This country was founded on...

[Mongo]

I will assume you mean the U.S.

The U.S. was founded upon belief in a supreme diety, not Jesus Christ. Some of the founders and shapers of our early country were Christians, or followed religious faiths that taught that Christ was our savior. A few believed in a supernatural power, but never said it was "God". Some believed in God, but didn't follow biblical teachings. The words, "In God We Trust" are there because our forefathers knew how important God was in our lives and how His blessings had enabled them to survive where others perished. If you read many of their personal documents, you will see how the majority feared that a country without God at it's center would become immoral, violent, perverse, and would decay slowly into obscurity. When prayer was removed from school, that's exactly what happened.

[O'Dannyboy]

I saw a documentary relative to this last night. I wouldn't go as far as to say "founded" on Christianity. As Dani so elequently put it, our founding fathers formed this country based on Christian principles.

The purists/pilgrims left Britain/England in search of a land where they could worship free of the influence of the RCC. They first settled, in Norway, but did not find the freedom of religion they saught. From there they chartered the infamous Mayflower and headed to the Americas where they finally landed at Plymouth Rock. I would have to say the the Majority of the leaders from this time had a healthy respect for G_d and/or the peoples feelings about G_d. It is most aparent that Christianity had a HUGE impact on the formation of this country and its system of government.

[book_wirm]

mostly deists

Misnomer.

Care to explain? Many were deists. What do you mean by "misnomer"?

...our founding fathers formed this country based on Christian principles.

I suppose this may be true, though it certainly comes across as hair splitting. I would ask, which principles are we referring to by this statement...and how can they be shown to have come from the principles of the Christian faith and not another source?

The purists/pilgrims left Britain/England in search of a land where they could worship free of the influence of the RCC. They first settled, in Norway, but did not find the freedom of religion they saught. From there they chartered the infamous Mayflower and headed to the Americas where they finally landed at Plymouth Rock. I would have to say the the Majority of the leaders from this time had a healthy respect for G_d and/or the peoples feelings about G_d.

The highlighted portion may be true, but what bearing does that have on the founding of this country? We are speaking of those during the Revolutionary period...quite some time later. It is pertinant whether the "founding fathers" held the same to be true and whether they intended to form this country as a place based on the Christian faith...not what one boatload of pilgrims believed. Truthfully, many of them did not believe in freedom of religion either.

In Christ,

Eric

[EricH]

Many of the founding Fathers were Deists, bit not necessarily Christian.

[other one]

I don't think I can get started on this thread...... I wouldn't last long

[book_wirm]

John Adams From a letter to Charles Cushing (October 19, 1756):

[book_wirm]

One more thought on Adams before it is assumed I classify him as a "Christian founding father". He was undoubtedly a Unitarian, and thus did not believe in eternal punishment, looking forward, rather, to a time when all would be united with Christ.

In Christ,

Eric

[Mongo]

KatyAnn,

Many of the founding fathers believed whole-heartedly in Jesus and God and publically acknowledged a supreme being. In many cases, they compromised on the terms, or words, so that the concept of a supreme diety was preserved, but that the individual's manner to recognize God was also preserved. You must understand that they came from varied religious backgrounds and teachings and did not seek to create a country where people were persecuted for variances - that's why they had sought exit from England in the first place. One of the strongest factors for rebelling against England was the continued effort of the church to enforce itself upon the new continent. The Church used its power to attempt to get a foothold in the new lands and many of our forefathers not only wanted to free themselves of political tyranny, but from religious tyranny as well.

Many fake documents have been used by aetheist to attack Christianity for years. In the last decade, more of these have found their way to the internet. Don't fall for it.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

[other one]

Well now, don't that just make the hair on the back of your neck stand up......

Thanks, it's been too long since I read that.......

[book_wirm]

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

~Which creator is it they are referring to? The God of Christianity? Whichever one you care to fill in the blank for? Or the impersonal "Supreme Architect" of the Freemasons?

~And which of this country's Christian principles is it that allowed for "created equal" to not apply to children, women, blacks, Indians, foreigners, non-land owners, etc etc...

As to your claims of forged documentation, I can offer no response without examples. I am aware that various groups have forged documents...it has been going on since the beginning. (Remember "The Donation of Constatine"?) But this only proves that it has occurred on both sides of many issues.

To that end...let's agree that when a quotation or statement is found to be untrue, we will disregard it and move on. That some may be found so, on both sides, cannot, however, be taken for an answer to all statements and quotes.

In Christ,

Eric