Seatbelt bill hits bump in the road

[apothanein kerdos]

It's not just liberals, Kat, it's well intentioned parents, Christian conservatives even, who, for example, believe these hideous laws were written for "the good of children." Hogwash. And people like you and me who buck the system (sorry, Buck) are looked at as cold hearted because we happen to believe in the power of the individual to control their own destiny and the that of their children, and--imagine this--we believe that people KNOW what's best for themselves and their families when educated and presented with solutions.

At the risk of opening another can of worms, it's the same with people who get AIDS as a result of their own actiions, whether from sex or needles. Why should I have to pay their consequences?

I actually agree with that to a point. I think if they agree to go out to high school students on a regular basis and explain the dangers of drugs, homosexuality, promiscuous sex, etc., then they should be able to receive help from the government. If they wont' do that, then they're on their own. It's their own fault. Money spent on helping them could go to the innocent victims of HIV and AIDS, or towards finding a cure.

[Marnie]

It's not just liberals, Kat, it's well intentioned parents, Christian conservatives even, who, for example, believe these hideous laws were written for "the good of children." Hogwash. And people like you and me who buck the system (sorry, Buck) are looked at as cold hearted because we happen to believe in the power of the individual to control their own destiny and the that of their children, and--imagine this--we believe that people KNOW what's best for themselves and their families when educated and presented with solutions.

At the risk of opening another can of worms, it's the same with people who get AIDS as a result of their own actiions, whether from sex or needles. Why should I have to pay their consequences?

I actually agree with that to a point. I think if they agree to go out to high school students on a regular basis and explain the dangers of drugs, homosexuality, promiscuous sex, etc., then they should be able to receive help from the government. If they wont' do that, then they're on their own. It's their own fault. Money spent on helping them could go to the innocent victims of HIV and AIDS, or towards finding a cure.

I do not disagree with that.

[rtwo]

It's not just liberals, Kat, it's well intentioned parents, Christian conservatives even, who, for example, believe these hideous laws were written for "the good of children." Hogwash. And people like you and me who buck the system (sorry, Buck) are looked at as cold hearted because we happen to believe in the power of the individual to control their own destiny and the that of their children, and--imagine this--we believe that people KNOW what's best for themselves and their families when educated and presented with solutions.

At the risk of opening another can of worms, it's the same with people who get AIDS as a result of their own actiions, whether from sex or needles. Why should I have to pay their consequences?

I actually agree with that to a point. I think if they agree to go out to high school students on a regular basis and explain the dangers of drugs, homosexuality, promiscuous sex, etc., then they should be able to receive help from the government. If they wont' do that, then they're on their own. It's their own fault. Money spent on helping them could go to the innocent victims of HIV and AIDS, or towards finding a cure.

I do not disagree with that.

I could agree with that, as well.

[Marnie]

And since when is Kat afraid of opening a can of worms??

[Scarletprayers]

I think when she was 4, she was afraid but not since then!

[kat8585]

And since when is Kat afraid of opening a can of worms??

[hmh]

Maybe it's the libertarian in me, but if you want to be dumb enough to drive a car without wearing a seatbelt, that should be your choice.

Police have better things to worry about than giving tickets for seatbelt violations.

Maybe so but you would be surprised how many people are arrested for such minor infractions as having outstanding warrants for various felonies such as murder, robbery, rape, and burglary. (Yes, even murders who don't even attempt to run).

And your point is? The rest of us law abiding citizens have to be inconvenienced with random seat belt checks in hope that the police will, by chance, catch a murderer?? Sorry... This is the 21st century, there are other ways to catch these people that don't involve the harassment of citizens.

Harrassment of citizens? Inconvenienced with random seat belt checks? Have you been driving at night and been inconveinenced by a randon DUI checkpoint? Does the police in your town/county/state simply inconveinence you for not wearing your seatbelt or speeding? This maybe the 21st century, and this is a country where the criminals have more rights than their victims. Maybe you've been watching too much CSI on TV. That is FICTIONAL! We don't have the entire population of the US on a DNA database. We don't work our own DNA analysis. I'm fortunate to have a DNA lab where I work at. It takes an average of SIX MONTHS TO A YEAR to get a DNA analysis on a murder case. Over a year on other violent crimes. And burglaries? We don't even waste our time collecting DNA. The criminals have learned what to do and not to do, so now they are wearing full body coverings to prevent fingerprints and DNA being left at the scene. This kind of rhetoric of "the police have better things to do than to harrass citizens with seat belt checks" is on of the many reasons that most in law enforcement today have a VERY negative view of the average citizen. A police office gets shot on a traffic stop and what is the public's opinion? Why was he wasting time on pulling someone over for a broken tail light? BECAUSE IT'S HIS JOB! I have worked in law enforcement for 10 years now. No matter what a police office does, he/she will always be treated worse than the criminal. A police office shoots a criminal who just shot at him, the investigation against the office is 10 times more stringent against the officer AND it's automatically assumed and investigated that the officer was wrong in shooting his weapon. So this whole argument about harrassing law abiding citizens is not valid. Maybe you don't like to wear your seatbelt. Fine. Work in your state to repeal that law. The law here was repealed on wearing helmets while riding a motorcycle. If you choose not to wear your seatbelt and get into a car crash and get hurt, guess who's footing the bill for the ambulance and hospital? NOT THE INSURANCE COMPANY. YOU ARE. I have personal feelings about the entire insurance industry, but if there is a law that says you must wear your seat belt, then wear it. If you think it's an attack on your personal freedom, then by all means work in your state legislature to get the law repealed. I have worked numerous accidents in my career. In fact that what I primarily did for five years was an Accident Investigator. I have seen people who walked away from serious car accidents because they were wearing their seat belts. And I have seen people who died because they did not wear seat belts and would have walked away if they were. I have to question people is if that you think police officers have better ways to do their jobs, then what qualifies you to think so? So I challenge anyone here that if you think you know better, come work for a police agency for a year, and after that year, make your suggestions. Because then you might understand that the barriers facing law enforcement are these:

1. Political issues. Between politicians and citizens who refuse to believe that there really is a crime problem in your area.

2. Funding. The politicians would rather spend money on having a statue placed in front of city hall than put lap top computers with the latest crime fighting technology.

3. Court system. Arrest someone for beating a 70 year old woman and taking her purse that was witnessed by 5 people and caught on video only to have the state attorney's office drop the charges because "not enough evidence" or "no DNA was collected at the scene." (an example of the CSI Effect)

4. Citizens. Most of the citizens you are sworn to serve and protect would rather spit on you than see you in their neighborhood. But as soon as one of them needs you, then they complain that "The police never patrol their neighborhood."

So as you can see I am callous to the entire argument about cops have better things to do. I do this job because there is a scientific avenue that still attracks me and the feeling of getting the murderer and child rapist off of the streets because there is that segment of the population that really has been devoured by satan that is a threat to all of us. I face a constant barrage of critizism because "I have had to violate someone's rights" to prove a case from the defense attorneys and the citizens at large. I blame this on the educational system misleading and not even teaching what the Constitution really says, instead of the bias that is being taught today. If something as challenging were offered to me today, with the situation as it is in law enforcement today, I would jump on it in a heart beat. And as I would watch the world go nuts over why didn't the police do this or that, I would simply shake my head and snicker. Simply because most don't understand nor do they really want to.

[Marnie]

Got a burr under your butt, there?

Yes, I have been inconvenienced with random seat belt checks. Any reading this who hasn't? I resent it. I get pulled over and invariably I am deemed difficult because I don't answer their questions. Why? I can't. Do they care? NO. Eventually when they read my license, they find out I am mute, they start yelling at me like the card said "deaf," not mute. I know, that's funny...and it is. But the point is, I wasn't speeding, I am obeying the law of the land. Why pull me over? Besides, all the State guys know my car anyway.

My knowledge of criminal justice comes my formal education and my former employer, the US Federal government, so I do have a pretty good idea of what's available out there.

I didn't even post the numerous stats about how dangerous seat belts are because I figured everybody knew them. Everybody seems to have bought the notion all they do is save lives, which is false. Next to the airbag, seat belts are very dangerous, depending on your weight and build.

[hmh]

Got a burr under your butt, there?

Yes, I have been inconvenienced with random seat belt checks. Any reading this who hasn't? I resent it. I get pulled over and invariably I am deemed difficult because I don't answer their questions. Why? I can't. Do they care? NO. Eventually when they read my license, they find out I am mute, they start yelling at me like the card said "deaf," not mute. I know, that's funny...and it is. But the point is, I wasn't speeding, I am obeying the law of the land. Why pull me over? Besides, all the State guys know my car anyway.

My knowledge of criminal justice comes my formal education and my former employer, the US Federal government, so I do have a pretty good idea of what's available out there.

I didn't even post the numerous stats about how dangerous seat belts are because I figured everybody knew them. Everybody seems to have bought the notion all they do is save lives, which is false. Next to the airbag, seat belts are very dangerous, depending on your weight and build.

A burr? More like a set of barbed spikes.

What makes seatbelts dangerous to some is because they are designed for the adult that is six foot and weights 190. If your are five foot and 90 pounds soaking wet then there is a problem. I don't know if Volvo or Mercedes (again I go foreign, refer to the NASCAR post) makes a seat belt that is adjustible for smaller adults, but even those that are adjustable the other problem is the height of the seat back and the seat positioning. Airbags? I've seen some serious damage done by air bags. I would rather have the air bag removed and a pillow put in its place.

The reason the state guy are pulling you over is because they like harrassing you. Trust me, I know of a few that do that locally. Yes there are bad apples all over the place, but my issue is that even with the "technology" available, try doing my job on the local level, and not on the federal level. It's a whole different world and a whole different set of issues that are faced on the court level.

[Marnie]

A burr? More like a set of barbed spikes.

Airbags? I've seen some serious damage done by air bags. I would rather have the air bag removed and a pillow put in its place.

The reason the state guy are pulling you over is because they like harrassing you. Trust me, I know of a few that do that locally. Yes there are bad apples all over the place, but my issue is that even with the "technology" available, try doing my job on the local level, and not on the federal level. It's a whole different world and a whole different set of issues that are faced on the court level.

I have the barbed spikes when it comes to airbags! Man, I hate those things. There is something wrong when a safety device comes with warnings plastered all over the sun visor telling you how dangerous it is!

I suspected that's they were pulling me over, but humility forbade from saying it.

I actually am sympathetic towards police officers who actually do their jobs in an efficient and professional manner. I feel that often they are asked to do things they have no business doing, which is why "there isn't a cop around when you need one."

Just so you understand, I wear my seat belt, not because I am forced to, but because this one actually fits me comfortably. I'm not 6 feet, 190 pounds......