A person who's a Mason and a Christian?

[jeffnevins]

Yes, good discussion.

This is difficult in that my family flat-out expects me to go. As if I don't have a choice.

I have a hard time saying no to people, and tend to give up in arguements.

My brother and mom are going. If only that was good enough-

[jmh137]

Maybe the LORD wants you to go for some reason that only he can know. Ididn't read each and evey post, so maybe someone else said this too. HE may use you when you go, to bring HIM much glory.

[Smalcald]

On this question I personally would go, family is important, and Christ tells us that. I have attended marriages that were not Christian including a Hindu ceremony where they invoked other God's, I have attended marriages in Catholic Churches where they invoked intercession by the Virgin Mary, and have attended a couple of Jewish Seder

[jeffnevins]

When I voiced my reservations (which I've had since I read up on the Masons a while back), my mother said I thought I was too good for my own family and hung up in my face.

First time that's ever happened. Could be one of those lame things that splits up a family for good (or a long time).

I totally don't care about hiding my real name on a message board like this. If I knew anyone here from (non-internet) life they would probably identify themself.

I don't know what God wants me to do. I pray. And I get opinions from my best friend in one direction (mature Christian), and family (also Christian, a bit less so).

Back to work. Thanks.

[Guest Daave]

Jeff,

I think you going with your grandpa would be a wonderful and unforgetable experience. Take careful note of what is going on, and ask lots of questions afterwards. Since your grandpa, as far as we know, is a christian, start reading the gospels and ask your grandpa some more questions. Who knows, you may be the instrament God is using because of the heart connection he has with you already.

My dad is a Mason, and I can see where the Masonic ecumenical teachings have meddled with his trusting the Bible. Stay true to the scriptures Jeff, but show respect and honor to whom it is due.

I have myself wrestled with how badly we christians interact with a lost world. Our knowlege of the truth of salvation, and the grace of God centered in the finished word of the cross through Jesus Christ becomes a cop out used so often to leave the work to others.

Going with your grandpa is a jesture of honor.

If your grandpa was asking you to join the masons and to come along with him for that reason, that would be a different thing. Then the answer would be "I'm sorry grandpa I can't do that, would you let me tell you why?"

Daave

[jeffnevins]

Hi Jeff,

Jeff,can I ask you a couple of questions.....?

1. Do you think you are strong enough in your faith to withstand the Lure and temptation of the enemy to lead you astray...?

2. What do you find most important above all else in your motivation to please your grandfather..? His acceptance or his salvation....?

Regards,

Ben.

1) If it means joining the Lodge, yes. If going is a temptation, I'm not sure it is.

2) Salvation.

Good message after those two questions as well. Thanks.

Thanks Daave as well.

[Can Do (Phil 4:13)]

Jeff,

I think you going with your grandpa would be a wonderful and unforgetable experience. Take careful note of what is going on, and ask lots of questions afterwards. Since your grandpa, as far as we know, is a christian, start reading the gospels and ask your grandpa some more questions. Who knows, you may be the instrament God is using because of the heart connection he has with you already.

My dad is a Mason, and I can see where the Masonic ecumenical teachings have meddled with his trusting the Bible. Stay true to the scriptures Jeff, but show respect and honor to whom it is due.

Going with your grandpa is a jesture of honor.

If your grandpa was asking you to join the masons and to come along with him for that reason, that would be a different thing. Then the answer would be "I'm sorry grandpa I can't do that, would you let me tell you why?"

Daave

Dave, may I compliment you on your excellent, well written post

[irishcowboy]

a mason will never ask some one to join the lodge.

joining the lodge is initiated by the person wishing to join.

there is no recruitment activity from masons.

the masons were instrumental in the formation of the United States. Christian values were used to write the United States Constitution.

George Washington, and many of our first Presidents carried the badge of a mason.

many of our leaders of the revolution were masonic brothers.

they believed in a free nation. it is a shame we do not have a free nation now.

the government now rules this nation, just as the king ( or queen ) ruled england and the colonies then.

we have not learned from our history, so we are making the same mistakes again.... and again....

we are no longer a free nation. we have allowed our freedoms to be taken, not even stolen, but given up freely....

those that stand up for what they believe are considered radicals and right wingest....

when people are being supressed in their worship.... the great commission can not even be accomplished in this country because of suppression of the government.

the constitution states we shall have freedom of religion, not from religion.... unless the religion is non-Christian, then you can have free run with it...... even in the schools......

our founding fathers are turning over in their graves......

Masons were the leaders that freed this place....

yes, it was said that there could be some bad apples in the masons, this may be true, being there is a background investigation on everyone that joins, some bad apples may slip through....

they, indeed, do not teach "christian" teachings. for they are not a "Christian" organization, but neither is the rotory club. Kiwana's, Lions, International order of odd fellows. even the Boy Scouts are not a Christian organization or the Girl Scouts. there are even some "Christian Church" congregations that are not "Christian" organizations...

they do have some Bible teachings, Old Testiment teachings. They profess their trust in God. being that it is Old Testiment, there is no teaching from the new....

as Christians, we are to keep the laws as well.......

IF YOU LOVE ME, YOU WILL KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS.....

there are Jewish people that are masons.

they teach how to live an upright life with the Bible as the base...

The Great Arcitech of the Universe, is the one and only GOD. He designed it, He spoke it into existance.

the Masons are not a religious organization. no more then the Boyscouts or girlscouts. They do pray, so do the boyscouts and girlscouts....

being a member of a baseball team could also be considered a cult or sect, and most of them do not pray to God before, during, or after a game... the same with football....

which type of cult or false god do most people bow down to?

they are placing other things before GOD, thus have their own form of false gods... racing, football, baseball, basket ball.....shopping, TV, cars, hunting, fishing. spending more time in any one of their pass time activities then with God. and even skipping time with God to be watching a ball game or other activity.

you never know, the man sitting next to you in church, that you are so envious of about how God is blessing him may be a mason, or the man across the aisle that is really happy and fully enjoying his time with the Lord, may also be a mason. some wear rings, some do not. they do not come out and say....Hey, look at me.... I'm a Mason.... the only time you would know is during a parade (with the shriners) or sitting by a lodge building before a meeting. some do have an emblem on their vehicles, but then so do some that profess to be Christian......

I have even heard one "Christian" based church fellowship calling other "Christian" based church fellowships cults and sects... ( one denomination calling another a cult.....and as one said occult )

if you raise your hands when in worship, you must be a cult, or is it if you have your hands in your pockets? if you sing with instrumental music, you are a cult, or is it only if you do not use instruments? a group singing songs only from Psalms? or even the songs the Israelites were given through Moses maybe just hymnal songs, or songs that are at least 100 years old.

here it is.....

Some one that worships, praises, sings, preaches, and or honors God in a different way then I do is a member of some cult......

thats it..... anyone different then me...... that means each and every one of you are probably in a cult, cause you do not do things the way i do things at the time i do things for God..... I may pray every two hours, but if you pray every hour, you are a cult.....

the Catholics have their statues,

the Presbyterians have their stain glass

the Baptist have their potlucks

the Lutherin have their pipe organs

the hardlines have their long dresses,

some have their pews to jump, others have alters to dance around.

some do not shed a tear, will not shed a tear, others allow the tears to flow as God is dealing with them

some shout AMEN, others nod, some sit very dignified with hands in lap and a smile on their face as the Spirit convicts them and they are saying to them selves who is this man to tell me what i need to do with my house.... some humble themselves and wish they could crawl under the pew and out the back door with out being seen, and then will not come back cause they got their feelings hurt.

what does your cult consist of?

[Rober H]

There have been Mormon, Christian, Catholic, Atheist, Agnostic war heros. They have raised families and contributed to their communities. All these people have things that they could be praised for.

I am sure there were Baal worshipers in the Old Testament that did some things that were commendable among men.

This isn't the issue.

I admire Catholics who stand on the street year after year silently protesting with signs reminding their communities that abortion is taking a human life and is wrong.

That doesn't mean I am going to attend their services and praise their teachings and doctrines. Quite the opposite.

The Masons teach doctrines that are clearly against the doctrines taught in the bible and they should be pointed out and Christians ( I don't care what non-Christians do) need to be warned.

No amount of words or drawn out excuses and rationalizations is going to change that fact.

Can you imagine Elijah praising the priests of Baal and putting down the faithful members of the children of Israel for wanting to separate from their heathen ceremonies and functions?

I can't...

2 Corinthians 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

2 Corinthians 6:15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?

2 Corinthians 6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

2 Corinthians 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,

2 Corinthians 6:18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

[Rober H]

The following quote is from

http://www.equip.org/free/DM166.htm

It is my contention that the Masonic ritual (i.e., Masonry's ceremonial rites of initiation that all Masons must pass through) of the First, Second, and Third Degrees teach all Masons exactly what God condemns as a false gospel, namely that a person is saved and goes to heaven as a result of his or her personal character and good works. As all Christians know, the Bible places such a teaching under God's curse. Paul said in Galatians 1:8-9: "But even though we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to that which we have preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so I say again now, if any man is preaching to you a gospel contrary to that we have preached to you, let him be accursed." The Bible clearly teaches how a man is saved: "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, that no one should boast" (Eph. 2:8-9. Cf. John 3:16; 5:24; 6:47; Rom. 3:28-4:6; 11:6). THE MASONIC LODGE AND THE CHRISTIAN CONSCIENCE

by John Weldon

Some people will write long posts using worldly philosophical arguments to defend the Masons and other groups which teach false doctrines which a Christian which believes the word of God should in no way condone or approve.

The bible warns us about such tactics.

Colossians 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

Edited June 6, 2006 by Rober H