Hot, Cold or Lukewarm?

[st. Worm]

"We are making the application based upon the hot and cold metaphor the Lord uses, which the Laodiceans would have picked upon immediately given their need to have water piped into them. They would have understood why lukewarmness was something repulsive to the Lord."

But that is not telling me how you are applying that to individual believers.

[Guest shiloh357]

"We are making the application based upon the hot and cold metaphor the Lord uses, which the Laodiceans would have picked upon immediately given their need to have water piped into them. They would have understood why lukewarmness was something repulsive to the Lord."

But that is not telling me how you are applying that to individual believers.

OK, I will repost what has already been said:

This has been mentioned before, but it bears mentioning here as well. It is important to note that the Church of Laodicea did not have its own natural springs, and therefore both hot and cold water had to be "piped" in via aquaducts from other cities. The problem was that when the water arrived at Laodicea, it was luke warm. Lukewarm water is where you find the highest degree of parasites, and so it had to be boiled first, before the citizens of Laodicea could use it for drinking, or cooking, or whatever.

Jesus says I wish you were either hot or cold. Hot and cold water are both useful to us. Cold water is refreshing and it quenches thirst. Hot water has healing and anti-sceptic properties.

Lukewarm water in those days, was not just useless but potentially deadly. These were apathetic, complacent people, neither hot nor cold. They were not making themselves useful for the Kingdom.

A lot of people can get caught up in "church work" and miss out on the work of the Church. It is too easy to get caught up in a self-centered form of Christianity, where we enclose ourselves in a bubble and end up not fulfilling our mission. In that sense we are lukewarm. We have our fancy buildings, our committees, our programs, our parties, but there is little to show for where the harvest of souls is concerned. The Church in America is fat. We have all the best resources, the most money, and I fear, we are going to be sweating when we have to account for what we did with what we have been given.

God cannot desire us to be cold towards Him, as the traditional contemporary translation of this passage goes - that goes against His nature.

Looking at the passage this way is much more sobering.

Are you as cold water - giving refreshment to others?

Are you as hot water - ministering healing?

Or are you as lukewarm water - ineffective?

Lukewarm can also mean blending into the culture such that none can tell by your life that you are any different than anyone else. For, in context, that is what happened to the Christians in Laodacea.

Do we complain about our bosses like everyone else? Or do we respect those in authority over us and pray for them in th efear of the Lord?

Those in authority, do you treat those under you kindly or do you abuse your power over them in the fear of the Lord?

That's one example.

The message appears to be that we need to be useful for the Kingdom, as both Cold (refreshing, edifying, encouraging) and Hot (healing, holy, standing against sin). We need both components in the Kingdom of God. It is when we become apathetic, (lukewarm) that we fall into inappropriate behavior, and we are no longer fit as conduits for God's character and operations to flow through. We, as EricH pointed out become poisonous to others. We find among the Lukewarm believers, gossip, talebearing, complaining, murmurring, etc. Such things are deadly to a healthy church.

Nebula also pointed out that we need to be conscious on a day by day basis as ot our personal conduct even at work. We need to both hot and cold on the job and everywhere we go.

[st. Worm]

And btw Shiloh, I don't disagree about the water having to be piped in to Laodecia, however I think the message if there is a universal application is that the church is to be useful, whether cold for refreshment or hot for healing. Lukewarm is neither refreshing nor useful in cleansing and healing. The application to individuals, in my view, is a stretch.

[Kabowd]

And btw Shiloh, I don't disagree about the water having to be piped in to Laodecia, however I think the message if there is a universal application is that the church is to be useful, whether cold for refreshment or hot for healing. Lukewarm is neither refreshing nor useful in cleansing and healing....

Um, that's what he's been saying....

[Gerioke]

Cold christians, to me, are the ones who say they believe in God and Jesus was a great man/prophet and they give other religions the same importance as the sacrifice our Lord made.

I would unfortunately fall into the second category and this worries me.

Geri, Jesus said, "I wish you were either hot or cold." If "cold" meant what you are saying, why would Jesus say he wants you hot or cold?? It is the "lukewarm" that he hates. "Cold water" refers to that which is refreshing, edifying, encouraging." Cold water is not "bad."

The people you are describing who ascribe Jesus as a prophet on par with other religious figures would not be a Christian, and would therefore not be included in this description.

Are you saying that Jesus is no more important than Buddha, Or Hinduism?? Are you saying that Jesus is a great man, but you don't believe he is the Son of God, but just a prophet?

[Guest shiloh357]

And btw Shiloh, I don't disagree about the water having to be piped in to Laodecia, however I think the message if there is a universal application is that the church is to be useful, whether cold for refreshment or hot for healing. Lukewarm is neither refreshing nor useful in cleansing and healing. The application to individuals, in my view, is a stretch.

Demonstrate why it is a "stretch."

[st. Worm]

I think based on the passage itself, the burden is on you to show applicability to individuals since that chapter and all of the surrounding ones are directly to churches and not individuals.

[Guest shiloh357]

I think based on the passage itself, the burden is on you to show applicability to individuals since that chapter and all of the surrounding ones are directly to churches and not individuals.

Every epistle that Paul wrote was to Churches. He made all kinds of corporate commands that they walk in, and be filled with the Spirit, that they should put on the Lord the Jesus Christ, that we repay evil with good, etc. There is no problem with personal application there is there?

There are myriad of sermons that have used the 1st three chapters as applicable to both churches and individuals.

You are the one making the allegation that personal application is a stretch. The burden is on you to demonstrate where we are wrong, or your allegation has no merit whatsoever. Telling us we are wrong, but refusing to demonstrate why, won't cut it.

I reposted how we are applying this. You simply need to demonstrate that our application is false.

[st. Worm]

I am sorry but your argument, such as it is, appears meritless. The passages are to churches in that portion of the book. To argue that the NT letters are to churches so all passages in Scripture have individual applicability is contrary to any reasonable principle of interpretation I am aware of.

go fish.

Edited January 15, 2006 by st. Worm

[Christ's Free Servant]

I believe HOT christians are the ones who devote most of their time in fellowship, praying, worshipping, and/or witnessing with enthusiasm .Luke warm christians are the ones who devote most of their time seeking self fulfillment while going to church on Sundays to give a good appearance. They spend more time watching TV or other recreational activities than they do working for God.

Cold christians, to me, are the ones who say they believe in God and Jesus was a great man/prophet and they give other religions the same importance as the sacrifice our Lord made.

I would unfortunately fall into the second category and this worries me.

I could be way off base with my outlook but Jesus said the road is narrow and I seem to be on a 4 lane hiway right now.

Gerioke,

I always appreciate your honesty! You are not afraid to be open about where you are spiritually. I think that is an admirable quality. I pray for you that God will move you out of your lukewarmness and into the kind of relationship with him that your heart desires.