Yes, Jesus meant TODAY in his message to the thief on the cross

[Frits]

On 5/11/2025 at 11:26 PM, AdHoc said:

No my brother. The question Galatians 3:29 answers is how you GENTILES come in line for the Covenant made with Abraham.

The Covenant that God made with Abram in Gen.15 was very good and God of course kept to it. But when the time came, He made a New and better Covenant (Mat.26:28) in His blood, with which the Old Covenant was declared outdated and worn out!

If the notary has recorded your Testament but after years you change it to a new better Testament, then only one Testament can be legally valid, and that is the last one or the New Testament. The New Covenant is what the Bible is about, the Old Covenant is worn out! (Heb.8:13)

[farouk]

On 5/4/2025 at 1:41 PM, BibleLove said:

I agree Jesus meant on that day the thief, Dismas, the first Saint according to Catholicism, was to be with Jesus in paradise that very day. Because Jesus died on that same day.

Hi @BibleLove

A major aspect is to recognize that:

"... Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

⁴ And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:" (1 Corinthians 15.3). 

It's good to be able to look beyond tradition and reckon with the claims upon us of the Saviour Himself.

[BibleLove]

5 minutes ago, farouk said:

Hi @BibleLove

A major aspect is to recognize that:

"... Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

⁴ And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:" (1 Corinthians 15.3). 

It's good to be able to look beyond tradition and reckon with the claims upon us of the Saviour Himself.

True. This does not mean Dismas was not with Christ in paradise on that same day Jesus died.

[Your closest friendnt]

1 hour ago, BibleLove said:

True. This does not mean Dismas was not with Christ in paradise on that same day Jesus died.

Jesus died and he went in the paradise of Abraham ahead of Dismas who died right after him. Jesus body from the Cross was place in the tomb. Who said buried? Was John or Perer or one of the women or Jesus Christ. 

Sorry I see the reference to Paul. My apologies. 

Edited May 15 by Your closest friendnt

[BibleLove]

15 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said:

Jesus died and he went in the paradise of Abraham ahead of Dismas who died right after him. Jesus body from the Cross was place in the tomb. Who said buried? Was John or Perer or one of the women or Jesus Christ. 

Sorry I see the reference to Paul. My apologies. 

I don't know what you mean to say here: "Was John or Perer or one of the women or Jesus Christ."

 

Dismas didn't have to die in the same moment as Jesus so to arrive in paradise. Jesus said Dismas would be there today with Jesus.

Your question that asked,who said buried?

I didn't. Buried is not written in my post that you quoted.

 

Blessings,

 

 

[Locust]

23 minutes ago, BibleLove said:

I don't know what you mean to say here: "Was John or Perer or one of the women or Jesus Christ."

 

Dismas didn't have to die in the same moment as Jesus so to arrive in paradise. Jesus said Dismas would be there today with Jesus.

Your question that asked,who said buried?

I didn't. Buried is not written in my post that you quoted.

 

Blessings,

 

 

the law  required burial that makes it a given

[AdHoc]

On 5/13/2025 at 1:04 PM, Frits said:

The Covenant that God made with Abram in Gen.15 was very good and God of course kept to it. But when the time came, He made a New and better Covenant (Mat.26:28) in His blood, with which the Old Covenant was declared outdated and worn out!

If the notary has recorded your Testament but after years you change it to a new better Testament, then only one Testament can be legally valid, and that is the last one or the New Testament. The New Covenant is what the Bible is about, the Old Covenant is worn out! (Heb.8:13)

God made TWO Covenants. ONE with Abraham and his Seed, and ONE with Israel at Sinai 430 years later. The first was ratified by Abraham's sacrifice of Genesis 15 and the second by Moses' sacrifice of Exodus 24. The first is an "everlasting Covenant" - the second was already broken by the golden calf some days later. It is this second Covenant that will be replaced. "Will be" is future to us now. It is already ratified by Christ's blood, but comes into effect when Israel are one nation again. You can see both Covenants in Galatians 3:16-18

 17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect. 18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

The New Covenant of Jeremiah 31 replaces that of Sinai. It is ratified by Christ's blood and comes into effect with the resurrection of Israel. The New Covenant is an "everlasting covenant" (Jer.32:40) and Jeremiah 33 says that if Israel were to break that Covenant they would cease to exist - but they won't. Israel returned to their Land only occurs AFTER the Church is complete (Act.15:14-16).

[Frits]

6 hours ago, AdHoc said:

It is already ratified by Christ's blood, but comes into effect when Israel are one nation again.

Joseph certainly came from the house of David. (Matt. 1:16) So the sons of Joseph were also descendants and they represented "the tabernacle of David, which has fallen down." (Acts 15:16)

If we then look back at Acts 1, we find in verse 14 that there were also women in the upper room on the day of Pentecost, and Mary was also there. Moreover, it is clearly noted that her sons were with her; James and Joses, and Simon and Judas. (Matt. 13:55)

These young men were the remnant of "the tabernacle of David that has fallen down." (Am. 9:11-12) But God is going to restore it in a special way, namely by pouring out the Holy Spirit on this 'remnant' of believers.
You see, br. @AdHoc, what the conditions are for the restoration of Israel and also of the house of David, that is the belief that the Lord Jesus Christ is God and loving and worshiping Him.

 Those who are of Israel, but were not in the upper room on the day of Pentecost or received the Holy Spirit afterward, are not truly Israel and have no part in God's restoration! That is what Paul meant when he said:

'For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel.' (Rom.9:6)

Furthermore, through this unique way of salvation, countless heathen will be saved and become God's people, if they receive the Lord Jesus Christ and believe in His name. (Amos 9:12)

Edited May 16 by Frits

[AdHoc]

8 hours ago, Frits said:

Joseph certainly came from the house of David. (Matt. 1:16) So the sons of Joseph were also descendants and they represented "the tabernacle of David, which has fallen down." (Acts 15:16)

If we then look back at Acts 1, we find in verse 14 that there were also women in the upper room on the day of Pentecost, and Mary was also there. Moreover, it is clearly noted that her sons were with her; James and Joses, and Simon and Judas. (Matt. 13:55)

These young men were the remnant of "the tabernacle of David that has fallen down." (Am. 9:11-12) But God is going to restore it in a special way, namely by pouring out the Holy Spirit on this 'remnant' of believers.
You see, br. @AdHoc, what the conditions are for the restoration of Israel and also of the house of David, that is the belief that the Lord Jesus Christ is God and loving and worshiping Him.

 Those who are of Israel, but were not in the upper room on the day of Pentecost or received the Holy Spirit afterward, are not truly Israel and have no part in God's restoration! That is what Paul meant when he said:

'For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel.' (Rom.9:6)

Furthermore, through this unique way of salvation, countless heathen will be saved and become God's people, if they receive the Lord Jesus Christ and believe in His name. (Amos 9:12)

If  a man or woman is born from the line of Jacob he/she is an Israelite. Being an Israelite depends on being conceived in the fleshly line of Jacob. That cannot be undone (Rom.9:3-4). There is no such thing in the Bible as a "true" Israelite. Either you were conceived from the line of Jacob and you are Israelite, or you were not conceived in this line and are NOT an Israelite.

The concept of "True Israelite" presupposes that there are UNTRUE Israelites - an absurdity

In Ephesians 2:15 God makes a New Man FROM MEMBERS of the Nation of Israel and FROM MEMBERS of the Nations (THE TWAIN - KJV). This New Man is a NEW CREATURE. That means that it has NO PAST (2nd Cor.5:17). Its ORIGIN is not the flesh like Israel. It proceeds out from Christ like Eve came out of Adam (Jn.12:24).

An Israelite has the choice. Embrace Jacob and Moses after him and you are an Israelite. Faith is defined in Hebrews 11:1. It is the hope and substance of things NOT SEEN. The second that our Lord Jesus bursts through the clouds and is SEEN, FAITH CEASES TO EXIST - seeing as the object IS SEEN. There is no possibility of conversion after Jesus touches down on Mount Olives. Israel will surely believe when they see Jesus, but they MOURN.

The "Tabernacle" of David is his HOUSE. His House is famous for two things;
1. It had two kings that rules COMBINED Israel - that is, before the schism of North and South. David's Tabernacle can only exist when Israel is ONE NATION
2. It would produce the Messiah Who would bring COMBINED Israel out of the bondage of foreign kings

1. Israel can only be one nation again when they are RESURRECTED as per Ezeiel 37

2. David's Tabernacle can only stand when all David's offspring - including all the kings that sprang from his loins are present. Good kings and bad kings alike, if they sprang from his (David's) loins, are the House of David. This happens AFTER the great Tribulation (Dan.12:1-2). That is why Jesus sends His angels to collect those dispersed to the "four winds" "after the tribulation of those days" in Matthew 24:28-31.

You did not explain Romans 9:6, so I cannot comment. But let me ask you a question. Abraham had many "seed" and eve means "Father of many nations". Isaac had two seeds. Jacob had for wives and 12 seed. That is, the seed to whom the Promises apply, has the following line: Shem - Abraham - Isaac - Jacob - Israel. How then can a member come from Jacob (Israel) and NOT be OF Israel? However impossible it may sound, it is fact - for scripture alludes to it. Please explain.

[Frits]

1 hour ago, AdHoc said:

You did not explain Romans 9:6, so I cannot comment. But let me ask you a question. Abraham had many "seed" and eve means "Father of many nations". Isaac had two seeds. Jacob had for wives and 12 seed. That is, the seed to whom the Promises apply, has the following line: Shem - Abraham - Isaac - Jacob - Israel. How then can a member come from Jacob (Israel) and NOT be OF Israel? However impossible it may sound, it is fact - for scripture alludes to it. Please explain.

No problem br. @AdHoc, I will try to explain it per Rom.2:28-29, Rom.9:6, Rom.11:1, and Gal.4:26.
The Old Testament Jews were recognizable by their circumcision in the flesh.

But Paul declares in so many words that these people are in fact not Jews, and that is why I also do not call these unbelieving people "true" Jews. Or I should know better than Paul but I don't, do you?
A people that definitely does not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ cannot possibly be Israel!

That is also Paul's explanation in Rom.9:6. Not all, but those who are from Israel now believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, they are truly Israel, Paul himself also belongs to that. (Rom.11:1)
And those who are indeed from Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, but definitely do not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, they are NOT Israel.

 True Jews are described by Paul as people who are circumcised in the inner man, that is, not in the flesh, but in the heart.

Rom 2
28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: 
Note: So the circumcision that people do in the flesh, is futile and reprehensible!

29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
Note: But if the heart is circumcised by the Lord Jesus Christ, in the spirit, then that person is a true Jew, who was born again in Jerusalem which is 'above'. (Gal. 4:26)