The Wonderful Fruit of the Spirit - it's just Christ in us!

[Vine Abider]

1 hour ago, Alive said:

50 plus years ago when Christ revealed Himself to me He led me to Watchman Nee and the Lord used his writings to lay a solid foundation in me before ever joining a congregation. After some time the pastor where I found myself asked me to teach a study based on what I had consumed. I very much to this day thank the Lord for WN. Much time has passed and the core of that remains and has been strengthened...Christ is my Life. I died and yet I live. I don't think I agree with anybody in total.

Witness Lee is a very, very different fella. I never read his stuff--but I recall the little I did many years ago--caused me to run.

Along with the Normal Christian Life I suggest Sit, Walk and Stand and Changed into His Likeness and What Shall This Man Do.

T. Austin Sparks can be very helpful as well.

Amen to all you said - and those Nee books are good!

Lee, on the other hand . . .  I spent years of discussion with various ones debating what was "baby" (to keep) and what was "dirty bath water" (to throw out) of his teachings and practices.  I have generally chosen to move on from that laborious, ongoing debate.

Now Sparks' writings I certainly do see as very good and always leading to a healthy focus of Christ in us.

[steve morrow]

CORE  ESSENTIALS  ---  DONT  AGREE  WITH  ANYBODY  IN  TOTAL ???

 

1 JOHN 2:6  he that saith he abideth in  HIM  ought himself also so to walk as  HE  walked 

1 JOHN 2:27  but the anointing which you have received of  HIM  abideth in you and you need not  --that any man teach you-- but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things --AND  IS  TRUTH-- and is no lie -- and even as it hath taught you you shall abide in  HIM

 

JOHN 12:48  HE  that rejecteth  ME  and receiveth not  MY  words hath one that judgeth him the word that I have spoken the same shall judge him in the last day 

--12:49-- for I have not spoken of myself but  THE  FATHER  which sent  ME  HE  gave  ME  a commandment what I should say and what I should speak 

--12:50--  and I know that  HIS  commandment is life everlasting whatsoever I speak therefore even as  THE  FATHER  said unto  ME  so I speak

 

JOHN 5:34  but I receive not testimony from man but these things --I  SAY-- that you might be saved 

 

2 CORINTHIANS 13:8  for we can do nothing against the truth --but for the truth--

 

PSALM 60:11  give us help from trouble for vain is the help of man 

 

2 PETER 1:3  according as  HIS  divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness through the knowledge of  HIM  that hath called us to glory and virtue 

 

PROVERBS 18:21  death and life are in the power of the tongue and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof

 

1 PETER 2:21  for even hereunto were you called because  CHRIST  also suffered for us leaving us an example that you should follow  HIS  steps

 

HEBREWS 13:6  so that we may boldly say --THE  LORD  IS  MY  HELPER-- and I will not fear what man shall do unto me 

 

 

LOVING  THE  LORD  JESUS  CHRIST 

[Alive]

8 minutes ago, steve morrow said:

CORE  ESSENTIALS  ---  DONT  AGREE  WITH  ANYBODY  IN  TOTAL ???

 

1 JOHN 2:6  he that saith he abideth in  HIM  ought himself also so to walk as  HE  walked 

1 JOHN 2:27  but the anointing which you have received of  HIM  abideth in you and you need not  --that any man teach you-- but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things --AND  IS  TRUTH-- and is no lie -- and even as it hath taught you you shall abide in  HIM

 

JOHN 12:48  HE  that rejecteth  ME  and receiveth not  MY  words hath one that judgeth him the word that I have spoken the same shall judge him in the last day 

--12:49-- for I have not spoken of myself but  THE  FATHER  which sent  ME  HE  gave  ME  a commandment what I should say and what I should speak 

--12:50--  and I know that  HIS  commandment is life everlasting whatsoever I speak therefore even as  THE  FATHER  said unto  ME  so I speak

 

JOHN 5:34  but I receive not testimony from man but these things --I  SAY-- that you might be saved 

 

2 CORINTHIANS 13:8  for we can do nothing against the truth --but for the truth--

 

PSALM 60:11  give us help from trouble for vain is the help of man 

 

2 PETER 1:3  according as  HIS  divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness through the knowledge of  HIM  that hath called us to glory and virtue 

 

PROVERBS 18:21  death and life are in the power of the tongue and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof

 

1 PETER 2:21  for even hereunto were you called because  CHRIST  also suffered for us leaving us an example that you should follow  HIS  steps

 

HEBREWS 13:6  so that we may boldly say --THE  LORD  IS  MY  HELPER-- and I will not fear what man shall do unto me 

 

 

LOVING  THE  LORD  JESUS  CHRIST 

I am sorry I was not more clear. What I mean is that I have never met anyone with whom I agree 100%.

This isn't a criticism, it is what it is.

[TheBlade]

Hey my brother praise GOD thanks for this. You know Christ said unless He goes the holy Spirit will not come "The fruit of the Spirit". We know the sweet holy Spirit is a person that does not speak of Him self but only what He hears from the Father/Christ "But when He, the Spirit of Truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth [full and complete truth]. For He will not speak on His own initiative, but He will speak whatever He hears [from the Father—the message regarding the Son], and He will disclose to you what is to come [in the future]."

And in Acts "the holy spirit said" "While they were serving the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, “Set apart for Me Barnabas and Saul (Paul) for the work to which I have called them.”

[PATrobas]

The Green Letters by Miles J. Stanford also speak to these things. I have found them helpful to spur me on to "rest" in the completed works of Christ in me. I echo the importance of the truth in 2 Cor. 4:7 as @Alive mentioned.

[Marathoner]

21 hours ago, Alive said:

50 plus years ago when Christ revealed Himself to me He led me to Watchman Nee and the Lord used his writings to lay a solid foundation in me before ever joining a congregation. After some time the pastor where I found myself asked me to teach a study based on what I had consumed. I very much to this day thank the Lord for WN. Much time has passed and the core of that remains and has been strengthened...Christ is my Life. I died and yet I live. I don't think I agree with anybody in total.

Witness Lee is a very, very different fella. I never read his stuff--but I recall the little I did many years ago--caused me to run.

Along with the Normal Christian Life I suggest Sit, Walk and Stand and Changed into His Likeness and What Shall This Man Do.

T. Austin Sparks can be very helpful as well.

I encountered Watchman Nee's books not long after I came to Christ. They had an immense impact upon me and that remains to this day. 

I never looked into Witness Lee, though. 

[Vine Abider]

2 hours ago, Marathoner said:

I encountered Watchman Nee's books not long after I came to Christ. They had an immense impact upon me and that remains to this day. 

I never looked into Witness Lee, though. 

Without going into too much detail, Lee was a younger contemporary of Nee and could be considered a protege. Nee got jailed by the communists and Lee went to Taiwan and eventually the USA in the 60s in southern CA. Lee strongly promoted the "one church - one city" idea, meaning in the NT we see the church as simply having a label according to where the believers lived and met.  Hence the city they were in, like: the Church in Ephesus; Church in Jerusalem, etc. - all believers in that city were considered one ekkelsia in that locality.  Therefore those following Lee's teaching were referred to as the "local church" in that city (e.g., The Church in Anaheim). The teaching was referred to as "the ground of oneness."

The teaching isn't without merit, but they really became elitist, shunning other groups of Christians who didn't drop their denominational names to come practice the "oneness" with them.  Lee often disparaged Christendom (again, not without some merit*), but the group really looked down upon and separated themselves from other Christians.  The characteristics of Laodicea started to become manifest and now they pretty much only read Lee's materials (with some Watchman Nee).  The so-called "ground of oneness" doctrine became a focus and just another point of division in the body of Christ - anything we focus on other than Christ, no matter how good, usually just results in another division!

* I say this has some merit simply because of the condition of the overall church in this age, with hundreds of divisions, of which we are all aware of its shortcomings.  This degraded state is somewhat "natural" in that we all still have the flesh, which is by nature, quite divisive.  Yet God sees the church as a new creation and glorious - this is a matter of standing in faith for us, in that He is able to present us to Himself glorious and "without spot, wrinkle or any such thing!"

[Alive]

14 minutes ago, Vine Abider said:

Without going into too much detail, Lee was younger contemporary of Nee and could be considered a protege. Nee got jailed by the communists and Lee went to Taiwan and eventually the USA in the 60s in southern CA. Lee strongly promoted the "one church - one city" idea, meaning in the NT we see the church as simply having a label according to where the believers lived and met.  Hence the city they were in: Church in Ephesus; Church in Jerusalem, etc. - all believers in that city were considered one ekkelsia in that locality.  Therefore those following Lee's teaching were referred to as the "local church" in that city (e.g., The Church in Anaheim). The teaching was referred to as "the ground of oneness."

The teaching isn't without merit, but they really became elitist, shunning other groups of Christians who didn't drop their denominational names and come meet with them.  Lee often disparaged Christendom (again, not without some merit*), but the group really looked down upon and separated themselves from other Christians.  The characteristics of Laodicea started to become manifest and now they pretty much only read Lee's materials, with some Watchman Nee.  The so-called "ground of oneness" doctrine became a focus and just another point of division in the body of Christ - anything we focus on other than Christ, no matter how good, results in division!

* I say this has some merit simply because of the condition of the overall church with hundreds of divisions, which we are all aware of shortcomings.  This degraded state is somewhat "natural" in that we all still have the flesh, which is by nature, quite divisive.  Yet God sees the church as a new creation and glorious - this is a matter of standing on faith for us, that He is able to present us to Himself glorious and "without spot, wrinkle or any such thing!"

A good example of how to tell whether something is of His Spirit...the Holy Spirit's two primary functions for us are to convict of sin and point to Christ. In any assembly Christ must be the Head, the focus and reason for gathering.

[Vine Abider]

3 hours ago, cma said:

I'm glad you don't meet with them anymore...

I'm curious - how did you come across Witness Lee's stuff?  I suspect that less than 1 in 50 Christians has ever heard of him . . .

[steve morrow]

WHY  THEN  THE  CONTINUANCE  IN  THE  FLESH

 

GALATIANS 5:19  now the works of the flesh are manifest which are these  adultery  fornication  uncleanness  lasciviousness  idolatry  witchcraft  hatred  variance  emulations  wrath  strife  seditions  heresies  envyings  murders  drunkenness  revelings  and such like of the which I tell you before as I have also told you in time past --that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of  GOD--

GALATIANS 6:8  for he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption but he that soweth to the spirit shall of the spirit reap life everlasting 

 

JOHN 6:65  and  HE  said therefore said I unto you that no man can come unto  ME  except it were given unto him of  MY  FATHER

--6:66--  from that time many of  HIS  disciples went back and walked no more with  HIM

--6:67--  then said  JESUS  unto the twelve will you also go away 

 

--6:68--  then Simon Peter answered  HIM  LORD  to whom shall we go thou hast the words of eternal life 

 

JOHN 3:36  he that believeth on  THE  SON  hath everlasting life and he that believeth not  THE  SON  shall not see life but the wrath of  GOD  abideth on him

 

JOHN 4:14  but whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life 

 

JOHN 6:27  labor not for the meat which perisheth but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life which  THE  SON  OF  MAN  shall give unto you for  HIM  hath  GOD  THE  FATHER  SEALED 

 

GENESIS 1:2  and the earth was without form and void and darkness was upon the face of the deep and the spirit of  GOD  moved upon the face of the waters 

 

PSALM 29:3  the voice of  THE  LORD  is upon the waters the  GOD  of glory thundereth  THE  LORD  is upon many waters 

 

JOHN 6:63  it is the the spirit that quickeneth the flesh profiteth nothing the words that I speak unto you --they are sprit and they are life 

1 CORINTHIANS 15:45  and so it is written the first man Adam was made a living soul the last Adam was made a quickening spirit 

--15:46--  howbeit that was not first which was spiritual but that which natural and afterward that which is spiritual 

--15:47-- the first man is of the earth earthy the second man is THE  LORD  from heaven 

 

JOHN 10:30  I  AND  MY  FATHER  ARE  ONE 

 

JOHN 5:21  for as  THE  FATHER  raiseth up the dead and quickeneth them even so  THE  SON  quickeneth whom  HE  will

 

JOHN 17:11  and now I am no more in the world but these are in the world and I come to thee  HOLY  FATHER  keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given  ME  --that they may be one as we are--

 

2 THESALONIANS 2:8  and then shall that wicked be revealed whom  THE  LORD  shall consume --with the spirit of  HIS  mouth-- and shall destroy with the brightness of  HIS  coming

 

 

LOVING  THE. LORD. JESUS. CHRIST