Global Warming

[IslandRose]

OK.... I'm not even going to try to PM everyone whose posts I removed. I tried to take out the personal attacks. This can be a good subject to debate, but EVERYONE needs to remember to debate the SUBJECT, not each others personalities.

If you write a sentence with the word "you" in it, take the time to go back and reread it from the point of view of the other posters. If you would be offended to see it posted to yourself, take it out of your post.

Let's try this again.

The subject is Global Warming.

(Please PM me or hit the Post Report button if you see any attacks I missed. )

[apothanein kerdos]

Pollution, however, kills of plant life and animals and also increases the speed in which Global Warming occurs.

Have you ever walked into a forest on a warm day? Or even a moderately cool day? The temperature jumps about 5-10 degrees C. I would think land developement is killing off more plant life than pollution is. Mind you there are certain areas that produce certain toxins that would have an adverse effect on foliage. But I don't believe it is a global problem.

Well any pollution, no matter how localized, holds potential to become a global problem. Think of Cherynoble (sp?). The fall out from it set off warnings in India and even so far as China. These effects did actually harm people in those areas. Another example is to look at the Jordan River. Damming of it is occuring in Syria, yet it is killing off the entire river. This destroys local economies, specifically farm land, which leads to poverty, which leads to civil unrest, which leads to war.

As for it having a direct global effect, in Canada you're lucky. You live in a nation that is relatively clean because it is sparsly populated. At the same time, in the US, specifically the lower regions, we see global warming taking a massive effect. Look at Kansas....it's been in a true drought for about two years. In Oklahoma and Texas (western) it's worse....having been in a drought for about three.

So pollution does eventually affect everyone on the globe.

[nebula]

I saw a chart in my Oceanography textbook which showed a graph of I guess average global temperature over the ages (I forget all the elements they look at to figure such, but there are ways they can get an idea of the historical climate).

Anyway, what it showed is that the Earth's global climate has been in a warming trend for several centuries. But around the time of the industrial revolution, there was a noticeably sharp increase in this warming trend. The graph went from a steady rise to a significantly sharp rise.

So, I would say there is a bit of both natural and man-made causes to the "global warming".

The question then would be whether the Earth can safely handle the drastic changes occuring over a short (relatively speaking) period of time.

For instance - animal adaptations. I saw an article a few weeks ago stating that the polar bears might soon be on the endangered species list as a result of loss of habitat (ice).

[Guest Kilad]

No one is saying that Pollution does not exist because it does. What you are being challenged on is your contention that Pollution, caused by man, causes Global Warming and that is just not true. There is NO credible scientific evidence to support that claim. Also God

[apothanein kerdos]

I saw a chart in my Oceanography textbook which showed a graph of I guess average global temperature over the ages (I forget all the elements they look at to figure such, but there are ways they can get an idea of the historical climate).

Anyway, what it showed is that the Earth's global climate has been in a warming trend for several centuries. But around the time of the industrial revolution, there was a noticeably sharp increase in this warming trend. The graph went from a steady rise to a significantly sharp rise.

So, I would say there is a bit of both natural and man-made causes to the "global warming".

The question then would be whether the Earth can safely handle the drastic changes occuring over a short (relatively speaking) period of time.

For instance - animal adaptations. I saw an article a few weeks ago stating that the polar bears might soon be on the endangered species list as a result of loss of habitat (ice).

The only thing I would question is has the warming trend been going on for centuries? I only ask this because in 1812 (I believe) we had a "year without a summer", basically where the temps were low year round (of course, there was a volcanic eruption...). But, that's not a point of contention, merely asking for clarification.

I

[Smalcald]

Global warming caused by human activities is an accepted theory among most climatologists who are publishing and doing research into the issue today, but not all. I am not denying that there are a minority of scientists who disagree with the human component of global warming (there is no debate that the world is warming), but they are not the leaders in the field.

Regardless of global warming, we need to burn less fossil based fuel, it is dirty to burn, it is dirty to extract and it largely comes from unstable parts of the globe.

I think the way to do that would be to simply build in the true cost of oil so prices accurately reflect how much oil is really costing us, we could do this with some sort of energy taxes on oil and the production of other dirty energy sources such as coal. I don't think propping up alternative energy sources with subsidies will work, they must be economically viable, meaning they must cost less than oil to produce and right now they don't.

We could solve most of our energy problems by just producing cars, which got an average of 10 miles more per gallon than they do now. But Americans are not willing to sacrifice anymore and I think that is the crux of the problem. Lets face it, until we have a major climate catastrophe or a truly major interruption in oil supplies, we will do nothing as all alternatives would require sacrifice. I mean we are supposedly in a war, and we don't want increased taxes, we don't want a draft and we would never accept rationing, all things we have done for real wars, but not now.

Oooops veering off topic again!

[apothanein kerdos]

Here....let's look at some links:

This website shows the decrease in polar ice. look to Canada and you'll see that the ice close to it has been melting as well, dispelling the myth that it's just ice displacement.

From a government website showing the melting in the ice caps and explaining it.

Even NASA confirms the melting.

Now, we can debate on what causes this...that's not a problem. It can very well be a "natural" source. However, to debate on if it is occuring at all.....c'mon......

[Gerioke]

The Sahara desert has been expanding rapidly over the past few decades as well. Antarctica was once a tropical paradice eons ago. Despite whether pollution plays a part in global warming or not, God has designed this planet to evolve with the times. Foliage is displaced and coastlines move. I don't believe there is much we can do about it or we should try and do about it. Consumerism is poison to society, not only for the pollution it creates, but also the dependancy we have on it for employment and "neccessities" of life. How big of a hole do you think we would need to accomodate all of the TVs on the planet? That is just one of many unneccessary items that preoccupy Joe Public"s time and resources and it also promotes the consumption of hundreds of other useless items that we really don't need.

[nebula]

The only thing I would question is has the warming trend been going on for centuries? I only ask this because in 1812 (I believe) we had a "year without a summer", basically where the temps were low year round (of course, there was a volcanic eruption...). But, that's not a point of contention, merely asking for clarification.

I'd have to dig up my textbook at look this up - when I have more time, and I remember -

but was a cause determined for that? I forgot.

Also, what were the years before and after that year like?

[eric]

So after reading through this thread, it seems that people, as usual, have left God out the equasion and are insinuating that man is in control of the world and not God, and that man has got all the answers to fix things.

Which leads back to a different thread where God's omiscience was raised. God must have known that man would stuff things up and cause pollution and that would be global warming,because, man who is so smart with all the new fangled scientific technology has brought it all on himself and without trying to sound pessemistic or gloomy will keep on destroying God's creation by trying to outsmart God's ordinances. I just love the second psalm.

Science only discovers what God put there in the first place to be found. It took them nearly six thousand years to know that there was an atom that could be split and now everyone in the world is waiting for a nuclear blast that will blow them off the face of the earth.

I got out on the wrong side of the bed this morning and feel like I am having a bad hair day.

eric.