Rev. Charles Haddon Spurgeon Free-Will -A Slave

[FreeGrace]

47 minutes ago, BornAgain490 said:

FreeGrace said:

But, do you?  You haven't provided any verses that say what you say.  According to the Berean verification method of Acts 17:11, your claims aren't biblical.

I've proven everything I've said with scripture.

I understand that you think you have.

47 minutes ago, BornAgain490 said:

You can't see it because you've been indoctrinated into Arminianism and Pelagianism. 

Such nonsense.  Arminians are as confused as Calvinists, just in different areas.

My standard is plain language, just like the Bereans.  My views come from the plain language of Scripture.

I've seen over and over how poorly Calvinists read verses.  They can't even see the obvious truth of Eph 2:8 that faith precedes salvation, and by extension from v.5, where Paul equates regeneration and salvation, regeneration.

Or, Eph 1:4, that says plainly that God chose believers to be holy and blameless, hardly a verse about God choosing anyone for salvation.  The "us" in v.4 is defined by Paul as "us who believe" so you can replace the "us" with "believers" in that verse.

[FreeGrace]

40 minutes ago, BornAgain490 said:

  FreeGrace said:

How do you understand 2 Tim 3:15?

It's an exhortation to Timothy to stay grounded in the word as he goes about the Father's business of teaching others.

See?  The verse is about the FACT that the gospel gives wisdom on HOW to be saved.  There is nothing there about being 'grounded'.  So you have demonstrated the reading skills of Calvinists.  Totally missing the clear point of the verse.

40 minutes ago, BornAgain490 said:

Salvation is by grace through faith, all of which are gifts of God. Ephesians 2:8-9 prove it. 

Do you really understand the words "through faith"?  I think not, esp since you have claimed that one must be regenerated BEFORE they can believe.  So Calvinists turn Eph 2:8 on its head and twist the real and obvious meaning from it.

Thanks for demonstrating my claim.

[FreeGrace]

39 minutes ago, BornAgain490 said:

FreeGrace said:

How do you explain that man CAN refuse to believe, since the Bible says so in Acts 14:2 and 19:9?

God's grace is effectual to those whom God has chosen to salvation before HE created.  All others where God's grace is ineffective, God by-passes. 

Another great example of how Calvinists totally misread Scripture.  There is nothing in either verse that says what you are saying here.  Zero.

Both verses plainly SAY that "men refuse to believe" and you have to go to your talking points.

And you dodged completely the issue of refusing.  It is a choice, but Calvinists are really allergic to choice, unless it is about what God does.

How can a puppet make any choices, is how the Calvinist mind thinks.  It is unthinkable for a Calvinist to consider that man is free to believe or refuse to believe, which are the 2 choices available to man.

 

[FreeGrace]

36 minutes ago, BornAgain490 said:

  FreeGrace said:

iow, one cannot refuse what one cannot choose.  It would be idiotic to argue otherwise.

Unregenerate man can choose all that his flesh desires. However, since his spirit is dead, he has no ability to choose godly spiritual things until and unless he is born again.

Once again, you have proven my claim about Calvinist reading skills.

As I previously said, the gospel is NOT a "spiritual issue".  It is a trust issue.

God makes a promise and man chooses whether to believe the promise or not.

To not believe the promise is to REFUSE to believe the promise.

That is the FACT, but Calvinists refuse to accept the FACT.  Which is a choice.

[BornAgain490]

52 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

As I previously said, the gospel is NOT a "spiritual issue".  It is a trust issue

I say it is a spiritual issue because it is the Spirit that must regenerate the dead spirit of man before he can have saving faith. 

[BornAgain490]

57 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Another great example of how Calvinists totally misread Scripture.  There is nothing in either verse that says what you are saying here.  Zero.

Both verses plainly SAY that "men refuse to believe" and you have to go to your talking points.

And you dodged completely the issue of refusing.  It is a choice, but Calvinists are really allergic to choice, unless it is about what God does.

How can a puppet make any choices, is how the Calvinist mind thinks.  It is unthinkable for a Calvinist to consider that man is free to believe or refuse to believe, which are the 2 choices available to man.

 

You obviously reject the complete and absolute sovereignty of God. 

[BornAgain490]

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

There is nothing there about being 'grounded'.

The whole book of 2 Timothy is about being grounded in God's word.  Keep it in context, sister. 

[BornAgain490]

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

I understand that you think you have.

Such nonsense.  Arminians are as confused as Calvinists, just in different areas.

My standard is plain language, just like the Bereans.  My views come from the plain language of Scripture.

I've seen over and over how poorly Calvinists read verses.  They can't even see the obvious truth of Eph 2:8 that faith precedes salvation, and by extension from v.5, where Paul equates regeneration and salvation, regeneration.

Or, Eph 1:4, that says plainly that God chose believers to be holy and blameless, hardly a verse about God choosing anyone for salvation.  The "us" in v.4 is defined by Paul as "us who believe" so you can replace the "us" with "believers" in that verse.

The problem is in your heart: you fail to see God as completely and absolutely sovereign and able to have mercy and compassion on only those whom HE has chosen. 

[BornAgain490]

2 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

one cannot refuse what one cannot choose.

The unregenerate cannot choose God. God chooses the unregenerate. 

[Michael37]

24 minutes ago, BornAgain490 said:

The unregenerate cannot choose God. God chooses the unregenerate. 

In His Eternal Wisdom God has given people freewill to choose and decide whether to obey His commands.

Example: 

Gen 2:15-17  Then the LORD God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to tend and keep it.  (16)  And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, "Of every tree of the garden you may freely eat;  (17)  but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."

Gen 3:17-19  Then to Adam He said, "Because you have heeded the voice of your wife, and have eaten from the tree of which I commanded you, saying, 'You shall not eat of it': "Cursed is the ground for your sake; In toil you shall eat of it All the days of your life.  (18)  Both thorns and thistles it shall bring forth for you, And you shall eat the herb of the field.  (19)  In the sweat of your face you shall eat bread Till you return to the ground, For out of it you were taken; For dust you are, And to dust you shall return."

From my notes:

God's Grace Is Evident In Human Volition Along With The Five Physical Senses: all of which God has His reasons for giving.

Scripture provides several reasons for why God gave laws and commands to mankind. 

1. Guidance for Righteous Living: In the Bible, God's laws and commands are often presented as guidelines for living a life that is pleasing to Him. For example, the Ten Commandments in Exodus 20 offer moral directives that help people understand how to conduct themselves in ways that honor God and respect others.

2. Revelation of God's Character: The laws and commands reveal aspects of God's character, such as His holiness, justice, and love. By following these laws, people can better understand who God is and what He values.

3. Establishing a Covenant Relationship: In the Old Testament, God's laws were given as part of the covenant relationship between God and His people, Israel. Obedience to these laws was a way for the Israelites to show their faithfulness and commitment to the covenant.

4. Highlighting Human Need for Grace: The laws also serve to show humans their inability to fully comply with God's perfect standards, thus highlighting the need for divine grace and redemption. This is particularly emphasized in the New Testament, where the Apostle Paul explains that the law acts as a tutor leading people to Christ (Galatians 3:24).

5. Promoting Justice and Compassion: Many of God's commands in the Bible are designed to promote justice, compassion, and social welfare. For instance, laws concerning the treatment of the poor, widows, and orphans demonstrate God's concern for the vulnerable and marginalized in society.

These reasons collectively show that God's laws and commands are meant to guide, teach, and help humanity in their relationship with Him and with one another.