Do you know where "Christmas" came from?

[Memmy]

Hi all, I understand what the discussion here is about but I don't understand why some who are so far removed from what is pagan is fearful of such things. We [i expect] are all Christians here and we are to do all things through Christ, so therefore are going to be judged by our hearts. If our hearts are in the attitude of being as Christ that would be in all of our ways in everything we do, and we need not be afraid of such things. Christ did not come to condemn, but to fulfil. He also celebrated passover and not all Christians do so either. And to the ones who remove themselves for what they believe are ONLY pagan practices, you must not use the days of the week by name either, because the pagans are the ones who named those. As I said it is in our hearts that God will see, not our "human" differences. Just my opinion. Thanks for your time...

Memmy

[Work in Progress]

Hey Memmy, welcome to the board.

. And to the ones who remove themselves for what they believe are ONLY pagan practices, you must not use the days of the week by name either,

I'm with ya all the way, but I've said that numerous times now in these discussions and no one has a reply. I wonder why? ? ? ?

I'm willing to bet the same people who condemn Christmas trees and Easter eggs also buy new baby boys blue gifts, use the names of the months and days, wear neckties etc etc etc.  I don't get it.    

Whatever. Like someone said above, salvation isn't based on it and I really don't care if someone else believes that having a tree is wrong. It's only when they tell others they are sinning is when I have a problem with it.

[CWJ]

Journey....you still missed MH's comment on verse 4....well...

I think you all are missing the point, I agree no relationship with the Lord is affected by having a Christmas tree, you are still a saint.

I DON"T go into someone's house and point the finger at all, in fact I never bring it up.  Not that important.  THAT is the wisdom taught in Romans 14.....

But here on this forum it's brought up, so out with the truth concerning pagan practice mixed with worship of God.

That's the issue!!

Journey you take this to a personal attack on me I think, when that is not the issue.

I am not "beating up" on anyone, but the Word of the Lord is a sharp Sword....has it cut you any?

Can anyone answer this  issue in light of the verse in James1:27??

Journey want to try? Journey want to try to show where I'm not grounded in scriptures?

AGAIN THIS IS AN ISSUE OF MIXING PAGAN STUFF WITH WORSHIP OF THE LORD JESUS!

Not about doing pagan stuff day to day like calling the days of the week by pagan originated names.  Now that's silly and we are free from that.

Remember He says that His commands would not be grievous for us to obey....but when OBEDIENCE is brought up in today's churchianity the fellers are yellers with cries of "LEGALISM!'

And what about James1:27?????????????????????????????????

[Lanakila]

If someone is accusing you of legalism you had better bet, that there is a good reason. We don't make this stuff up. My liberty in Christ is something I cherish and I won't be put under any mans legalistic bondage again. Being a Christian isn't a list of do's and a much longer list of don'ts. It is a relationship with a living, loving, Lord who happens to be with you and in you if you are his, amen. This reality changed my prayer life immensely by the way from one of duty, to one of joy. I don't go to church out of obligation and I don't read my Bible out of obligation and I don't skip the junk from hollywood out of obligation either. When we rent a umm video and it turns out to be junk (full of sex) or go to a movie and get the same junk we get up and walk out. The Holy Spirit in us convicts us and we don't stay even though we paid our money. But, do we stay away from all entertainment because its evil and sinful? No the answer is that we would miss out on a lot of good movies, and good times if we just decided they were all bad.

The same thing goes with Holiday's which are of pagan origin. Some people don't celebrate their Birthdays either (JW's). We need to be careful that we aren't being so separated from all pagan practices that we are in a sense monks, with a high and mighty attitude. God is the one we should be trying to please, and if you are the one with the convictlon you are the weaker brother, in a sense. But, should you be a weaker brother when you should be eating meat instead of drinking milk?

Obedience isn't legalism, when its obeying things written in scripture. Legalism is adding rules to the Christian life to make a person feel more righteous. Christianity isn't rules its a relationship. I obey God rather than men, myself. How about you? God didn't say in the NT that we are to practice ritual cleansing, or tithe jot and tittle, so I don't do it. In fact Jesus had alot to say to those Pharisees who kept the law, but their hearts were so far from God. God didn't tell us in the NT when to worship. Why must we try to add to God's Word? There is a curse to those that add to the Word, so I would be careful in this vein, if I were you.

[Memmy]

WIP, Thank you for your welcome ! I am new here so maybe I just don't see the connections yet, and that makes me still and always, a work in progress too. I feel that all Christians have their way of thinking but when it comes to condemning others, I tend to have a defensive approach. I just don't see that pointing out some trivial things are what Christ Himself came here to do....as I said before He did not come to condemn but to FREE us!

[Work in Progress]

You are right about Jesus, Mem. The woman at the well was a total tramp, but Jesus never said a word about that. Instead, He addressed her "heart condition". He knew that if that was right, everything else would fall into place, and she would work out all the little details with him as she walks her walk. I would never say that we shouldn't call sin, sin and expose it. No way. However, where the Bible is silent, so should we be, IMO.

I'm glad you're here.

Lana - Oh, man. AMEN!

[Guest FishMan]

I remove myself from pagan practices when they are intermingled with worship of God. Obviously I can't "remove" myself from being alive on Saturday or Monday or whatever. Those days are just normal days - pagan in nature, but I don't have the world telling me on those days "here is how you need to worship God". That's the difference, WIP. Dec 25 is pagan mixed with a time of "worship" - and God says throughout the Bible to keep our worship separate from the pagan practices of this world.

Now quit saying no one is answering your questions!

[CWJ]

Amen Fishman!

Boy....I am getting all accused of some bad things , Lan!

ALL I've done is point out how we shouldn't mix pagan rituals with worship of God, and you have said I'm adding to the Word!!

WOW!

[Work in Progress]

Now quit saying no one is answering your questions!

Okay.  

Fish, I don't expect you to not 'be alive' on the days of the week. I do expect you, if you truly want nothing to do with anything pagan, to not use the names of the days of the week. Before they were named for Gods and Godesses by pagans, they had other names. Why does it not bother you to use the pagan names; why do you not use other names?

CWJ, I'm not Lana, but I will address somethings you said.  You said -  

?  Or should we be studying more to find the meat of truths there?  

I get (what I think is) your point and totally agree. Something may not be mentioned specifically in Scripture, but there may be supporting Scriptures that seem pretty clear whether the thing is right or wrong. I understand that. However, Christmas trees and reindeer don't have supporting scriptures that I know of.  Without much stretching, you'd be hard put to find verses calling these things wrong, evil, sinful etc.

And, I can assure you that I am not rebellious in this area, nor do I have any guilty feelings at all. What I do have is a strong dislike for anything legalistic. Legalism destroys. Christ frees.

[The Journey]

CWJ,

  Man, I tried to stay out of this but such self promoting drivel.  I think you've patted your back enough.  We know...we know...your a great warrior...so pious...and holy.  Consider that you are the temple of the Holy Spirit.  The individual believer is holy ground.  You cannot separate "worship" from everyday living.  The Apostle Paul admonishes that in all we do it is to be done for the glory of God.  That is worship!!  I worship the Master by walking with Him through all the mundane details of daily life.   Going to the clinic everyday is an act of worship.   Making breakfast for my family is an act of worship.  Bringing roses to my wife is an act of worship.  CWJ, you are willing to compromise with the world and accept days of the week, months and a myriad of other pagan influences in your temple...but are quick to judge fellow believers when they violate your peculiar beliefs.  

- Steve

P.S.

In answer to your question...yes, the Word of God carves down the edges of my heart on a daily basis so that at the end of my life I will look like Jesus.