His fury and anger against the nations.  The Lord is not seen on this Day. Psalms 11:4-6, Habakkuk 3:4          BEFORE the Return!

 

The Day of the Lord’s fiery wrath, as the Son of Man, is the sudden, shocking and unexpected Day, a world changer, which will set the stage for the establishment of a One World Govt. Daniel 7:23-27, Revelation 13:1-8

The faithful Christian peoples, will pass safely through this literal Day of worldwide disaster. We are told what to do: Call upon the Name of the Lord and you will be saved. Joel 2:32, Acts 2:21, Romans 10:13

 

The Day of the Lord’s glorious Return; As the King of Kings and Lord of Lords. Much has to happen before we get to Revelation 19:11-13, where Jesus is described as coming in garments already splashed in blood.  Got from His previous Day of  vengeance and wrath. Isaiah 63:1-6 and Revelation 14:17-20

It will NOT be unexpected; heralded by God and the angels and NOT a surprise, as He will Return exactly 1260 days, [42 months] after Satan desecrates the Temple. Daniel 9:27b, Revelation 13:5

Jesus destroys the attacking armies at Armageddon by the Sword of His Word and chains up Satan. He just separates the nations at this time. Matthew 25:31-33

Jesus then commences His thousand year earthly reign, on David’s Throne, in the new Temple in Jerusalem.  As Isaiah 65:18-25, Zechariah 14:16-21 describe. 

 Conclusion: 1 Thess 4:16 and 1 Thess 5:1-3 are about 2 separate Days, several years apart.  Paul; like the other Prophets, doesn’t write them into their correct sequence.

The final Judgment happens after the Millennium. Matthew 25:46, Revelation 20:11-15   Then comes Eternity      These facts prove that there is a gap of a thousand years between 1 Corinthians 15:23 and verse 24           

 

2 Peter 3:12-13

Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

[13]Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Bro I believe in less than ten years we will see Jesus Christ coming in great power and glory with His mighty angels in flaming fire cleansing the earth as it is made new. 

Joel 2:1-3,11

Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the LORD cometh, for it is nigh at hand;

[2]A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, even to the years of many generations.

[3]A fire devoureth before them; and behind them a flame burneth: the land is as the garden of Eden before them, and behind them a desolate wilderness; yea, and nothing shall escape them.

[11]And the LORD shall utter his voice before his army: for his camp is very great: for he is strong that executeth his word: for the day of the LORD is great and very terrible; and who can abide it?

We who are "alive and remain" will be changed into our heavenly bodies and will be able to "abide it", the flames will not harm us..... sounds familiar.....

Daniel 3:25

He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

A preview of things to come? 

Zechariah 13:9

And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.

2 Peter 3:7

But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

Joel 1:15,19-20

Alas for the day! for the day of the LORD is at hand, and as a destruction from the Almighty shall it come.

[19]O LORD, to thee will I cry: for the fire hath devoured the pastures of the wilderness, and the flame hath burned all the trees of the field.

[20]The beasts of the field cry also unto thee: for the rivers of waters are dried up, and the fire hath devoured the pastures of the wilderness.

Malachi 4:1-3

For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.

[2]But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.

[3]And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the LORD of hosts.

ASHES UNDER THE SOLES OF YOUR FEET...We will be here in that great day. 

[Keras]

1 hour ago, Luther said:

ASHES UNDER THE SOLES OF YOUR FEET...We will be here in that great day.

Yes; we will all experience the great Day of the Lords vengeance and fiery wrath, The next Prophesied event, soon to happen, which will set the scene for all the end times events. 

We will, God willing, in our mortal life; also be alive to see the Lord Jesus Return, several years later. 

The forthcoming Day of fiery wrath, will be triggered by Iran attempting to nuke Israel. Psalms 7:12-16, Jeremiah 40:35-37, describes what will happen perfectly. 

[Luther]

9 hours ago, Keras said:

Yes; we will all experience the great Day of the Lords vengeance and fiery wrath, The next Prophesied event, soon to happen, which will set the scene for all the end times events. 

We will, God willing, in our mortal life; also be alive to see the Lord Jesus Return, several years later. 

The forthcoming Day of fiery wrath, will be triggered by Iran attempting to nuke Israel. Psalms 7:12-16, Jeremiah 40:35-37, describes what will happen perfectly. 

That's a curious stance you take with fiery wrath and destruction not being the end of all things, to be honest. 

I believe that we know everything about Iran's ability to make and currently possess nuclear weapons. Our technology is too advanced not to know. They're always " two weeks away" from having a nuclear warhead. Most likely Trump will negotiate with them, a no d I think there will be stability. 

[tatwo]

You are welcome @Luther...

Much of what you and Keras are discussing does not take into account the understanding and intention that God had in mind prior to installing creation within Himself.

For example…if one picks the prophecies of ancient Israel as a starting point for God’s plan…a fair amount of “prior” background understanding is neglected. So the picture is incomplete at best…while actually presenting a modicum of Truth…it also brings in a measure of deception as I see it.

Serving as another example that I have come across many times in these discussions…if one tries to understand God’s plan for creation starting at the cross…obviously that work will contain only a “partial truth” of the “Big picture” as well. Thus “limiting” or even “blocking” ones access to a more complete understanding of the Truth that has been revealed and is available.

This leads to a blindness concerning the "continual revealing of mysteries" that have been hidden in God for long ages past...which…are slated to come forth as the age proceeds to its summation…again leading to deception.

It seems like that describes the constant disconnect between you two…both of you are only dealing with “partial truth” at best as I see it. I leave Keras to his own…he seems happiest there…I will scan his posts concerning subject matter that is pertinent to me…as I encounter it…however…typically I am reminded of a blindness that he is unwilling to address.

Paul gives instruction on how to go about interacting with people who are in this place…so that’s how I generally approach folks in that place. With the understanding of the ongoing nature of prophetic revelation...one must be open to receive this revelation from the Holy Spirit and from gifted family mambers?

Tatwo...:)

[tatwo]

19 hours ago, Luther said:

Thank you. Keras has a highly detailed website that requires time to look into, but from what I have seen, many verses that he would group into different events occurring at different times, in actuality ( and historically), have been understood to occur at one time, the last day of the world. 

The phrases "The coming of the Lord", "The day of the Lord", " The coming of the day of God" and so on, refer to the same time. Many people like to give these different phrases different  "dispensations" if you will, and the Bible won't allow it if you earnestly compare scripture with scripture. 

1 Corinthians is a great example of this. 

1 Corinthians 15:23-24,26

But every man in his own order: Christ the first fruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

The above verse is used to illustrate that the "rapture " occurs  before the very end of the world, (after 1000 years of course). But look at the next verse:

[24]Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

" Then cometh the end"....the end of the world. Then to be sure it's the last day in view, a few verses later:

(V.26) The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

We know that in Revelation 20:14:

"....death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death."

Mostly everyone agrees that the very very end of the world ( after the 1000 years of course) death is destroyed at God's final judgment. 

So how can there be enormous time intervals?

Great question...here is an option for you…Luther…perhaps...there are a few angles to approach this question...here is one.

 1^st Corinthians 15:23-26…“(23)  But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ's at His coming,  (24)  then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power. (25)  For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet. (26)  The last enemy that will be abolished is death.”

In the previous verses 20-22 we see that as Yahshua was raised…and that the dead and the living in Christ “will” also be raised.

Now getting into the verses you are inquiring about [23-26] I’ll show you what I see.

The "timing" of this…to some degree…is set for us by Paul’s choice of the word “when” in verse 24…”when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.”

It would seem to me…that there “may” be a “period of time” between…the resurrection of those in “Christ – His Body” at His return at the end of this age…and ”when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.” It is plausible…which I think might be exemplified by his next statement…

 “(25) For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet.” 

The “when” from verse 24 picks up some definition here in verse 25 from the word “until”… “For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet.” I see the simple inclusion of a “time duration” of the “when” in that verse…as I discern the word… "until.”

So from the time of the Lords return in which He gathers His own…to the time in which He puts all His enemies under His feet…including the last enemy “death”…which Paul mentions in verse 26. There really should be no doubt that this clearly leaves room…for understanding that there is indeed a measured or measurable “time interval”…as mentioned here by Paul.

I do not see a suggested length or duration of the “time frame” here in these passages…only that there “is” a duration of time…”when and until”…which begins…after the Lord pulls the Body together from the living and the dead and the abolishing of death.

We can see that there is some “period of conflict” that requires “Christ” to rule and reign over His enemies “until” He finally abolishes the “last” one…death.

“Christ” as I have depicted it here is “Head and Body” in a perfect choreography…utterly destroying the enemies of God over a period of time…as recorded in the text...ending with the destruction of the last enemy...death.

What do you think here Luther?

Tatwo...:)

[Keras]

7 hours ago, Luther said:

That's a curious stance you take with fiery wrath and destruction not being the end of all things, to be honest. 

I believe that we know everything about Iran's ability to make and currently possess nuclear weapons. Our technology is too advanced not to know. They're always " two weeks away" from having a nuclear warhead. Most likely Trump will negotiate with them, a no d I think there will be stability. 

You are extremely optimistic to think stability can be achieved in the present situation. But yes: Paul does say there will be a time when people will say: All is peaceful, all secure, 1 Thess 5:3; THEN sudden destruction is upon them ....and there will be no escape. 

It is just 'head in the sand', to think Iran does not yet have nukes. They actually bought at least one nuke from the Ukraine. Now they have the rockets to reach Israel and the desperation to attempt to do what they openly say they will. 

Careful study of the 100+ Prophesies about the forthcoming Day the Lord sends His fiery wrath, makes it clear it is mainly directed onto the Middle East region. That area will be cleared and cleansed, Deut 32:43, Zephaniah 1:14-18, 2:4-7, Psalms 83

The rest of the world will be badly affected, loss of our modern infrastructure, etc, but will carry on and in order to regain stability; will establish a One World Govt. 

[Luther]

5 hours ago, tatwo said:

Great question...here is an option for you…Luther…perhaps...there are a few angles to approach this question...here is one.

 1^st Corinthians 15:23-26…“(23)  But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ's at His coming,  (24)  then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power. (25)  For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet. (26)  The last enemy that will be abolished is death.”

In the previous verses 20-22 we see that as Yahshua was raised…and that the dead and the living in Christ “will” also be raised.

Now getting into the verses you are inquiring about [23-26] I’ll show you what I see.

The "timing" of this…to some degree…is set for us by Paul’s choice of the word “when” in verse 24…”when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.”

It would seem to me…that there “may” be a “period of time” between…the resurrection of those in “Christ – His Body” at His return at the end of this age…and ”when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.” It is plausible…which I think might be exemplified by his next statement…

 “(25) For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet.” 

The “when” from verse 24 picks up some definition here in verse 25 from the word “until”… “For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet.” I see the simple inclusion of a “time duration” of the “when” in that verse…as I discern the word… "until.”

So from the time of the Lords return in which He gathers His own…to the time in which He puts all His enemies under His feet…including the last enemy “death”…which Paul mentions in verse 26. There really should be no doubt that this clearly leaves room…for understanding that there is indeed a measured or measurable “time interval”…as mentioned here by Paul.

I do not see a suggested length or duration of the “time frame” here in these passages…only that there “is” a duration of time…”when and until”…which begins…after the Lord pulls the Body together from the living and the dead and the abolishing of death.

We can see that there is some “period of conflict” that requires “Christ” to rule and reign over His enemies “until” He finally abolishes the “last” one…death.

“Christ” as I have depicted it here is “Head and Body” in a perfect choreography…utterly destroying the enemies of God over a period of time…as recorded in the text...ending with the destruction of the last enemy...death.

What do you think here Luther?

Tatwo...:)

First thing I would do is question the time frame of when " he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet" in v.25: 

" He must reign" is NOW. We know that Christ is with us, " unto the end of the world " ( Mt.28:20). 

" If we suffer, we shall also reign with him..."( 2 Tim. 2:12)

We reign with Christ as " Kings and priests" on earth ( Rev.5:10, 20:6). 

Christ is head of the church, currently "putting all things under his feet" ( in other words all things are subject unto him):

"And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,"(Ephesians 1:22).

So Christ reigns now, in his kingdom of believers on earth, having all things subject unto him. 

However, the last thing, principality or  enemy to put under him (or destroy) is death. 

1 Corinthians 15:26

The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

So when did Jesus do this?

For all whom he came to save, he abolished death on their behalf (2 Timothy 1:10), even before the world began, as a "Lamb slain from the foundation of the world" (Revelation 13:8). 

But the sin and death that corrupts this world will be destroyed at His coming. 

Revelation 20:11,14

And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

[14]And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

The " great white throne judgment " is when Christ comes in the last day to judge the living and the dead:

1 Corinthians 15:24

Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

****Death is destroyed 

****The Kingdom is delivered up ( the children of the kingdom, to New Jerusalem, heaven)

****"New Heavens and a New Earth 

****All things are made new

AMEN. 

 

[Luther]

6 hours ago, Keras said:

You are extremely optimistic to think stability can be achieved in the present situation. But yes: Paul does say there will be a time when people will say: All is peaceful, all secure, 1 Thess 5:3; THEN sudden destruction is upon them ....and there will be no escape. 

It is just 'head in the sand', to think Iran does not yet have nukes. They actually bought at least one nuke from the Ukraine. Now they have the rockets to reach Israel and the desperation to attempt to do what they openly say they will. 

Careful study of the 100+ Prophesies about the forthcoming Day the Lord sends His fiery wrath, makes it clear it is mainly directed onto the Middle East region. That area will be cleared and cleansed, Deut 32:43, Zephaniah 1:14-18, 2:4-7, Psalms 83

The rest of the world will be badly affected, loss of our modern infrastructure, etc, but will carry on and in order to regain stability; will establish a One World Govt. 

When I read about the fiery wrath of God, it encompasses everything. I think 2 Peter 3:10 is an outstanding example ( I guess that's why I always go to it):

2 Peter 3:10

But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

In similar language:

Isaiah 13:6-11

[6]Howl ye; for the day of the LORD is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.

[7]Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt:

[8]And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth: they shall be amazed one at another; their faces shall be as flames.

[9]Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

[10]For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

[11]And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

Notice v.11.....I will punish the WORLD. 

Zephaniah 3:8

Therefore wait ye upon me, saith the LORD, until the day that I rise up to the prey: for my determination is to gather the nations, that I may assemble the kingdoms, to pour upon them mine indignation, even all my fierce anger: for all the earth shall be devoured with the fire of my jealousy.

ALL THE EARTH.....FIRE.

God the Holy Spirit moved these men to write in a particular fashion. If it was all the same, there would be no bickering (LOL) but seriously the same event can be spoken of with different nuances. 

[Keras]

44 minutes ago, Luther said:

When I read about the fiery wrath of God, it encompasses everything. I think 2 Peter 3:10 is an outstanding example

2 Peter 3:10-11 is a Prophecy about the final Judgment, after the Millennium. Rev 20:9 & Rev 21:1

The rest of your quotes refer to the Day of the Lords wrath, the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster. None of them say it will be the final end of the world. 

[Keras]

1 hour ago, Luther said:

But the sin and death that corrupts this world will be destroyed at His coming. 

Revelation 20:11,14

You cannot just gloss over the Words of Revelation 20, saying 6 times about the thousand years between the glorious Return of King Jesus and the final Judgment of God.

Only in the new heavens and earth, will Death be no more. Revelation 21:4