The Book of Life

[endure4salvation]

endure, it's pointless to provide scriptures.... this is the fifth thread on this topic, and it doesn't matter how many scriptures that we post, they are disregarded. what a shame

Yea, but don't forget that there are probably a lot of people who read these that will not post.

It is for them that I do this. If they are on the edge, they may come back when they see the hard warnings from God.

[Adstar]

I've posted this before but never really got any reaction but here goes again. The judgment at the end of the millenium is pretty much universally accepted to be the judgement of the unsaved. Why then does God have to have the Book of Life checked if He already knew they were the unsaved? Why wouldn't he just cast them all into the Lake of Fire? Could it be because some of the unsaved are found in the book of life as being unworthy of harsh punishment? It sure seems that way or why would God have the book checked? BTW, it also says that there were other books other than just THE book of life. It obviously doesn't say that all the unsaved were cast into the lake of fire, but it does say that DEATH and HELL are cast into the lake of fire, and WHOSOEVER WAS NOT FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF LIFE but it does not say all the unsaved at all.

Hello smasher.

I believe that the first resurrection will be people who have accepted the Messiah Jesus as their savor. this resurrection occurs at the start of the millenium. So only the saints will be raised. The second resurrection at the end of the millenium will be for all the rest. People who have faith in God will be included in the second resurrection, they will be like Abraham justified by faith. These people lived before the time of the Messiah Jesus.

I agree with you that if they where all to be condemned then there would be no point in looking into the Book of Life.

All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Adstar]

endure, it's pointless to provide scriptures.... this is the fifth thread on this topic, and it doesn't matter how many scriptures that we post, they are disregarded. what a shame

Yea, but don't forget that there are probably a lot of people who read these that will not post.

It is for them that I do this. If they are on the edge, they may come back when they see the hard warnings from God.

Amen endure

We should not forget we are not just talking to people set in their ways, There are a lot of people out their who are still searching.

All praise The Ancient Of Days

[Adstar]

Hello His Son

Phil 4:3

3 And I intreat thee also, true yokefellow, help those women which laboured with me in the gospel, with Clement also, and with other my fellowlabourers, whose names are in the book of life.

(KJV)

[This tells us how we get into the book of life.]

This simply states that their names are in the book of life. It does not say when their names where entered?

Rev 13:8

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

(KJV)

This states that only those people not written into the book of life will worship the AC again it does not state when or if their names where removed?

Rev 17:8

8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

(KJV)

This one actually says that the people who are going to wonder after the beast. Their names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world. This scripture actually points to their names not being in the book of life from the foundation of the world. From creation.

Rev 20:15

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

(KJV)

Here again there is not indication that their names where ever written into the book of life.

Rev 21:27

27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

(KJV)

And again no indication either way when their names where written into the book of life.

By the way I am not a calvinist.

All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[CWJ]

Phil 4:3

3 And I intreat thee also, true yokefellow, help those women which laboured with me in the gospel, with Clement also, and with other my fellowlabourers, whose names are in the book of life.

(KJV)

[This tells us how we get into the book of life.]

Rev 13:8

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

(KJV)

Rev 17:8

8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

(KJV)

Rev 20:15

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

(KJV)

Rev 21:27

27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

(KJV)

It will take some fancy rewritting to support the idea that all names are written in the book of life.

Psalms 69:27-28..."Add iniquity to their iniquity, And let them not come into your righteousness,

(28)..Let them be blotted out of the book of the living. And not be written with the righteous."

"Not written" is the same as being blotted out.

The CONTEXT of 2Peter 2:20 is set by the example of the sow and the dog, NOT being made a new creature.

The parable of the sower shows these type to be "not really saved".

Still none has shown any scripture that says one can become un-re-born.

[CWJ]

I agree that if you reject Jesus THEN you are blotted out.

I would like to point out that there is no verse in the Bible that says rejecting Christ will cause your name to be blotted out. It is:

Sin

Taking away from God's Word

God wants ALL to repent and be saved. Read 2Peter3:9.

This makes it logical that ALL names are begun in the book of life.

Do a study and you will see that only ones who do not do the will of the Lord are blotted out.

[CWJ]

Endure...you just don't understand what being re-born means.

Look up the definition of an overcomer in the bible....it's in 1John 5.

Your post just nowhere shows that we "loose" salvation once having received it.

I have looked up 1 John 5. If you read Young's Literal Translation, you will see that the term 'believe' is rendered 'IS BELIEVING' thereby making is conditional upon continued belief, not a one-time belief good forever.

And there is no such thing as "loose" salvation just as there is no such thing as "tight" salvation. You should probably spell it "lose" and it means forsake whereas "loose" means to loosen.

My post clearly states that those whom are sinning against God will be blotted from the Book of Life.

Where are you getting scriptural evidence of the entering of names in the of life?

To my knowledge, there is no verse that clearly says, "It is at this point where your name is written in the Book of Life." I will have to ask you or anybody else to post it.

Where is your scriptural evidence of God blotting one's names out when they reach the age of accountability?

[Rick]

[ Quote ]

" Please take close note of the bolded section here. It say that some are washed and then return. What does being washed mean? Acts 22 says that baptism washes away sins after conversion to Christianity.

Those are saved people who go back and forfeit their salvation."

I hope this isnt taken the wrong way, Just wanted to point out something.

Baptism does not save. If it did, then John the Baptist saved many people, including Jesus.

" And now why tarriest thou? arise and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord." Acts 22:16.

This verse does not signify that baptism washes away sin. Calling upon the name of the Lord brought his salvation.

" And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." Acts 2:21. Romans 10:13.

Even John recognized that Jesus was the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. John 1:29.

" For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: Not with wisdom of words, lest the cross should be made of none effect. " 1 Cor. 1:17.

" Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas, And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. And they spake unto him the Word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house. And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his , straightway." Acts 16:29-33.

" For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any should boast." Eph. 2:8-9.

Baptism is a work. It is obediance to the command of God.

The cleansing we receive is not by the act of baptism, but by an act of God.

" Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost. " Titus 3:5.

Your Brother in Christ,

Rick

[nebula]

Why is it that people are afraid to say, "I don't know."?

I've grown up learning interpretations of the Scripture before someone finally challenged me to check for myself what the Scriptures say apart from the interpretations.

Seeing things that way, there's a lot we argue about that just is not as clear as we want them to be.

Example: do babies who die go to Heaven or Hell? Well, we can pull verses out to try to piece whatever together. But point blank, it does not say. Sure, I would hope the aborted babies, since they never even had the chance to sin, go to Heaven. But the Scriptures do not specifically say.

Now, Scriptures mention this thing called the Book of Life. Scriptures mention names being written in the book (or being found written in the Book, anyway). Scriptures also mention names being blotted out. Point blank, it does not say when names are written in. To say they are written at this time or that they were always written there is a speculation.

Now, if someone can dig up some cultural research to show that the idea of these "Books" had some relevance to their understanding and there was a certain principle by how they operated that could clarify this issue, a good case may be presented tehn for whatever direction it goes. Otherwise, I might as well be like a person in China 2000 years from now trying to figure out what - say - "raining cats and dogs" or "going postal" or "circular file" mean without any outside references.

Catch my drift?

And suppose we do resolve this debate? What then?

If I believe in "once saved, always saved," do I not care if I or someone I care about "backslides"? Of course not! I or the other person needs to repent. And if I or the other person dies before coming back to repentance, will what I or what the other person believes about the issue change what will happen? I doubt it.

I think our energies would be better used in figuring out how to bring a "backslidden Christian" back to repentance than in arguing what their fate would be should they die. (Unless you want to believe, "Oh, they'll go to Heaven any way, so why should I bother if they live in sin or not?" :c: )

[Dad Ernie]

Greetings All,

This has not been brought up before, but the "concept" of eternal security is not new to the New Covenant. Judaic Jews are convinced without a shadow of a doubt that they and they alone are the "elect of God". This goes for all of them for all time, even today. It just does not penetrate their skull that they could be "lost" unless they absolutely reject God. Even then many believe that even the lost Jews ARE elect. They have no concept of "repentence and being saved", and many regard the Christian's concept of Hell or the Lake of Fire as so much Christianese hype.

So it is not surprising that this concept of "eternal security" has carried over to many in mainstream Christianity. Yes, there are many verses that refer to the elect or the chosen AND their eternal security, but there are just as many, if not more, verses that show a person can "LOSE" their salvation. Now I believe in a death bed conversion - just ask the thief on the cross. So final eviction from the Lamb's Book of Life, I don't believe, comes until the day we can no longer accept our Lord's forgiveness - the day we die.

Being written in the Lamb's Book of Life, as I have pointed out, means we are written on Jesus' heart, even BEFORE the foundation of this world, and if you will notice, many other verses indicate the word "FROM" the foundation of this world - which only means "from the creation of this world". But it is SIN that CAN remove us from this Book, and the biggest sin is to refuse the FREE offer of grace we find in Christ. Therefore, babies, who knew no sin, remain in the Book, and those in the book and continue to live, God will try to "reconcile to Himself" up to the very last moment through the power of the Gospel. I have to believe this, because my concept of God is that HE is fair AND just. So though a baby may not accept Christ, his name is nevertheless written in the Book and if he/she has never had a chance to sin, then they REMAIN in the Book. I believe the same goes for the mentally infirm.

Blessings to all,

Dad Ernie