Christ is Israel

[Anne2]

39 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

At this time we are in Abraham the Lord imputed righteousness to him. Because he believed in what God promised him. Abraham never went to look for a blessing to anyother God.

Yes, I agree. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God. To look for a blessing? I don't get that.

 

39 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

When he believed that God will still give him children inspite of his age God declared him a righteous man by degree. 

Till the Covenant of Cirumcision that required the obedience of Abraham to the Cirumcision and God included only Isaac in the imputed righteousness of Abraham. 

The covenant of circumcision at that time, excluded the uncircumcised in the promise. To access this promise you had to become circumcised.  Those born under the covenant were circumcised by their fathers, those Gentiles of faith chose to become circumcised/ become an Israelite, to inherit the promises.

 

39 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

The Lord from the beginning wanted to have a Nation for himself from Abraham. 

I am not sure if Abraham  connected to that in Genesis 15 but sure he connected to that in Genesis 17 because God included his children and their children's children. 

It included gen 15 because it included being a slave 400 years. being redeemed from slavery. It also was exclusive to the 4th generation...not Isaac, Jacob and twelve Patriarchs themselves. They are dead in this covenant.

Gen 17 included mention of Gentiles. Which could also become circumcised. In other words it was exclusive to circumcision. You basically had to become an Israelite/Jew. 

39 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

He said to Abraham walk with me and do what I will ask you. 

Please it is about Abraham. 

Issac was born to the Lord and God repeat his Covenant with him and not with the other children of Abraham. 

Isaac was the son of promise.

Eph 2:12  That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

Edited Friday at 09:06 PM by Anne2

[Your closest friendnt]

@Mr. M

Please ask the questions to the specific issue at hand to have the chance to elaborate. 

Please within the Genesis context chapter 17 only.  If it is about someone else the questions has to be to them. 

After we go through chapter 17 and take it apart then we can look at some others

[Your closest friendnt]

 

@Anne2 

If you draw a parallel to Abraham and the Covenant of Cirumcision and look at what Abraham did later on and what Judah did and the crimes of the other twelve Patriarhs nothing to say about Benjamin.

And how they worship other God's even Moses who grew up in Pharaoh's Palace and the Lord still considered them to be his people, his Nation. Israel in my Son. Let my people go.

Then you can see that their sins were not counted against them and they continued to be the Children of Abraham and the Nation of God in the Covenant of Cirumcision and they continued to be Gathered to Abraham in the Bossom of Abraham at their death time. 

They did not have forgiveness of sins they had the imputed righteousness of Abraham their sins like the sins of Abraham were not counted against them. 

Much like our sins are not counted against us in Jesus Christ. 

David understood exactly that because under the law they were Judge for their sins and he looked back to the Covenant of Cirumcision and he said bless is he to whom the Lord will not count his sins against him. 

In the Covenant of Cirumcision there was not Judgement for their sins. I hope you can see that and they were not cut off from the people of God and Abraham. 

Edited Friday at 09:04 PM by Your closest friendnt

[Your closest friendnt]

24 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

Yes, I agree. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God. To look for a blessing? I don't get that.

 

The covenant of circumcision at that time, excluded the uncircumcised in the promise. To access this promise you had to become circumcised.  Those born under the covenant were circumcised by their fathers, those of faith chose to become circumcised to inherit the promises.

 

It included gen 15 because it included being a slave 400 years. being redeemed from slavery.

Gen 17 included mention of Gentiles. Which could also become circumcised. In other words it was exclusive to circumcision. You basically had to become an Israelite/Jew. 

Isaac was the son of promise.

God told him to circumsized everyone but the Cirumcision did not included in the promises of the Covenant. 

Only to Issac and later to Jacob with whom God repeat the blessings of Abraham to them and all the children of Jacob and he called him Israel in him all his children were included and the foreigners to be included had to be adopted by a family of one of the tribes. 

How many souls went down to Egypt. 77 the backbone of the Nation of Israel. 

[Anne2]

10 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

If you draw a parallel to Abraham and the Covenant of Cirumcision and look at what Abraham did later on and what Judah did and the crimes of the other twelve Patriarhs nothing to say about Benjamin.

And how they worship other God's even Moses who grew up in Pharaoh's Palace and the Lord still considered them to be his people, his Nation. Israel in my Son. Let my people go.

Then you can see that their sins were not counted against them and they continued to be the Children of Abraham and the Nation of God in the Covenant of Cirumcision and they continued to be Gathered to Abraham in the Bossom of Abraham at their death time. 

They died in Adam

Rom 5:12  Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned: {for that: or, in whom }
13  (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
14  Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam’s transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

Something to consider

The common death all men die....apart from the law...ALL MEN vs death by provocation of God (wrath)

28  And Moses said, Hereby ye shall know that the LORD hath sent me to do all these works; for I have not done them of mine own mind.
29  If these men die the common death of all men, or if they be visited after the visitation of all men; then the LORD hath not sent me. {the common … : Heb. as every man dieth }
30  But if the LORD make a new thing, and the earth open her mouth, and swallow them up, with all that appertain unto them, and they go down quick into the pit; then ye shall understand that these men have provoked the LORD.

[Anne2]

4 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

God told him to circumsized everyone but the Cirumcision did not included in the promises of the Covenant. 

Because it was a sign and a seal of his faith. Those household servants with their children remained servants... 

The same was true under the law. If his master gave him a wife, the children belonged to his master. That if he were freed, he would have to leave them behind. 

Edited Friday at 09:19 PM by Anne2

[Your closest friendnt]

28 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

They died in Adam

Rom 5:12  Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned: {for that: or, in whom }
13  (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
14  Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam’s transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

Something to consider

The common death all men die....apart from the law...ALL MEN vs death by provocation of God (wrath)

28  And Moses said, Hereby ye shall know that the LORD hath sent me to do all these works; for I have not done them of mine own mind.
29  If these men die the common death of all men, or if they be visited after the visitation of all men; then the LORD hath not sent me. {the common … : Heb. as every man dieth }
30  But if the LORD make a new thing, and the earth open her mouth, and swallow them up, with all that appertain unto them, and they go down quick into the pit; then ye shall understand that these men have provoked the LORD.

Sorry you have Genesis and you have the blessings to have a copy this is why I point earlier read it for your self without other people telling you what it means.

They had to obey at the time of Cirumcision there is no confession of faith. Like is with the water baptism of an adult. 

Eight weeks old baby was circumcised. Abraham who circumcised adults never did any rituals for confession. 

And later he circumcised babies which it is impossible. 

[Anne2]

6 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

Sorry you have Genesis and you have the blessings to have a copy this is why I point earlier read it for your self without other people telling you what it means.

I am having a hard time understanding this. Are you saying . Are you saying Paul is other people?

[Your closest friendnt]

6 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

I am having a hard time understanding this. Are you saying . Are you saying Paul is other people?

God gave you Genesis to read he wants to guide you himself. You, Genesis 17th and the Holy Spirit and a sound mind. You have to use what he has given you. 

Edited Friday at 10:04 PM by Your closest friendnt

[Anne2]

4 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

God gave you Genesis to read he wants to guide you himself. You, Genesis 17th and the Holy Spirit and a sound mind. You have to use what he has given you. 

Are you saying don't listen to the apostle Paul?