Justice at the judgement

[farouk]

31 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Not true.  Evidence is necessary to demonstrate one's faith.  That is what 2:18 is about.

Do you recognize the sujunctive mood in that verse?  iow, not all believers do what it says.  But all are SUPPOSED to.  Or OUGHT to.

The evidence is first and foremost Godward.

[Mr. M]

14 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Really?  Are you not aware of the state of "spiritual death"??  Paul clearly mentioned it in Eph 2.

Where is the term "spiritually dead" found in this passage?

Ephesians 2:1 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins, 2 in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience, 3 among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others.

4 But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

When you use the term "spiritually dead", all that means is that our spirit is unable to receive from God's Spirit. When Jesus said "you must be born again" the Greek is literally "from above".  There is nothing wrong with the explanation I have thoroughly provided. What was lost in the garden is restored in "the mind of Christ". The human spirit was not dead, it simply could not receive "from above". Dead to God? Sure. Mind, heart, spirit.

Again, that is a doctrine of man based on what you have said, "on that day" meant that something had to die, but that is an interpretation. As I have explained, it means that on the day you eat, you will surely die, there is no recourse. They did not have to die immediately, and an insistence to explain why they did not die on the spot.

God continued to communicate with Adam and Eve, and spoke to Cain, Noah, Abraham, even Abimelech. God is Spirit must be "spiritually discerned". Noah and Abraham were blameless, free of idols, and able to receive.

Man clearly continued to have a functioning spirit.

Psalm 77:6 I call to remembrance my song in the night;
I meditate within my heart,
And my spirit makes diligent search.

Isaiah 26:9 With my soul I have desired You in the night,
Yes, by my spirit within me I will seek You early;
For when Your judgments are in the earth,
The inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness.

Job 7:11 Therefore I will not restrain my mouth;
I will speak in the anguish of my spirit;
I will complain in the bitterness of my soul.

Why don't you come right out and tell me what I don't know. If you have a question and I don't seem to have an answer that satisfies you, share it. I don't know what you are looking for, how's that . But don't say that I refuse to answer, for I have given my understanding. If it is wrong, prove it, I will gladly stand corrected to end this run around you have been putting me through. 

[FreeGrace]

11 minutes ago, farouk said:

FreeGrace said:

Not true.  Evidence is necessary to demonstrate one's faith.  That is what 2:18 is about.

The evidence is first and foremost Godward.

Regarding James 2:18 - But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works. Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works."

James is referring to demonstrating their faith to others.  

Regarding God, He doesn't need to see evidence.  He is omniscient and already knows everything.  

But man must see evidence in order to see one's faith.  

Claiming faith doesn't demonstrate the faith.  Demonstrating one's faith is the issue.

[Mr. M]

7 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Regarding James 2:18 - But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works. Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works."

James is referring to demonstrating their faith to others.  

Regarding God, He doesn't need to see evidence.  He is omniscient and already knows everything.  

But man must see evidence in order to see one's faith.  

Claiming faith doesn't demonstrate the faith.  Demonstrating one's faith is the issue.

Faith is tested and proven genuine before salvation is confirmed.

For many, an inconvenient truth.

 

1 Peter 1:

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant mercy has begotten us again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

4 to an inheritance incorruptible and undefiled and that does not fade away, reserved in heaven for you, 

5 who are kept by the power of God through faith for salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

6 In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials, 

7 that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ, 

8 whom having not seen you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory, 

9 receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls.

 

Edited June 11, 2024 by Mr. M

[FreeGrace]

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

FreeGrace said:

Really?  Are you not aware of the state of "spiritual death"??  Paul clearly mentioned it in Eph 2.

Where is the term "spiritually dead" found in this passage?

Ephesians 2:1 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins, 2 in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience, 3 among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others.

I put the words in GREEN.  I already explained it, so your question is quite odd.

Now, tell me what has been "made alive" in v.5 - even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved—

What, specifically, 'has been 'made alive'?  Can you explain?

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

4 But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

When you use the term "spiritually dead", all that means is that our spirit is unable to receive from God's Spirit.

Why would that be?  DEAD is why.  All you provide is opinion.  You don't recognize the reason WHY our spirit is unable to receive from God's Spirit.  Because it is DEAD  DEAD DEAD as a doornail.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

When Jesus said "you must be born again" the Greek is literally "from above".  There is nothing wrong with the explanation I have thoroughly provided.

None of your replies are thorough.  All are just vague comments and opinions.  I've given you specific words that are logical.  And you STILL haven't explained what specifically DIED "on the day" that Adam ate the fruit.  It seems you don't really know.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

What was lost in the garden is restored in "the mind of Christ".

That is a vague statement.  What do you mean?  1 Cor 2:16 is a referenc to the WRITTEN WORD, which is the "mind of Christ".  So your statement doesn't make sense.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

The human spirit was not dead, it simply could not receive "from above". 

This is just an opinion, without any support from Scripture.  The REASON the human spirit cannot receive "from above" is simple; Adam's spirit DIED "on the day he ate the fruit.  So it can't receive from above.  This is quite simple and logical.

But you can't explain what DIED "on the day" Adam ate the fruit.

And man needs to be "born again".  So what gets born AGAIN?  The human spirit, at which time it IS ABLE to "receive from above".  Because it is alive AGAIN. RE-born.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

Dead to God? Sure. Mind, heart, spirit.

Dead period.  As the Bible says.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

Again, that is a doctrine of man based on what you have said, "on that day" meant that something had to die, but that is an interpretation.

So you're going to hide behind that old saw about "interpretation".  One can use that tired excuse for disagreeing with EVERYONE.  

Look, the warning to Adam is CLEAR;  on the day that he eats the fruit, he "will surely DIE".  So something DID die that day.  But you can't explain what died and it seems you are arguing that nothing actually did die.

That is the same as NOT believing what the Bible says.  No interpretation is necessary here.  Something literally died and you can't explain it.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

As I have explained, it means that on the day you eat, you will surely die, there is no recourse.

The Bible says nothing about "resource".  It simply says "dying, you shall surely DIE".  

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

They did not have to die immediately,

Now you're just waffling.  Something DIED "the VERY DAY" that Adam ate the fruit.  Are you really denying that FACT?  The Bible says so plainly.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

and an insistence to explain why they did not die on the spot.

Nonsense.  The Bible SAYS they "surely died" on the day they ate the fruit.  And Romans 5 backs all that up.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

God continued to communicate with Adam and Eve, and spoke to Cain, Noah, Abraham, even Abimelech.

Hold on.  Let's just stick with Adam, the first human, who had the warning.  Note that God never warned another human being about that kind of death.  

I'm glad you noticed that God "continued to communicate with A&E.  But also notice that when the Lord appeared that evening, they hid.  Demonstrating their inability to initiate any communication with God.  Yes, they could respond, but they hid due to their DEAD human spirit.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

God is Spirit must be "spiritually discerned". Noah and Abraham were blameless, free of idols, and able to receive.

Do you know why?  They believed the promise first given to A&E in Gen 3:15 - I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heel.”

Maybe you aren't aware, but this verse is the promise of Messiah.  Those who place their faith in the Messiah are RE-generated, RE-born, made alive.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

Man clearly continued to have a functioning spirit.

And I just explained, logically, WHY those men did.  But Paul told the Ephesians that they were "dead in sins" before they believed in Christ.

And you don't even know what was "dead".

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

Psalm 77:6 I call to remembrance my song in the night;
I meditate within my heart,
And my spirit makes diligent search.

And Paul differentiated between the "mind" and "spirit" in 2 Cor 14:14 - For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful.

This verse proves the difference between the mind and spirit.  They aren't the same.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

Why don't you come right out and tell me what I don't know.

That's what I've been doing.  

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

If you have a question and I don't seem to have an answer that satisfies you, share it.

That's what I've been doing.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

I don't know what you are looking for, how's that .(Gen 3:151).

The Trinity made man in their image.  That refers to 3 parts.  Man was created with body, soul and spirit.  3 separate parts, just as 1 Thess 5:23 states, and Heb 4:12 differentiates.

When Adam ate the fruit, his human spirit died (quit functioning).  He needed to be born again, which occurred when he believed the promise of the Messiah (Gen 3:15).

Jesus told the woman at the well in John 4:24 one must worship God 'in spirit (human) and in truth'.  This is why man needs to be born again.  His dead human spirit needs to be RE-born, RE-generated, made alive, all biblical words.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

But don't say that I refuse to answer, for I have given my understanding. If it is wrong, prove it

I've given Scriptural evidence for what I believe and it is totally logical.  Even it you've never heard any of this before, it's simple enough to follow and understand.

1 minute ago, Mr. M said:

I will gladly stand corrected to end this run around you have been putting me through. 

Run around?  I have been trying to get you to explain WHAT died "on the day" Adam ate the fruit.  You have consistently ignored my question to you about that.

And I have been explaining all this in my posts.  

If you can show from Scripture that my explanation is refuted, and you have a better explanation of the verses I've used to support my view, please share.

As I posted before, I don't want to be wrong any more than you.

Thanks.

[FreeGrace]

23 minutes ago, Mr. M said:

FreeGrace said:

Regarding James 2:18 - But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works. Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works."

James is referring to demonstrating their faith to others.  

Faith is tested and proven genuine before salvation is confirmed.

For many, an inconvenient truth.

I suppose you have a clear verse that supports this claim?  Salvation is confirmed the MOMENT one believes in the Savior.

John 5:24 - “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life.

The verbs "believe" and "has" are both in the present tense.  That means WHEN a person believes, they POSSESS (has) eternal life.  

This verse refutes your claim.  There is no testing before salvation.  If you think there is any verse that says so clearly, it should be obvious that you have misunderstood that verse.  Or prove that John 5:24 doesn't say what I just said it says.

23 minutes ago, Mr. M said:

 

1 Peter 1:

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant mercy has begotten us again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

4 to an inheritance incorruptible and undefiled and that does not fade away, reserved in heaven for you, 

5 who are kept by the power of God through faith for salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

6 In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials, 

When "salvation" is in the future tense, it is always referring to eternity itself, when believers have been given their resurrection bodies.

23 minutes ago, Mr. M said:

7 that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ,

The Greek for "genuineness" is approved.  iow, our faith needs to be approved through testing.  Again, John 5:24 proves that salvation is instantaneous the MOMENT one believes.

23 minutes ago, Mr. M said:

 8 whom having not seen you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory, 

9 receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls.

Again, v.9 refers to eternity.  

[Mr. M]

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

I put the words in GREEN.  I already explained it, so your question is quite odd.

Now, tell me what has been "made alive" in v.5 - even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved—

What, specifically, 'has been 'made alive'?  Can you explain?

Why would that be?  DEAD is why.  All you provide is opinion.  You don't recognize the reason WHY our spirit is unable to receive from God's Spirit.  Because it is DEAD  DEAD DEAD as a doornail.

None of your replies are thorough.  All are just vague comments and opinions.  I've given you specific words that are logical.  And you STILL haven't explained what specifically DIED "on the day" that Adam ate the fruit.  It seems you don't really know.

That is a vague statement.  What do you mean?  1 Cor 2:16 is a referenc to the WRITTEN WORD, which is the "mind of Christ".  So your statement doesn't make sense.

This is just an opinion, without any support from Scripture.  The REASON the human spirit cannot receive "from above" is simple; Adam's spirit DIED "on the day he ate the fruit.  So it can't receive from above.  This is quite simple and logical.

But you can't explain what DIED "on the day" Adam ate the fruit.

And man needs to be "born again".  So what gets born AGAIN?  The human spirit, at which time it IS ABLE to "receive from above".  Because it is alive AGAIN. RE-born.

Dead period.  As the Bible says.

So you're going to hide behind that old saw about "interpretation".  One can use that tired excuse for disagreeing with EVERYONE.  

Look, the warning to Adam is CLEAR;  on the day that he eats the fruit, he "will surely DIE".  So something DID die that day.  But you can't explain what died and it seems you are arguing that nothing actually did die.

That is the same as NOT believing what the Bible says.  No interpretation is necessary here.  Something literally died and you can't explain it.

The Bible says nothing about "resource".  It simply says "dying, you shall surely DIE".  

Now you're just waffling.  Something DIED "the VERY DAY" that Adam ate the fruit.  Are you really denying that FACT?  The Bible says so plainly.

Nonsense.  The Bible SAYS they "surely died" on the day they ate the fruit.  And Romans 5 backs all that up.

Hold on.  Let's just stick with Adam, the first human, who had the warning.  Note that God never warned another human being about that kind of death.  

I'm glad you noticed that God "continued to communicate with A&E.  But also notice that when the Lord appeared that evening, they hid.  Demonstrating their inability to initiate any communication with God.  Yes, they could respond, but they hid due to their DEAD human spirit.

Do you know why?  They believed the promise first given to A&E in Gen 3:15 - I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heel.”

Maybe you aren't aware, but this verse is the promise of Messiah.  Those who place their faith in the Messiah are RE-generated, RE-born, made alive.

And I just explained, logically, WHY those men did.  But Paul told the Ephesians that they were "dead in sins" before they believed in Christ.

And you don't even know what was "dead".

And Paul differentiated between the "mind" and "spirit" in 2 Cor 14:14 - For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful.

This verse proves the difference between the mind and spirit.  They aren't the same.

That's what I've been doing.  

That's what I've been doing.

The Trinity made man in their image.  That refers to 3 parts.  Man was created with body, soul and spirit.  3 separate parts, just as 1 Thess 5:23 states, and Heb 4:12 differentiates.

When Adam ate the fruit, his human spirit died (quit functioning).  He needed to be born again, which occurred when he believed the promise of the Messiah (Gen 3:15).

Jesus told the woman at the well in John 4:24 one must worship God 'in spirit (human) and in truth'.  This is why man needs to be born again.  His dead human spirit needs to be RE-born, RE-generated, made alive, all biblical words.

I've given Scriptural evidence for what I believe and it is totally logical.  Even it you've never heard any of this before, it's simple enough to follow and understand.

Run around?  I have been trying to get you to explain WHAT died "on the day" Adam ate the fruit.  You have consistently ignored my question to you about that.

And I have been explaining all this in my posts.  

If you can show from Scripture that my explanation is refuted, and you have a better explanation of the verses I've used to support my view, please share.

As I posted before, I don't want to be wrong any more than you.

Thanks.

Man's spirit did not die on the day Adam ate,

sin and death entered the world.

Romans 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned

One way or another, death is a process.

James 1:

13 Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He Himself tempt anyone. 

14 But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed. 

15 Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.

Refusing to acknowledge this process leads many to seek an explanation as to why Adam and Eve did not immediately die, and the idea of "spiritual death" was originated.

2 hours ago, Mr. M said:

Man clearly continued to have a functioning spirit.

Psalm 77:6 I call to remembrance my song in the night;
I meditate within my heart,
And my spirit makes diligent search.

Isaiah 26:9 With my soul I have desired You in the night,
Yes, by my spirit within me I will seek You early;
For when Your judgments are in the earth,
The inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness.

Job 7:11 Therefore I will not restrain my mouth;
I will speak in the anguish of my spirit;
I will complain in the bitterness of my soul.

I provided 3 verses showing man continued to have a spirit, you cite one and "clearly and logically" explain away...

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

And Paul differentiated between the "mind" and "spirit" in 2 Cor 14:14 - For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful.

This verse proves the difference between the mind and spirit.  They aren't the same.

Paul and the Corinthians were baptized in the Holy Spirit. Of course their spirit could pray. That does not mean that spirit in these verses "actually means mind".

Similarly, when Paul was cited as saying we must cleanse ourselves of the filth in the flesh and spirit, you replied that he meant 'soul', even as you cite Hebrews to show there is a difference between the two.

You claim to be logical and scriptural, but you are not. Throughout the OT, the scriptures continue to make reference to the spirit of man, yet you insist that it was:

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

it is DEAD  DEAD DEAD as a doornail.

So one more scripture for you to"logically and scripturally" explain away, and then I will leave you to it.

Numbers 14:24 But My servant Caleb, because he has a different spirit in him and has followed Me fully, I will bring into the land where he went, and his descendants shall inherit it.

Caleb's spirit apparently was a different kind of dead.

Or maybe God used the wrong word and meant mind?

[FreeGrace]

1 hour ago, Mr. M said:

Man's spirit did not die on the day Adam ate,

sin and death entered the world.

Yet, you still don't know WHAT died "on the day" he ate the fruit.  That's just swell.

So, on the flipside, what is "made alive", also called "RE-generated" and "born AGAIN"?

Only ONE thing fits both scenarios.  And you deny that.  

1 hour ago, Mr. M said:

Romans 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned

One way or another, death is a process.

According to the Bible, which is my source for truth, the death both A&E experienced "on the day" they ate the fruit was their human spirits.  What is actually a process is physical death through aging.

1 hour ago, Mr. M said:

James 1:

13 Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He Himself tempt anyone. 

14 But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed. 

15 Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.

Note that James was writing to saved Jews.  If one thinks that death is eternal, then no one can be saved since all sin.  They'd be dead at the first sin.

Obviously it can't be physical, because not even Adam dropped when he ate the fruit.

In this text, "death" refers to temporal death, or loss of fellowship with the Lord.

David wrote that if he regards iniquity, the Lord will not hear him (praying).  That is loss of fellowship.  The Lord isn't listening.

1 hour ago, Mr. M said:

Refusing to acknowledge this process leads many to seek an explanation as to why Adam and Eve did not immediately die, and the idea of "spiritual death" was originated.

Because that is the ONLY logical reason.  And it fits perfectly being RE-generated, RE-born or made alive at the moment of faith.

Nothing else fits at all.  But you are just ignoring all the implications.

1 hour ago, Mr. M said:

I provided 3 verses showing man continued to have a spirit, you cite one and "clearly and logically" explain away...

Those verses were describing saved people.  All saved people have been born again.

btw, please describe what being "born again" means.

1 hour ago, Mr. M said:

Paul and the Corinthians were baptized in the Holy Spirit. Of course their spirit could pray. That does not mean that spirit in these verses "actually means mind. 

Of course it doesn't.  And that is my point.  The "mind", also called "heart" is different than the spirit.

1 hour ago, Mr. M said:

Similarly, when Paul was cited as saying we must cleanse ourselves of the filth in the flesh and spirit, you replied that he meant 'soul', even as you cite Hebrews to show there is a difference between the two.

I also explained that in some places in the Bible, soul and spirit are synonymous.

1 hour ago, Mr. M said:

You claim to be logical and scriptural, but you are not.

Oh, THAT is rich!!  lol  You're the one who can't describe WHAT died "on the day" A&E ate the fruit, nor can you describe WHAT is made alive, RE-generated or born AGAIN at faith.  So don't tell me what I'm not.

You have no idea what died and what is reborn, yet I've shown you the verses where these words are used, and you remain clueless.  

How logical is THAT?

1 hour ago, Mr. M said:

Numbers 14:24 But My servant Caleb, because he has a different spirit in him and has followed Me fully, I will bring into the land where he went, and his descendants shall inherit it.

Does this verse have any real meaning to you?  What is a "different spirit"?

1 hour ago, Mr. M said:

Caleb's spirit apparently was a different kind of dead.

Or maybe God used the wrong word and meant mind?

Why ask about death when the verse doesn't?  Why try to move the goal posts?

Let's just face the fact that even though Adam DID DIE "on the day" he ate the fruit, AND at the moment of faith one is born AGAIN, or RE-generated or made alive, you just don't want to accept what IS totally logical.

What isn't logical is to have NO IDEA what DIED "on the day" Adam ate the fruit, or what is made alive, RE-generated or born AGAIN at the moment of faith.

Totally illogical to have NO explanation for those words, which mean things.  But not to you, apparently.

[Charlie1988]

18 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

His Lord answered and said, thou wicked and lazy servant, you knew that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed... take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which has the ten talents. ...

AND CAST YE THE UNPROFITABLE SERVANT INTO OUTER DARKNESS:
THERE SHALL BE WEEPING AND GNASHING OF TEETH.

Matthew 25:26 - 30

Knowing therefore the TERROR of the Lord we persuade men....
2 Corinthians 5:11

Yes the wicked and lazy servant was judged according to his works and cast into the outer darkness. But the other two received different rewards according to their works. 

Knowing the terror of the Lord, should serve to keep all believers from willful sin. Believers should be very concerned about the coming judgement, we will all suffer different levels of loss according to our works. Likewise everyone will receive different levels of reward in heaven. 

The bible doesn't list all the ranks of heaven, but we have an abundance of scriptures which make it crystal clear that both heaven and hell have different levels of reward and punishment. 

1 Cor. 3:11-15

“For no man can lay a foundation other than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

Now if any man builds upon the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, each man’s work will become evident; for the day will show it, because it is to be revealed with fire; and the fire itself will test the quality of each man’s work. If any man’s work which he has built upon it remains, he shall receive a reward.

If any man’s work is burned up, he shall suffer loss; but he himself shall be saved, yet so as through fire.”

Matt 16:27

“For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.”

Matt 5:19

“Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.”

Matt 18:4

“Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven.”

These are just a few verses stating that some will be great in the Kingdom of God and others will not. We also read in Matthew 20 that God predetermined everyone's place and rank in heaven, so this confirms predestination and election. 

Matthew 20:21-25

21 And He said to her, “What do you wish?”

She said to Him, “Grant that these two sons of mine may sit, one on Your right hand and the other on the left, in Your kingdom.”

22 But Jesus answered and said, “You do not know what you ask. Are you able to drink the cup that I am about to drink, and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with?”

They said to Him, “We are able.”

23 So He said to them, “You will indeed drink My cup, and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with; but to sit on My right hand and on My left is not Mine to give, but it is for those for whom it is prepared by My Father.”

[Desopixi Seilynam]

On 6/11/2024 at 6:38 PM, Charlie1988 said:

Yes the wicked and lazy servant was judged according to his works and cast into the outer darkness.

Let us therefore not be wicked lazy and unprofitable, but fruitful.

Fruit are the people we lead to Christ.

The only thing we can take with us into heaven are other people.

Our work of evangelism will be tested on the last day.

Paul in 1 Corinthians 3:4-23 is clearly speaking about the work of evangelism.

"Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom you believed,
even as the Lord gave to every man
I have planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the increase"
1 Corinthians 3:5-7

"For we are laborers together with God, you are Gods husbandry,
you are Gods building" 1 Corinthians 3:9

"other foundation can no man lay than is already laid which is Jesus Christ"
1 Corinthians 3:11

[Lay the foundation of Christ, in you, that is, the Spirit, inside of you]
 [Foundation:
   One receives the Spirit upon belief: Galatians 3:2, Ephesians 1:13
   Good building: And one is supposed to be led by the indwelling Spirit:
   Romans 8:14, Ephesians 2:10, Titus 3:5]

Now, if any man build upon this foundation, gold, silver,
precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
Every mans work shall be made manifest:
for the day (of the Lord) shall declare it;
for it shall be revealed by fire,
and the fire shall test every mans work,
of what sort it is.
1 Corinthians 3:12-13

If any man's work abide which he has built thereupon,
he shall receive a reward. (the person you led to Christ goes to heaven)

If any man's work shall be burned,
he shall suffer loss; but he himself shall be saved;
yet so as by fire. 
1 Corinthians 3:15

Paul is clearly talking about the building of a person,
you are Gods building.

Paul is talking about the work of evangelism.

And let's now ask Paul, what get's burned?

Know ye not that you are the temple of God?
and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?
If any man defiles the temple of God,
him will God burn
for the temple of God is holy, which temple you are.

1 Corinthians 3:16-17

 

That is what is being said in 1 Corinthians 3:4-17