What do you object to regarding Christianity and Jesus?

[Copper Scroll]

Characterized, as a thing... as a religion, Christianity is corruptible. But name anything that is not corruptible.

Of course every ideology is corruptible. And teleological ideologies like Christianity are especially corruptible. That said, I don't think corruptibility is what's special here; it's the amazing extent of Christianity's corruption. If you consider violence and war to be a corruption of Christianity, then Christianity is the most corrupt religion on Earth, more so even than Islam, whose violence is at least partially rooted in doctrine. Mohammed killed; Jesus did not. Jihad is a part of Islam and Christianity doesn't have an equivalent doctrine. So how is a self-proclaimed religion of peace one of the most violent religions on Earth? Other religions of peace, like Buddhism, actually do have peaceful histories. Is it just a coincidence that Christianity is particularly abused, or is there actually some feature of Christian doctrine which enables violence? I don't know the answer--maybe you can help me--but I think I would be remiss to ignore this phenomenon.

Again this is not about what Christianity is supposed to be or even about what it is or what it was. This is about Christians who killed and exploited and used the name of God and Christ during their misdeeds. Misdeeds are not the sole property of Christians. You can make arguments on why Christians have historically been worse than people of other religions based on your own criteria of what is right and good. But to generalize about all Christians or to project the misdeeds of some Christians onto the true standard for all Christians--Christ--is foolish. If you are not generalizing and projecting, then mind the topic of this thread.

You find no fault in the Gospel, as far as I can tell.

I do, but I'll save that for later.

So you are beating around the bush.

Calling oneself Christian is not a claim to being perfect but, in my eyes, it is a claim to being Christian. A lot of Christians say that Christians who practice "poorly" simply aren't Christian. I won't presume to decide who is and isn't Christian, so when I judge Christianity I will judge all those who call themselves Christian.

So far you have only claimed to judge Christians on Christian standards, which is a little arrogant for a non-Christian.

Also, you probably have a problem that my posts have focuses on the people who practice Christianity rather than Christian doctrine itself.

I haven't read any posts of yours that focus on Christian doctrine. You do know that that is what this thread is supposed to be about, right?

[Guest lettheredeemedsayso]

As Christians we are followers of Christ. our main objective is to follow Christ. Since Jesus led a perfectly sinless life I don't see how anyone could have a problem with Him. Although believers may be an example to us our main objective is to follow Christ.

[ayin jade]

Nazi Germany was not Christian.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler%...ligious_beliefs

I'm just looking at the building.

From your link, despite public speeches where he claimed to be catholic, he states otherwise in private. He also tried to rewrite the bible and expressed a desire to eradicate Christianity. Not the work of a saved person.

Joseph Goebbels, for example, notes in a diary entry in 1939: "The F

[undone]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler%...ligious_beliefs

I'm just looking at the building.

Check out this link that talks about Hitler and his views of Christianity. He clearly despised it.

http://groups.google.com/group/talk.origin...883c57fcad016a5

[undone]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler%...ligious_beliefs

I'm just looking at the building.

Check out this link that talks about Hitler and his views of Christianity. He clearly despised it.

http://groups.google.com/group/talk.origin...883c57fcad016a5

Here's some more regarding Hilter as an atheist adherent: Be sure to scroll about 1/4 way down the page.

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.ta...6ebe892a0?hl=en

Edited November 5, 2006 by undone

[TheProcess]

There is nothing that He could do that would be immoral. Is there somethings He does that you find immoral? Lets discuss this.

So God could do anything at all, and it wouldn't be wrong for him? Anything that God does is automatically good? If that is what you are saying, does it not become a bit meaningless to say that God is good? Do we not need a difference between the behaviour of a good God and a bad God, to say that a particular God is "good"?

[TheProcess]

Is there somethings He does that you find immoral? Lets discuss this.

Well I am still waiting for a reply about the Calvinist doctrine of unconditional election. If you want, you can always say that Calvinism would be an immoral thing for God to do, but you don't think it Biblical. Otherwise, how do you defend it?

[ayin jade]

I thought I had said enough earlier regarding calvanism. Calvanism isnt a core doctrine in Christianity. Many solid believers in Christ have never heard of it, or do not believe in it. The evidence for calvanism isnt solid for or against.

I do not think calvanism is immoral for God. Im also not sold on its biblical soundness. I have no reason to defend it.

Let me ask you though, does the Creator have the right to do what He wishes with His creation? The fact is, we are all sinners in His eyes. He could have just erased us from this world, but He chose to save us. He chose to sacrifice Himself to pay that penalty for our sins. Would you willingly pay a death sentence penalty for someone?

[Guest foxjoe]

runner: Jihad is a part of Islam and Christianity doesn't have an equivalent doctrine.

Actually your wrong here. Sorry to have to say, in Luke it says "If anyone doesn't follow me, bring him before me and slay him".

This type of doctrine is what allowed the Inquisition to happen.

Throught the whole old testiment, there is doctrine for "in group" vs "Out group" mentallity. It is how societies survived over time.

Islam has no doctrine of "love thy enemy". That is the difference.

[Guest foxjoe]

Just for reference: Luke 19:

Why then didn't you put my money on deposit, so that when I came back, I could have collected it with interest?' 24 "Then he said to those standing by, 'Take his mina away from him and give it to the one who has ten minas.' 25 "'Sir,' they said, 'he already has ten!' 26 "He replied, 'I tell you that to everyone who has, more will be given, but as for the one who has nothing, even what he has will be taken away. 27 But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them--bring them here and kill them in front of me.'"