Feminism is anti-Christ

[apothanein kerdos]

1Be imitators of God, therefore, as dearly loved children 2and live a life of love, just as Christ loved us and gave himself up for us as a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God.

15Be very careful, then, how you live

[OopsMartin]

What you have done is made claims that certain words didn't appear in the Greek manuscripts, but that is not so with regard to the textus receptus. You are going by copies of manuscripts you picked up somewhere that support your position. Try pulling out a King James Bible and arguing your point from that.

I don't argue points from translations. ALL translations are imperfect no matter what language they are in. All my research is aimed at finding the truths from the original languages as best I can find them. When there are major differences in different copies it brings into question the omitted or added words. This is why a certain sections of the end of Mark is questionable as to it's authenticity. When we see things missing in some places but in other places, then the scholars must determine as best they can if it was added in for clarity of interpretation on the part of the copiers or something else. In this case I believe it was added in for clarity, but actually it ended up detracting from the precision of Paul's words.

[firehill]

Yay for finding that verse that says the husband is the head over the family!

[apothanein kerdos]

Yay for finding that verse that says the husband is the head over the family!

Does it matter? You'd argue with Jesus Himself if He gave the verses.

Regardless, just to show I'm a sucker for futility:

Colossians 3:18 - "Wives, be subject to your husbands, as is fitting in the Lord."

1 Timothy 3:12 - "Deacons must be husbands of only one wife, and good managers of their children and their own households."

In other words, before a man can become a deacon, he must be a good manager of his household and children.

Titus 2:5 - "to be sensible, pure, workers at home, kind, being subject to their own husbands, so that the word of God will not be dishonored."

1 Peter 3:1 - "In the same way, you wives, be submissive to your own husbands so that even if any of them are disobedient to the word, they may be won without a word by the behavior of their wives,"

I mean, you can argue all you want that the context of Ephesians 5 doesn't allow for the headship of the man...but honestly...that's just ignorant to the rest of scripture.

[firehill]

Yay for finding that verse that says the husband is the head over the family!

Does it matter? You'd argue with Jesus Himself if He gave the verses.

Regardless, just to show I'm a sucker for futility:

Colossians 3:18 - "Wives, be subject to your husbands, as is fitting in the Lord."

1 Timothy 3:12 - "Deacons must be husbands of only one wife, and good managers of their children and their own households."

In other words, before a man can become a deacon, he must be a good manager of his household and children.

Titus 2:5 - "to be sensible, pure, workers at home, kind, being subject to their own husbands, so that the word of God will not be dishonored."

1 Peter 3:1 - "In the same way, you wives, be submissive to your own husbands so that even if any of them are disobedient to the word, they may be won without a word by the behavior of their wives,"

I mean, you can argue all you want that the context of Ephesians 5 doesn't allow for the headship of the man...but honestly...that's just ignorant to the rest of scripture.

I'm sorry. Where's that verse again that instructs women to rule the home? Lemme go find it...

[rtwo]

Yay for finding that verse that says the husband is the head over the family!

Does it matter? You'd argue with Jesus Himself if He gave the verses.

Regardless, just to show I'm a sucker for futility:

Colossians 3:18 - "Wives, be subject to your husbands, as is fitting in the Lord."

1 Timothy 3:12 - "Deacons must be husbands of only one wife, and good managers of their children and their own households."

In other words, before a man can become a deacon, he must be a good manager of his household and children.

Titus 2:5 - "to be sensible, pure, workers at home, kind, being subject to their own husbands, so that the word of God will not be dishonored."

1 Peter 3:1 - "In the same way, you wives, be submissive to your own husbands so that even if any of them are disobedient to the word, they may be won without a word by the behavior of their wives,"

I mean, you can argue all you want that the context of Ephesians 5 doesn't allow for the headship of the man...but honestly...that's just ignorant to the rest of scripture.

I'm sorry. Where's that verse again that instructs women to rule the home? Lemme go find it...

STOP!!!!!!!

Okay. Let's please read each other's posts BEFORE posting. You two agree. At least here. Let's not start something silly.

[apothanein kerdos]

Yay for finding that verse that says the husband is the head over the family!

Does it matter? You'd argue with Jesus Himself if He gave the verses.

Regardless, just to show I'm a sucker for futility:

Colossians 3:18 - "Wives, be subject to your husbands, as is fitting in the Lord."

1 Timothy 3:12 - "Deacons must be husbands of only one wife, and good managers of their children and their own households."

In other words, before a man can become a deacon, he must be a good manager of his household and children.

Titus 2:5 - "to be sensible, pure, workers at home, kind, being subject to their own husbands, so that the word of God will not be dishonored."

1 Peter 3:1 - "In the same way, you wives, be submissive to your own husbands so that even if any of them are disobedient to the word, they may be won without a word by the behavior of their wives,"

I mean, you can argue all you want that the context of Ephesians 5 doesn't allow for the headship of the man...but honestly...that's just ignorant to the rest of scripture.

I'm sorry. Where's that verse again that instructs women to rule the home? Lemme go find it...

Like I said, you'd argue against it no matter what.

[firehill]

1 Timothy 5:14 Paul counsel's younger widows to marry and oikodespoteo, that is, the word is translated, 'be head of the home'.

Matthew

10:25

to be like his teacher, and the servant like his master. If the head of the house has been called Beelzebub, how much more the members of his household! NIV

10:25

It is enough for the disciple to become as his teacher, and the slave as his lord. If they called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more those of his household? GLT

13:27

And coming near, the slaves of the housemaster said to him, Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? Then from where does it have the darnel? GLT

Luke

13:25

From the time the Master of the house shall have risen up, and He shuts the door, and you begin to stand outside and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us. And answering, He will say to you, I do not know you, from where you are.

GLT

1 Timothy

5:14

Therefore, I desire the young women to marry, to bear children, to rule the house, giving no occasion to the adversary on account of reproach. GLT

Also see that the same word is used in Matthew13:52; 20:1, 11; 21:33; 24:43; Mark 14:14; Luke 12:39, 14:21, 22:11

firehill:I'm sorry. Where's that verse again that instructs women to rule the home? Lemme go find it...

AK:Like I said, you'd argue against it no matter what.

How can I argue against something that doesn't exist? The statement 'the husband is the head of the home' doesn't exist in the bible. You're arguing for something that isn't even there.

[Neopatriarch]

Yay for finding that verse that says the husband is the head over the family!

Does it matter? You'd argue with Jesus Himself if He gave the verses.

Regardless, just to show I'm a sucker for futility:

Colossians 3:18 - "Wives, be subject to your husbands, as is fitting in the Lord."

1 Timothy 3:12 - "Deacons must be husbands of only one wife, and good managers of their children and their own households."

In other words, before a man can become a deacon, he must be a good manager of his household and children.

Titus 2:5 - "to be sensible, pure, workers at home, kind, being subject to their own husbands, so that the word of God will not be dishonored."

1 Peter 3:1 - "In the same way, you wives, be submissive to your own husbands so that even if any of them are disobedient to the word, they may be won without a word by the behavior of their wives,"

I mean, you can argue all you want that the context of Ephesians 5 doesn't allow for the headship of the man...but honestly...that's just ignorant to the rest of scripture.

Now you've done it. You know they have 'answers' for these verses as well.

In my experience, egalitarians like to deny that the word for 'submit' means submit. For reference, here are the instances of hupotasso in the NT. (I did an Englishman's Concordance search for this, and the results are in NASB)

Luke 2:51 ...came to Nazareth, and He continued in subjection to them; and His mother ...

Luke 10:17 ...joy, saying,

[apothanein kerdos]

At least A.K., when I am discussing something with you, whether I agree or dissagree, there is some scriptural substance. You rarely find that in a Firehill post.

Well, she also denies the deity of Jesus and accepts the Apocrypha. What do you expect?

You and I disagree, but as Francis Schaeffer stated, the great divide of our day does not come between those who disagree over an interpretation of scripture, but over those who believe scripture is infallible and those who believe it is not.

1 Timothy 5:14 Paul counsel's younger widows to marry and oikodespoteo, that is, the word is translated, 'be head of the home'.

*sigh*

The exegetical fallacy of equivocation...similar to the logical fallacy. "If one Greek word is used elsewhere in scripture in one way, then it must be used the same way in all of scripture." This is an amateur mistake.

This, of course, ignores the broader context of scripture. You cannot use scripture to combat scripture. I offered up verses that, without a shadow of a doubt, show the wife is to submit to the husband and that he is the proper head of the house. You offer up one verse, out of context.

The passage you are dealing with is with widows who are unmarried. In this instance, it makes more since that the word would indicate "manage" the family instead of "rule" the family. This distinction fits with the whole of scripture. oikodespoteo does not always mean "head of the home" but can also mean "manager." This means the purpose takes commands and enforces those commands, but is not the originator of those commands.

Regardless, what I now expect is for you to argue this point whilst ignoring all the scriptures I gave.