genesis 1

[MorningGlory]

After reading this long, and endlessly looping thread, one 'fact' emerges from posts of nonbelievers. The continuous attempt to marginalize or deny the creation of the universe by Almighty God. They must attempt this and have been doing so relentlessly for millenia; albeit without success. Most atheists are sincere. And they sincerely don't realize they are being used by the Deceiver.

Go to your local sandy beach, if you can. Grab a handfull of sand. As each individual grain of sand runs out between your fingers, reflect on the fact that for each grain escaping your fingers, there is a star somewere, and that you will have to sift every grain of sand on this planet before you have matched all of the stars.

Our own milky way is pretty big, but another galaxy in our local group, M31, has more than 1000,000,000,000 stars. Each is a stellar system, a large proportion of which will have planets. If only 1 in a million is suitable for life, there might be a billion planets capable of life, just in one galaxy.

Take a look at this amazing view of space. This is the area of space that would be covered by a dime at 75 feet away. The whole of space looks like this. Except, that of course, that it doesn't, since we still can't see all of it - there's even more.

In 2007 you are able, like humans have never before been able, to see the true wonder of the universe. And, granted this stupendous view, granted to you by those scientists you despise, there you still are, nose deep in an ancient book, and you still literally beiieve that all this was done in a day, because some arabic nomads in a desert, 4,000 years told you so? Give me strength!

Did you know that after the big bang, the temperature of the universe was so hot that atoms could not form for 400,000 years? So photons could not exist, and 'Let there be light! had to wait a while? No, you probably didn't...

"Being used by the Deceiver"? Wake up! There's a far deeper beauty out there than any god you can conceive of with your puny insight. What you lack in spades, my friend, is imagination.

Quoting your Master to ME? I'm flattered..............

[MorningGlory]

Did you know that after the big bang, the temperature of the universe was so hot that atoms could not form for 400,000 years? So photons could not exist, and 'Let there be light! had to wait a while? No, you probably didn't...

Did you know that after the big bang there was......oh, yeah, there WAS no big bang. But, your comments read as if YOU are so hot that atoms could not form on your forehead. Better get used to the fact that Christians don't buy the big lie, my friend.

[Floatingaxe]

And where, pray tell did you come up with such a factoid? It is from someone's imagination.

Nah. Cosmology 101

*****WARNING*******

Reading the above may cause learning, which is dangerous, and to be avoided at all costs, unless one wants to be in touch with REALITY.

God is one huge, colossal, giant, stupendous, humongous GOD!!

But as I said, you really haven't grasped just how humungous the universe is.

Who can? All I know is that the universe is smaller than God.

PS: reading that link was like reading a comic book.

[MorningGlory]

Just frustration, H-E. Explaining easy science here is rather like explaining to a rather backward boy of 15 that there are no fairies at the bottom of the garden. I'm beginning to get the impression that there are one or two people here are now going to be upset because they actually still believe in the fairies...(sigh)

[Guest]

Since this is a science vs faith section, let's do some science. Let's imagine I am an unbeliever, casting around for a religion into which to put my faith. I have come across the Greek and the Jewish accounts of creation. How would you explain to me, in scientific terms, how the Genesis story is obviously the correct version?

Of course Dave I can no more explain the Truth of The Bible than I can cause you to be born again.

This is a spiritual awakening and you must open yourself up to see and to receive The Truth.

Dave, no other man can do it for you.

Unless you surrender your will to God or unless you are willing to take your stand on what God shows you to be true, you most likely will never see Jesus except as your judge.

I pray you see Jesus as your Beloved Savior.

If you would read The Gospel of John and look up to God, as if there is a God, and honestly promise Him that you will take your stand on what He shows you to be True and to follow it wherever it carries you, you will see Jesus is The Christ and The Son of God and you will believe and you will be saved.

Great Science Stuff Dave!

Thank you for the encouragement to check it out.

This is so cool!

As the universe can be described by such coordinates, the Big Bang is not an explosion of matter moving outward to fill an empty universe; space itself expanded and caused the physical distance between two comoving points to increase.

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang

Dear Dave since this is a Science Vs Faith section, let's do some faith.

This rather backward boy of 64 will peak into his Beloved Book of Faith and check out the exciting "NEW" discovery of stretchy space (by cosmology).

This is so cool!

Faith and science agree.

Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.

Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?

Job 38:4-5

Thus saith the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, and his Maker, Ask me of things to come concerning my sons, and concerning the work of my hands command ye me.

I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded.

Isaiah 45:11-12]

And forgettest the LORD thy maker, that hath stretched forth the heavens, and laid the foundations of the earth; and hast feared continually every day because of the fury of the oppressor, as if he were ready to destroy? and where is the fury of the oppressor?

Isaiah 51:13

He hath made the earth by his power, he hath established the world by his wisdom, and hath stretched out the heaven by his understanding.

Jeremiah 51:15

I love God.

I love science.

Go figure!

Love, Joe

[MorningGlory]

It must edifying for you, davem, to be so intellectually superior to that 'rather backward boy of 15.' You are NOT however, from reading your comments, one whose education and training make them superior to other posters on this forum. In fact, several who post here have a better grasp of science. To post the Greek myth, as if it was comparable to Genesis, is arrogance in it's highest form, my friend. It seems as if it is YOU who believe in fairies. I guess atheists have to believe in SOMETHING.

I don't of course, believe in the Greek myth. However, it is a nice poetic piece, suitable for explaining beginnings of the universe to unsophisticated people of several thousand years ago. There are lots of creation myths in the world - the Genesis account is one of several dozens, if not hundreds. Horizon asked if it was luck, or insight from God. I posted the Greek myth, which also has a beginning, a creation of man, and a reason for all the ills in the world. Just like Genesis. In fact, remarkably like Genesis, except for multiple Gods. Was that luck, or a direct explanation from their gods? How can we tell the difference? What's the actual evidence?

Since this is a science vs faith section, let's do some science. Let's imagine I am an unbeliever, casting around for a religion into which to put my faith. I have come across the Greek and the Jewish accounts of creation. How would you explain to me, in scientific terms, how the Genesis story is obviously the correct version?

I pointed you to the 'Cosmology 101' web site, and you called it a comic. Perhaps you could explain why, rather than just scoffing at it? You accuse me of being arrogant, yet you just dismissed the life's work of all the cosmologists on the planet. Isn't that also just a teensy bit arrogant? The page mentions the Cosmic Microwave Background, which was a prediction of the big bang theory. Maybe you, or one of the people on this board who has a better grasp of science than I do, would kindly explain to me the reason for the existence of the CMB? After all, the CMB is one of the simplest predictions of the big bang theory.

I look forward to your answer.

You should reread my comment, davem. While I did take exception to the Greek mythology vs Genesis statement, I did not mention, nor scoff at, nor dismiss the life's work of cosmologists; it's amazing that you could read what I wrote and comprehend something else. I read up on the CMB theory and it actually makes sense. Of course, I don't see the theory as a prediction of the 'big bang'. I see it as the logical result of a created universe. Why try to make a logical discovery into the antithesis of Genesis? The Lord created everything; don't you think that includes the Cosmic Microwave Background and the cosmologists themselves? Of course other belief systems echo Genesis; I believe Man was created with the knowledge of the Beginning and the Creator hardwired into his soul.

If you were looking about for a religion I would tell you the Truth and, if you were ready, you would understand it and come to the Lord. I hope that happens for you one day.