Who teaches you?

[Guest Car54WhereRU]

The Holy Spirit will guide you into all truth. The Ethiopian eunuch read the scriptures and Philip asked if he understood what he read. His reply was, "how can I except some man guide me." The Lord will use men to teach you things. How do your children learn? From watching you (Seems they pick up the bad stuff more ). But the only way you will understand stuff is if God opens your eyes. Psalm 119:18 says open mine eyes that I may behold wondrous things out of thy law and then verse 130 says the entrance of thy words giveth light, it giveth understanding to the simple. The reason alot of people say that they "only follow the Lord and let him teach them" is cause they are rebellious and will not submit to the authority of a pastor in a local church.

Hello Car54WhereRu,

I do not mean to get off topic here but you say something in your last sentence that I been wondering about of course I got my own thoughts but it do not hurt to get others opinions right. You said the reason alot of people say they only follow the Lord and let him teach them is cause they are rebellious and will not submit to the authority of a pastor in a local church.

My question is how far do that pastorial autority go. I mean I seen pastor who want to control every aspect of your life. I think it go to far sometime and can tear homes apart cause pastors get in the middle of things. I mean the word say husband is head of household not the pastor of church but have experienced such pastor before and do not think it biblical of them to go beyond the bounds of the church. But what i've seen is pastor's ursurping the authority of individuals homes and they have not been rightly given that place of authority and to me it is an abuse of their position to push they wills and desires upon you within this manner i mention here.

i have struggles from past that do mess with my head trusting those in authority among other issues going on at the same time but I am willing to submit to teachings of local church if they are truth but if I can't go in and out the church finding green patures and still waters to eat and drink because they want to make you their personal servants well I just can't find peace in that and think pastor's put more on people than what God requires of them to. Am I off base or do I got some validity to what I asking. The churches in my area are terrible in this avenue. And most of them are full of women and not many men. Which make me think as scripture say in timothy about silly women being taken captive. Do the pastor's get such a foothold on the women in they marriages that they follow the pastors and leave husband behind making pastor soul authority or dictator in their lives. I just don't want to be a silly women but balanced.

thanks

OC

Hey OC, I don't think you are getting off the topic. There has to be a balance in "pastoral authority" where he's not medalling but helping. Here: Hebrews 13:7 Remember them which have the rule over you, who have spoken unto you the word of God: whose faith follow, considering the end of their conversation. Hebrews 13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.

This of course can be abused because preachers are flesh. But he is a shepherd placed there by God and he wants to take care of the sheep. But there needs to be order in the church. In Acts 15 James basically was the leader even though they counsulted each other on the questions at hand.

As far as the women thing....I hear ya. Alot of times it's all women cause MEN can spot a phony and can't be bullied into submission. My Pastor is half crazy..... but we have men in our church that would follow him if he charged hell with a squirt gun wearing gasoline britches cause he is a man and a leader. Women do play a very important part in our church but have there place according to the scriptures. They make some of the best Sunday School teachers. Our church is well balanced in this aspect.

I guess I would suggest find a man that you can follow, pray for him, trust him to lead according to God's will, but don't exalt him and keep your eyes on Jesus, he's the only one that won't let you down. When your pastor lets you down or fails you, have grace with him and ask yourself if you have prayed for him like you should.

Hope this helps. Thanks for your response.

Car54

[Openly Curious]

Thank you car 54

You have been most helpful and spoken to my concerns and to my thoughts in this avenue. And I never thought about the men not being so easily bullied into submission like the women which seems to answer my why question. So the ones in the church who have the "rule" over me is who I suppose to submit to not just to anyone who bullies me around. This is good cause I have that "rule" you mentioned to see if they are the ones to submit to or not. It is in Galatians 6:14-18 the "rule" is in verse #16 as they faith will follow as you say in they example. And it sound like you have a good pastor where you go.

thank you once again for taking the time for me. blessings

OC

[Guest Car54WhereRU]

OC,

Glad it was helpful. I can see you are truly open and you seem to be very reasonable. I hope God guides you to find a good, God fearing, Bible believing pastor you can follow.

Just to eloborate a little more, my submission to my pastor is because of his belief in the word of God. God has given him and pastors an insight and discernment that alot of church memebers lack. Some of the burdens that a pastor bears, a "laymen" couldn't bear. That is why it is important that everyone find their part in the local body. If you can match your weaknesses to another's strength, you will work well as a team. It's not a clergy/laity battle. The church at Pergamos had the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which God hates. That doctrine is the clergy conquoering the layity or people.

May God bless your endeavour to please him.

In Christ Jesus,

Car54

[Openly Curious]

OC,

Glad it was helpful. I can see you are truly open and you seem to be very reasonable. I hope God guides you to find a good, God fearing, Bible believing pastor you can follow.

Just to eloborate a little more, my submission to my pastor is because of his belief in the word of God. God has given him and pastors an insight and discernment that alot of church memebers lack. Some of the burdens that a pastor bears, a "laymen" couldn't bear. That is why it is important that everyone find their part in the local body. If you can match your weaknesses to another's strength, you will work well as a team. It's not a clergy/laity battle. The church at Pergamos had the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which God hates. That doctrine is the clergy conquoering the layity or people.

May God bless your endeavour to please him.

In Christ Jesus,

Car54

I have studied the doctrine of the Nicolatans in which you speak of and know for a certainty God has sent you my way. Cause i have observed this but not only the way you say it clergy conquering the layity but the layity conquering the clergy goes on to where the pastor is not free to be free to lead God people in right way he himself is controlled and manipulated. So i just don't want to be silly and duped either way. I have studied the seven churches in Revelation is very much depth and have gleaned from them to help me to know discernment. the doctrine of balaam i found most interesting in how satan operates. but you are the first person i have ran across that knew of the doctrine of the nicolatins which is another dimension in the church satan uses to get a foot hold on the church so it can't fulfill it's mission. It has been a real pleasure and treat to converse with you blessings.

OC

[Guest Car54WhereRU]

I have studied the doctrine of the Nicolatans in which you speak of and know for a certainty God has sent you my way. Cause i have observed this but not only the way you say it clergy conquering the layity but the layity conquering the clergy goes on to where the pastor is not free to be free to lead God people in right way he himself is controlled and manipulated. So i just don't want to be silly and duped either way. I have studied the seven churches in Revelation is very much depth and have gleaned from them to help me to know discernment. the doctrine of balaam i found most interesting in how satan operates. but you are the first person i have ran across that knew of the doctrine of the nicolatins which is another dimension in the church satan uses to get a foot hold on the church so it can't fulfill it's mission. It has been a real pleasure and treat to converse with you blessings.

OC

[Christian]

i take that scripture at face value as it was the one the Lord gave me while praying for those who think we must be taught by men to survive....... from the moment i was saved it was one on one with me and the Lord being filled with the Holy Spirit, it always amazes me how people do not understand the Lord Jesus lives in Us and how they think they need others to lead and quide them.......... now don, t get me wrong........... there are annointed leaders to help us along in our walks............. but so many never ever know the Lord for themselfs.........which is sad indeed............ Do not be called leaders; for One is your Leader, that is, Christ. (matt.23:10)

My point exactly

Beautifully said eagleswings

in Christ,

-CC-

[Marnie]

i take that scripture at face value as it was the one the Lord gave me while praying for those who think we must be taught by men to survive....... from the moment i was saved it was one on one with me and the Lord being filled with the Holy Spirit, it always amazes me how people do not understand the Lord Jesus lives in Us and how they think they need others to lead and quide them.......... now don, t get me wrong........... there are annointed leaders to help us along in our walks............. but so many never ever know the Lord for themselfs.........which is sad indeed............ Do not be called leaders; for One is your Leader, that is, Christ. (matt.23:10)

My point exactly

Beautifully said eagleswings

in Christ,

-CC-

It's well said, but taken too far is a destructive, unbiblical attitude. Of course we are to be led of the Spirit in all things, but the Lord has given us pastors and spiritual leaders as well. We are to submit to them, assuming they are also being led of G-d. This distrust of pastoral authority, so rampant here, is part of the emergent church and is definitely not part of Biblical teaching. Matthew 23:10 is part of a larger discussion of those who act like Pharisees; those who lord it over people; those who are holier-than-thou. It has nothing to do with the believer's relationship to Church leadership.

[Christian]

i take that scripture at face value as it was the one the Lord gave me while praying for those who think we must be taught by men to survive....... from the moment i was saved it was one on one with me and the Lord being filled with the Holy Spirit, it always amazes me how people do not understand the Lord Jesus lives in Us and how they think they need others to lead and quide them.......... now don, t get me wrong........... there are annointed leaders to help us along in our walks............. but so many never ever know the Lord for themselfs.........which is sad indeed............ Do not be called leaders; for One is your Leader, that is, Christ. (matt.23:10)

My point exactly

Beautifully said eagleswings

in Christ,

-CC-

It's well said, but taken too far is a destructive, unbiblical attitude. Of course we are to be led of the Spirit in all things, but the Lord has given us pastors and spiritual leaders as well. We are to submit to them, assuming they are also being led of G-d. This distrust of pastoral authority, so rampant here, is part of the emergent church and is definitely not part of Biblical teaching.

Mark 13:21-23

21 And then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is the Christ; or, Lo, there; believe it not:

22 for there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall show signs and wonders, that they may lead astray, if possible, the elect.

23 But take ye heed: behold, I have told you all things beforehand.

Marnie, I'm merely illuminating this possibility for those who need the message the most... those that strictly run to forums or online evangelicals for their answers. That we should not necessarily believe everything we hear simply because it comes from someone who "claims annointing". Nothing has been said here about not needing instruction from good, sound Biblical teachers , but that one should first rely on prayer and the Holy Spirit, then weigh any teaching received up against Scripture. I do not consider this "rampant" distrust of pastoral authority and take offense to your accusation of my being part of any "emergent church" or the questioning of the Biblical validity of my faith.

in Christ,

-CC-

[Guest man]

I have not taken this verse out of context unknowingly, but instead I find it very intruiging in it's message.

What is your opinion of it's statement?

1 John 2:27

But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you,

and ye need not that any man teach you:

but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie,

and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

in Christ,

-CC-

I have one teacher and that is Christ. There are more denominations then you can shake a stick at...which one speaks the Truth? We are all to be of the same mind and we're not. Each denom. has their own little view as to what's right and what's not. Until they all get on the same page (and they won't) I will put my trust in God. If He can't teach me...nobody can.

[Guest Car54WhereRU]

Marnie, I'm merely illuminating this possibility for those who need the message the most... those that strictly run to forums or online evangelicals for their answers. That we should not necessarily believe everything we hear simply because it comes from someone who "claims annointing". Nothing has been said here about not needing instruction from good, sound Biblical teachers , but that one should first rely on prayer and the Holy Spirit, then weigh any teaching received up against Scripture. I do not consider this "rampant" distrust of pastoral authority and take offense to your accusation of my being part of any "emergent church" or the questioning of the Biblical validity of my faith.

in Christ,

-CC-