Gay Marriage or Civil Union?

[stevehut]

In Romans 1:26-27, homosexual behavior (both male and female) is clearly pictured as a sin. This letter was written to the Romans who at least condoned, if not openly accepted, homosexuality

[Arthur Durnan]

The ONLY sexual relationship Jesus Christ ever approved was heterosexual monogamy within the framework of commitment in Holy Matrimony. AMEN!

http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com

[PBob]

In Romans 1:26-27, homosexual behavior (both male and female) is clearly pictured as a sin. This letter was written to the Romans who at least condoned, if not openly accepted, homosexuality

[stevehut]

heterosexual monogamy within the framework of commitment in Holy Matrimony.

Yup.

[ray]

This my Bible study an what scriptures I have on the issue of homosexuality.

Homosexuality

What the Bible says from Old Testament to New Testament?

Including the battle of the mind.

Before we can look at this topic I think it is important to understand some definitions of words that are associated with homosexuality.

Definitions According to Webster

[PBob]

A great!!! study and a "tolerant" point of view in my opinion. Again, I want to emphasize some of the job (I believe) of the Holy Spirit - to reveal truth - to convict us of sin. Not my yob, man. I bring the good news along with the agape love of Christ as one crying in the wilderness with a compassionate roar. Free will is a precious gift from God for all of us - we can choose to use it His way or the other way but regardless of our choices God still calls the shots and I really don't think He is about to consult me or anyone else. He "sits in the heavens and does whatever He pleases" whether you and I like it or not. that old bumper sticker says it all "GOD SAID IT - I BELIEVE IT - THAT SETTLES IT" You can get rid of the part about I BELIEVE IT because whether you and I believe it or not if He said it that SETTLES IT.

The Lord says " Let us sit down and reason togetrher" I.ve done this on numerous occations in my 65 years and have yet to hear Him say, "Oh, now I understand your way I was wrong." as He hits His head with the palm of His hand.

Relevant Scriptures: (ASV) I'm sure ther are more ....

1Jo 5:7 And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is the truth.

Joh 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he shall guide you into all the truth

Joh 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may be with you for ever,

Joh 14:17 even the Spirit of truth: whom the world cannot receive; for it beholdeth him not, neither knoweth him: ye know him; for he abideth with you, and shall be in you.

Joh 16:8 And he, when he is come, will convict the world in respect of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:

Note: Great free Bible is avilable on the internet ' "e- sword" you can get multiple versions, commentaries, etc -it's filled with all kindso tools like macros for your word processor. Since I don't think I am allowed to put a URL here I recommend you go to "google" and search e-sword - I just did it - its the first thing that comes up.

[freedfromsin]

Hello PBob,

while I am not at this point in total agreement with your methods or advice on how to deal with the homosexual I am open to hear what you are saying and weighing it with scripture and what I feel that I am hearing from the Lord. My question is this; Using your method how many or perhaps what percent of those you speak with convert? I am not looking for perfect stats, just some idea of success. God bless

[PBob]

BELOW IS AN EDITED E-MAIL I RECENTLY RECEIVED FROM A MISSIONARY FRIEND - IMAGINE IF THE US PASSED A LAW THAT SAID NO HOME SCHOOLING AND LEGALIZED PROSTITUTION, DRUGS, EUTHANASIA AND HOMOSEXUALITY (SOME OF THESE LAWS ARE ALREADY PASSED OR IN ONE OF GOV HOUSES)java script:add_smilie("","smid_55")

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Praise the Lord, we are finally leaving for the Netherlands on January 9th! We would appreciate your prayers for...

.REMOVED SECTION

...for our quick adjustment to being back in Europe, especially for Nathan.

...that we would be able to get an exemption for TONY (NAMED CHANGED) to finish out this school year at his online homeschool. Prostitution, drugs and euthanasia are legal in Holland, but homeschooling is not!

...for open doors for the gospel and the work we've been called to do!

Thanks for your prayers! EMPASIS MINE PBOB

Edited January 6, 2007 by PBob

[RustyAngeL]

The ONLY sexual relationship Jesus Christ ever approved was heterosexual monogamy within the framework of commitment in Holy Matrimony. AMEN!

http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com

Right Arthur. You can put any spin on this you want. Call it gay marriage or Civil Union but God calls it sin. We are to respond to the gays as Jesus would. Love the people but hate and reject the lifestyle. This topic has been around the block about a million times but the answer is still the same. It's sin. You won't go to hell because you are gay. You go to hell because you reject Jesus. If you accept Christ then you must accept what His word says and he calls the homosexual lifestyle an abomination to Him. I have known gays that have tried to straddle the fence when it comes to this. I know a man who has accepted Christ yet says he's gay and always will be. He doesn't pratice the lifestyle. I don't buy into that either. God did not create him that way therefore he can be changed by the power of God, but had taken the easy way out. In my mind it's a chosen lifestyle and can be changed if you give yourself over to God.

[PBob]

The ONLY sexual relationship Jesus Christ ever approved was heterosexual monogamy within the framework of commitment in Holy Matrimony. AMEN!

http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com

Right Arthur. You can put any spin on this you want. Call it gay marriage or Civil Union but God calls it sin. We are to respond to the gays as Jesus would. Love the people but hate and reject the lifestyle. This topic has been around the block about a million times but the answer is still the same. It's sin. You won't go to hell because you are gay. You go to hell because you reject Jesus. If you accept Christ then you must accept what His word says and he calls the homosexual lifestyle an abomination to Him. I have known gays that have tried to straddle the fence when it comes to this. I know a man who has accepted Christ yet says he's gay and always will be. He doesn't pratice the lifestyle. I don't buy into that either. God did not create him that way therefore he can be changed by the power of God, but had taken the easy way out. In my mind it's a chosen lifestyle and can be changed if you give yourself over to God.

Without the WORD men do what is "right in their own eyes". I am a firm believer in the Bible and trust the Holy Spirit to reveal truth to me. In a conversation with a close friend who is gay - he said I have been this way since I was born - (how do I know)- so i discussed the pertinent scriptures with him and said something like - because of sin all of creation is messed up - mutations, diabetes, blindness, etc. - Only the Lord really knows what we may be going through but He is righteous and will always forgive our sin if we repent and ask. I then said, You know what, I think God is more concerned about what we want to do than what we do. We cannot just deny Him to indulge in the things of the flesh. I aslo reminded him that, "Greater is He that is in you (me) than he that is in the world."

I was able to have this discussion because we had a relationship based on love and respect not my opinions or his or our own thoughts. I always try to use the Bible as my proof and basically say - don't argue with me, I'm just the messenger. What iif the Bible is true? Debating the WORD, in my opinion, only leads to alienation - I try to show them God's word and leave it up- to the Holy Spirit to reveal to them the truth and to convict them ofther sin.

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I POSTED THE ABOVE EARLIER - CONSIDER THE CONVERSATION.... WHAT I AM POSTING BELOW IS NOT MEANT TO APPROVE HOMOSEXUALITY OR PROVIDE AN EXCUSE TO CONTINUE IN THE GAY LIFE STYLE....

I AM A SCIENTIST (PHD MEDICAL BIOCHEMISTRY) - NOT THAT THAT MEANS ANYTHING - BUT I WORKED YEARS IN BIOCHEMISTRY AND CLINICAL CHEMISTRY AND FEEL THAT GAYNESS COULD BE A RESULT OF SOMETHING MORE THAN CHOICE - (UNPROVEN- YES I AM SURE THERE IS CHOICE INVOLVED BUT THE SEXUAL URGE IN EVEN CHRISTIANS CAN LEAD TO BAD CHOICES) - A RESULT OF MUTATION, ETC. LET ME EXPLAIN. I KNOW PEOPLE WHO THINK THAT SOMEONE WITH DIABETES OR CLINICAL DEPRESSION OR MENTAL DISEASE OR CANCER OF THE STOMACH OR........ HAVE APPARENTLY DONE SOMETHING WRONG OR ARE POSSESSED OR DON'T HAVE ENOUGH FAITH AND SHOULD NOT TAKE MEDICINE - WHICH I GUESS IMPLIES THEY DON'T TRUST GOD. WELL I AM CONFIDENT THAT MANY DISEASES, MUTATIONS, ABNORMALITIES, HORMONAL PROBLEMS...ETC ARE INHERITED, A RESULT OF A MUTATION, A RESULT OF EXPOSURE TO CHEMICALS, ETC AND THEY ARE PRESENT IN NEW BORNS. I HAVE ALSO BEEN IN FELLOWSHIP WITH AN INDIVIDUAL WHO WAS TRUELY TRANS-SEXUAL... I MET HER AS SAMANTHA AND KNEW HIM LATER AS SAM - HE/SHE WAS BORN WITH BOTH MALE AND FEMALE SEXUAL ORGANS - GENETICALLY HE WAS XYY OR XXY RELATIVE TO HIS CHROMOSOMES - MALES ARE XY AND FEMALES ARE XX. IN ANY CASE AT ABOUT 40 AFTER LIVING A VERY CONFUSED AND HURTFUL LIFE AS A WOMAN HE BEGAN TAKING MALE HORMONES, HAD AN OERATION AND IS NOW LIVING AS A MALE IN A MARITAL RELATIONSHIP OF OVER 10 YEARS. DID GOD CREATE HIM THAT WAY? NO - SEE EXPLAINATION BELOW...

BEFORE, PROVIDING FURTHER DISCUSSION - CONSIDER THIS STATEMENT IN THE ABOVE QUOTE FROM MY PREVIOUS POST, "I then said, You know what, I think God is more concerned about what we want to do than what we do. We cannot just deny Him to indulge in the things of the flesh. I aslo reminded him that, "Greater is He that is in you (me) than he that is in the world." I DID IN FACT ALSO DISCUSS REPENTANCE AND FORGIVENESS WHICH IF I REMEMBER IS FREELY GIVEN TO ALL WHO APPLY..

WHY IS THERE MUTATION, DISEASE, PAIN, ETC CONSIDER THESE FIVE REASONS:

WHAT ARE REASONS FOR PAIN AND SUFFERING - I WILL POST THIS IN ANOTHER FORUM AS WELL -

1. MY FREE WILL - I CAN MAKE DECISIONS AND CHOICES THAT CAN CAUSE ME PAIN AND SUFFERING, IE, SMOKING, DRUGS, HOMOSEXUALITY, ETC

2. YOUR FREE WILL - I DON'T EVEN KNOW YOU AND YOU COULD MEET ME AND DECIDE TO HIT ME OVER THE HEAD WITH A 2X4 BECAUSE YOU WANT MY MONEY. YOUR CHOICE CAUSED ME PAIN AND SUFFERING

3. SIN - THE BIBLE TELLS US THAT BECAUSE OF SIN ALL OF CREATION IS IN A TURMOIL - CONSIDER THE COSMOS BUT MORE CLOSE TO HOME - DISEASE, AGING, DEATH, MUTATIONS, BLINDNESS, ETC. (ROMANS 8:15 - 8:22)

4. SATAN - ROAMS THROUGHOUT THE WORLD SEEKING WHOM HE CAN DEVOUR - I CANNOT EXPLAIN ALL THIS BUT I FEEL CONFIDENT THAT SATAN CAUSES PAIN AND SUFFERING WHEREVER GOD PERMITS HIM TO (CONSIDER JOB)

FINALLY

5. GOD - THE WORD SAY HE CHASTISES AND DISCIPLINES THOSE WHOM HE LOVES (I REMEMBER DAD DOING THAT - IT SURE FELT LIKE PAIN) THERE ARE MANY OTHER TIMES WHEN THE LORD ALLOWED SATAN OR HIS ANGELS TO BRING PAIN AND SUFFERING TO MAN BECAUSE OF THEIR DISOBEDIENCE.

IN THE MEANTIME WE ARE CALLED TO BE LIGHT AND SALT TO BE HIS WITNESSES AND TO SHOW HIS LOVE TO A DYING WORLD. HE IS RIGHTEOUS AND JUST AND WILL DO WHAT IS RIGHT.

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