God allows satan sometimes

[butterfly]

I have recently taken more notice to destruction upon earth, as in Tornado's, Thunderstorms, Rain, Hail, etc.  My question to you is...Where do you believe these things are coming from.  Do you beleive that GOD controls all these things?  Or do you believe that it just simlpy needs happen from time to time to keep the flow of nature balanced?  Maybe you have a different view then one I've mentioned. Perhaps you even feel that satan has control over such thing's.  Or maybe you feel that GOD allows him some power over disasters from time to time.  Remember Job? What do you think?  Does satan have any control or is it all GOD?  Or just nature?  It would be nice if you would share your views with us.  I personal believe that every single storm or disater that occurs upon earth or anywhere for that matter is in complete control by GOD.  Everytime it even rains, I think of the one who even created the rain. Not one thing can happen upon this earth without his approval.  But, I invite you to share your belief with me.  If you have found any relating scripture, please do share it.  In Christ, Your sister, with Love. (butterfly) :T:  

[godrulz]

See "Does God create evil" thread under Doctrinal Discussions.

I think Scripture shows that some natural disasters can be from God, Satan, or simply natural weather patterns due to the limitations of creation (or mad made due to pollution).

[Ovedya]

God has set in motion all the items in creation that preserve and perpetuate our ecosystems.  This includes sunlight, rain, and even natural disasters such as forest fires, hurracains, tornadoes, etc.  I do not believe that Satan has control over any sort of weather.  I do not know of any examples from Scriptures that show this.  God can, and does direct the weather as He pleases however.

[Dad Ernie]

Greetings Butterfly,

I personal believe that every single storm or disater that occurs upon earth or anywhere for that matter is in complete control by GOD.

God most certainly uses every situation for His Glory and for the good of the saints. But as to his "controlling" everything, I would hesitate to go that far.

Man is also able to "control" the weather to some degree. He does so inadvertently by polution and by contributing to ozone depletion, as well as destroying the rain forests which produce most of the world's oxygen. Nuclear weapon detonation or any large explosions can alter the local weather and that in turn alters the universal weather picture. Drilling oil can cause earth changes. I'm sure there are other things man does such as heating up the atmosphere causing polar melting which raises the level of the oceans.

Man is also able to directly effect the weather, such as causing it to rain or snow or sleet or hail. It is reported that Russia has tried to sell technology that can produce hurricanes or cyclones or some other weather phenomena.

So God is in the business of allowing things to proceed of their own course, but according to scripture, He intercedes when He hears the heart cry of His people. He says:

2 Chronicles 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

1 Peter 5:6 Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time:

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

[Guest shilou]

Butterfly God also uses wheather to proclaim his wrath upon an unbelieving and unrepentant people. Some would like to think God is only loving and kind, but that would be so far off from scripture as to be credible. Read Exodus chapter 9, Revelation 11:9, Palms 105:32 78:47, I could give you many other places to look but the bottom line is there is nothing under heaven that God is either not in control of or allows. It is like the ozone layer we may be affecting it by our actions, but come on God is God he could choose to just stitch it back together again. He built it in the first place, so in effect although we may believe we have control over it by our actions it is really because God allows it and we will suffer the consequences thereof. The wind, the water, the hail, and all of creation belongs to God and He can send any bit of it where He chooses. It was God who told the waters where to part, it was God who placed the earth in it's cycle, and called upon day and night at His command. You see if we truly believe we can make it happen then we believe we can make it stop happening with all our wisdom and technology. And God laughs from His heavenly throne and says, why do the nations plot in vain.

Humbly waiting upon His return

Shilou

[godrulz]

God-Man: Job 1:6-22  Satan went out from the presence of God with permission to afflict Job "...everything he has is in your hands, but on the man himself do not lay a finger...when suddenly a mighty WIND swept in from the desert...and they are dead..."

God did not directly kill Job's children  (the THIEF comes to kill and destroy). Satan seems to have used a wind to knock the house down.

Jesus rebuked the wind and the waves (Mark 4:35-41, etc.) to calm the storm. Some conservative scholars feel he rebuked the demonic powers behind the destructive weather, and not inanimate wind/water only. This is based on the technical Greek term (also used in Mk. 1:25 "Be quiet!...Come out of him. The evil spirit shook...") =Gk. perfect tense= 'be muzzled and remain so'= used of dispossessing a demonic spirit of his power.

I think there may be other allusions to the limited possibility of Satan energizing the weather (rarely) for his destructive plans (at least anecdotally...some have rebuked tornados/ droughts, etc. with  some effect).

Certainly God is the Lord of creation. Reasonably, some weather is  merely a result of the type of physical world God created (heat, cold, solar energy, man, moisture, etc. all have a natural role).

[Ovedya]

However, it could be reasonably argued that God gave Satan the authority to use fire from heaven and wind to kill Job's family and servants.  Take note of verse 12:

"And the LORD said to Satan, "Behold, all that he has is in your power; only upon himself do not put forth your hand." So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD."

There seems to be an exchange of authority here from God to Satan.  In the preceding verse Satan says, Put forth your hand..." But here God seems to be saying, "I give you authority to touch him."  The same word is spoken again to Satan in 2:6.

The word for "power" in the Hebrew is translated "hand."  So literally, the Lord said to Satan, "...all that he has is in your hand."  This could be an indicator that God handed Job over to Satan, giving Satan the authority to do what he could to stumble him.  But then it could also be an indicator that God was giving Satan the authority to use whatever means he could to stumble Job as well.

I always thought the term "rebuke" in the New Testament Greek was an interesting one.  In each instance where the word is used, is it used always as a sharp admonition, or could it sometimes be used in the sense of the other defintion, "to show honor to"?   The two roots of the word are "upon, at, by, before, etc." showing position, and "to fix a value to; honor, to have in honor, revere, venerate."  Like any other word, it matters how it is used, however (obviously).

So taking a look at Matthew 4:39, it says, "and He arose and rebuked the wind, and said to the sea, "Peace, be still..."  Did the Lord show honor then say "Peace..." or did He show stern admonition as a Father would to a son who did something wrong, and then say, "Peace..."  It would seem to me anyway, that the word "Peace..." should follow a peaceful word or attitude.  Taking into account the Lord's behavior prior to this even, I tend to think that He was pretty calm.

It is interesting to consider, though, that many of the life-threatening situations the apostles went through were on the ocean.  Have you ever heard of the theory that demons inhabit the oceans?

[godrulz]

Some believers have written books thinking that the Bermuda Triangle is demonic (this is speculation). Others feel Hades/hell was at the center of the earth? (again speculation). There is the supposed Lost City of Atlantis? Some sea creatures (?Leviathan?/dragons?) are thought to be demonic?

If anything, Satan is the prince of the power of the AIR.

Interesting to speculate, but you are right to want to find more explicit Scriptures for our beliefs.

Thanks for your insights.

[Ovedya]

I think the Jews believed Hades to be in the center of the earth.  Don't know if you would find this specifically in Scripture, but some other texts might say so.

I find these things very interesting, but don't really get too paranoid about them, if you know what I mean.  If Satan can cause natural disasters, then it is only because God allows him to for His purpose.  As such God is really the one in control anyway, and Satan is a fool....well, he's a fool no matter what.

[angels4u]

All those things happen because we live in a fallen world, it started when Eve ate from the fruit and things will only get better when Jesus returns! But for now God is allowing all those things to happen and the devil knows his time is short and he will take all the chances he gets to get people to focus on all other things exept Jesus and His Salvation plan.

This earth is getting darker and darker and Jesus told us those things would happen before His return, but He also told us not to fear, because He is still on the throne!!

PTL< Angels