Sex and the Bible

[Vickilynn]

Addendum:

Lest anybody misunderstand what I mean by "intimacy." One of the most intimate moments I ever had with my husband was shortly after my operation. Of course, having intercourse was impossible, but I got one of the best back rubs in my life. What made it intimate was while he was rubbing my back, Mike was sharing some deep thoughts with me about his fears and such, and he really opened up like he never had before. So, intimacy is much more than a physical encounter; it's a spiritual one.

Shalom Marnie,

Well-said. Well-said.

Sierra, I believe you and Marnie agree if I'm not mistaken.

[Iryssa]

I like sex. Sex is fantastic when it's with your spouse. I had experience before I was married, and let me tell you, it was never as enjoyable then as it is now...before marriage there can be so many other factors besides just enjoying it with the person you love, like insecurity ("what if he breaks up with me if I don't?"), manipulation, pure and simple addiction...it's never as good or fulfilling. Seriously. Not worth it.

As far as sex for pleasure in marriage goes: I think it's great!! It's a very important kind of intimacy in a marriage relationship. If a married couple stops entirely (for reasons other than abstaining for a period of prayer or because of physical disability), it is almost always a symptom of another problem. I think it's important to keep it up (doesn't have to be every day or week or whatever...just whatever you're comfortable with) whether or not you're planning on having kids, because of the intimacy factor and so that neither party will be tempted to seek satisfaction elsewhere (1 Cor. 7:5).

[HAZARD]

"His left hand should be under my head, and his right hand should embrace me."

"How fair and how pleasent art thou, O love, for delights."

"Thy naval is like a round goblet, which wanteth not liquor: thy belly is like a heap of wheat set about with lillies."

"Thy two breasts are like two young roes that are twins which feed among the lilies."

"Thy neck is like a tower of ivory; thine eyes like the fish-pools in Heshbon."

All these and more love songs are written in the (Song of Solomon 1:1-17; 2:1-17; 3:1-11; 4:1-16; 5:1-16; 6:1-13; 7:1-13; and 8:1:14).

[Vickilynn]

PLease just remember that I have never said that man and wife should not enjoy sexual congress, only that the primary purpose of male and female union is procreation, and mutual comfort is secondary to that.

The major problem with this statement is that God is the creater and "manager" (to be worldly if I may) of our lives. If one believes that our life is molded and shaped through Christ, and person is infertile, then how can the primary purpose of sex be procreation? If God did not intend the couple have sex for the sole purpose of comfort, then why not take away their sex drive as well?

I'm sorry, Vicky, but I just do not agree that because God ordained marriage for procreation that that makes Him "manager" of our lives, as you put it. God ordained man to have fellowship with Him, but because of Adam's sin and our own, we do not, unless and until we are born again and become new creations in Christ. Does that make God a "manager"? And I don't believe that our lives are moulded and shaped through Christ - that would be a total waste of time as far as I am concerned - there's nothing in me worth moulding and shaping! Imagine trying to mould and shape a lump of poo like me? Poo, in whatever shape, is still a lump of poo! No, I am a new creation in Christ, my old life, the life I live in the flesh, is dead, it died with Christ, and therefore I count it as dead. Now I am resurrected with Christ, I am a new and incorruptible creation in Jesus, with the imputed righteousness of Christ, and therefore wholly acceptable to God the Father.

Furthermore- (and this is not a question solely for you Ruth, but everyone) what happens when a husband or wife loses their libido due to an accident, surgery, pregnancy or other unforseen situation? Is that marriage null and void because the couple can no longer consumate their marriage?

Of course not! What ever made you think that could be the case?

I assure each of you that there will be a point in your marriage when things are going to slow down and the bed will get mighty cold (pregnancy in my case). Does that make my marriage un-christian right now? what if my husband (God forbid) gets into an accident and is numb from the waist down- should I throw in the towel right there?? My personal opinion is that we have taken vows to remain married until death no matter what, and I will honour those vows. But some of the views expressed earlier seem to indicate a slightly different idea?? Maybe it's just my way of understand but if any of you could clarify that would be great.

I am keeping my marriage vows. I am married to an unbelieving husband. Also, through no wish of my own, I have slept in a separate room from my husband for 8 years. None of this in any way changes what God has said about my marriage or marriage in general. Just because I/we can't live up to God's perfect intent for my/our marriage, doesn't make it any less valid. Nor does it make me any more sinful - just incapable as a fallen human being, of being and having the best that God intended for humanity.

What God ordains as His perfect "recipe" for life, if you like, is different from what we are able to accomplish. But that doesn't mean that God's recipe isn't the best, nor does it necessarily mean that our inability to accomlish it is anything more or less than human fraility. What I believe is most important is that we are in agreement with God whether or not we manage to accomplish His perfect will and ordinances which, after all, were given for our best. I so dislike seeing God's Word traduced just because we find ourselves incapable of living up to it.

In Jesus,

Ruth

Shalom Ruth,

Unless Sierra's name is Vicky, then you have us mixed up. I did not write those posts.

And you have made some strong assertions as what G-d's "perfect recipe" is, yet you cannot support it by Scripture.

You said you dislike seeing "God's Word traduced", yet you cannot prove your point via G-d's Word.

Sister, I'm sorry, but in this case you are wrong to insist that your opinion is G-d's "perfect" anything. It just isn't the case. It IS your opinion and what G-d has shown YOU, yet because it is not Scripture, it is not applicable to all Believers, only those He leads in this way. This is the difference between Biblical conviction and Biblical mandate.

And pushing one's Biblical conviction onto others and saying it is Biblical mandate is not only incorrect, but it is harmful and hurtful to those precious Believers that G-d has led in another way. And especially harmful and hurtful to those Believers who cannot or chose not to have children.

We must be careful to follow OUR Biblical convictions for ourselves and not make the mistake of insisting others must do the same. The Scriptures are our authority, not man's opinions and convictions.

Let us be considerate and tenderhearted towards those Believers who cannot or choose not to have children and have sought the L-rd concerning it. To then read or hear from other Believers that they "sinning" is harmful and hurtful and NOT G-d's will because the Scriptures do NOT make it a mandate.

[Guest LadyC]

Sex is first and foremost for the procreation of children,

Sorry Ruth, we agree on most everything, but I strenuously disagree with you on this. I'd like to know your Biblical basis for that idea. The NT teaching about "coming together" never mentions procreation.

Sex was given as a gift by G-d to man first and foremost to be a demonstration of the kind of intimacy G-d wants with His children. That's why sex is not to be withheld in a marriage unless there is a mutual decision to do so for a time, for spiritual reasons.

Your kind of reasoning is highly offensive (I know you don't mean it that way) to the tens of thousands of fine Christian couples who can't have children for some reason.

I was paraphrasing the wedding ceremony from the Book of Common Prayer.

THE FORM OF SOLEMNIZATION OF MATRIMONY

DEARLY beloved, we are gathered together here in the sight of God, and in the face of this congregation, to join together this Man and this Woman in holy Matrimony; which is an honourable estate, instituted of God in the time of man's innocency, signifying unto us the mystical union that is betwixt Christ and his Church; which holy estate Christ adorned and beautified with his presence, and first miracle that he wrought, in Cana of Galilee; and is commended of Saint Paul to be honourable among all men: and therefore is not by any to be enterprised, nor taken in hand, unadvisedly, lightly, or wantonly, to satisfy men's carnal lusts and appetites, like brute beasts that have no understanding; but reverently, discreetly, advisedly, soberly, and in the fear of God; duly considering the causes for which Matrimony was ordained.

First, It was ordained for the procreation of children, to be brought up in the fear and nurture of the Lord, and to the praise of his holy Name.

Secondly, It was ordained for a remedy against sin, and to avoid fornication; that such persons as have not the gift of continency might marry, and keep themselves undefiled members of Christ's body.

Thirdly, It was ordained for the mutual society, help, and comfort, that the one ought to have of the other, both in prosperity and adversity. Into which holy estate these two persons present come now to be joined. Therefore if any man can shew any just cause, why they may not lawfully be joined together, let him now speak, or else hereafter for ever hold his peace.

I am sorry if you find it offensive. There is nothing in this that I can detect that is unscriptural.

Ruth

i'm a bit late to respond, but it seems to me whoever wrote that thing contradicted themselves...

signifying unto us the mystical union that is betwixt Christ and his Church; that's mentioned in the first paragraph, and should have remained there, since that is truly the primary purpose of a union of husband and wife.

[Guest LadyC]

Furthermore- (and this is not a question solely for you Ruth, but everyone) what happens when a husband or wife loses their libido due to an accident, surgery, pregnancy or other unforseen situation? Is that marriage null and void because the couple can no longer consumate their marriage? I assure each of you that there will be a point in your marriage when things are going to slow down and the bed will get mighty cold (pregnancy in my case). Does that make my marriage un-christian right now? what if my husband (God forbid) gets into an accident and is numb from the waist down- should I throw in the towel right there?? My personal opinion is that we have taken vows to remain married until death no matter what, and I will honour those vows. But some of the views expressed earlier seem to indicate a slightly different idea?? Maybe it's just my way of understand but if any of you could clarify that would be great.

as marnie said, there are other means of being intimate than intercourse. it's not a matter of being "guilted" into doing anything you don't want, it's a matter of biblical obligation. if there are medical reasons why intimacy is a bad idea, then the spouse should be understanding and accommodating, however God doesn't give us any wiggle room in that we are not to neglect the intimacy needs of our spouse. during times when physical intimacy is risky or painful, as long as the spouse is agreeable to waiting, great. and no spouse should ever guilt or force themselves on the other. however, each of us have a God-given responsibility to make sure that we are not giving satan a foothold in our marriage, or in our spouse's thoughts, by finding some means of meeting their sexual needs... and it IS a need.

of course it shouldn't be the center of anyone's marriage, and sex rarely IS the central focus of a married couple after the honeymoon phase is over. but the need is always there.... some people can be fullfilled in that way through OTHER forms of intimacy that have nothing to do with sex. women are more capable of that then men though, and so women need to be careful not to assume that the husband can live indefinitely without sexual stimulation and releaase of some sort. whether it's a man or a woman, if they never get satisfied at home, they'll get satisfied somewhere else.

[Guest LadyC]

Addendum:

Lest anybody misunderstand what I mean by "intimacy." One of the most intimate moments I ever had with my husband was shortly after my operation. Of course, having intercourse was impossible, but I got one of the best back rubs in my life. What made it intimate was while he was rubbing my back, Mike was sharing some deep thoughts with me about his fears and such, and he really opened up like he never had before. So, intimacy is much more than a physical encounter; it's a spiritual one.

Shalom Marnie,

Well-said. Well-said.

Sierra, I believe you and Marnie agree if I'm not mistaken.

the most intimate moment mark and i ever shared.... we'd been married only a short time, i'd had a stressful day, my kids were working my last nerve, and he came home. i was standing in the kitchen crying my eyes out and he wrapped his arms around me. i told him "i just wish i could ignore everything that i have to do, shut the bedroom door and let you make love to me...."

and his response was, as he stood their holding me tightly in the middle of the kitchen with my snot all over his shoulder.... "i AM making love to you, right now".

[Vickilynn]

i'm a bit late to respond, but it seems to me whoever wrote that thing contradicted themselves...

signifying unto us the mystical union that is betwixt Christ and his Church; that's mentioned in the first paragraph, and should have remained there, since that is truly the primary purpose of a union of husband and wife.

Shalom LadyC,

Excellent!!! Amen!

[MeCajunboy]

Part 1

Our worlds of Christianity and sexuality are commonly viewed as being miles apart. Someone once said, "Christian sex" is an oxymoron. We don't talk about sex or preach about sex unless it's a sermon that deals with "the sinfulness of sex" outside of marriage. When was the last time you heard a sermon preached on the positive side of sex or a sermon from the Song of Solomon. I'm not saying we need to be discussing sex openly, but we've got to understand that God created sex. Why not at least tell people what He has to say about it from a biblical perspective?

Believe it or not, God created sex as something good, and the bible actually has a lot to say on the subject. You may think, with all the warning about not having sex before marriage, that sex is bad. The Bible says something quite contrary to that. Sex is biblical, if looked at from a Godly perspective.

Here's what I see the Bible saying about Sex...

1. Sex is a Good Thing. Sex was created by God as something good. He gave a husband and a wife this gift as a way for them to express their love for one another. God did create sex to be a beautiful and enjoyable expressions of love, but only between a man and wife (Genesis 2:24; Proverbs 5:18-19; Song of Songs 7:6-7; 1 Corinthians 6:13). God also created sex as a way for a husband and wife to have children or as the bible says, "be fruitful and increase in number" (Genesis 1:27-28).

2. Sex was Created for a Husband and a Wife. Sex is in just about every movie, book, television show and song on the radio. Our world has become lax about sex, making it seem like sex is okay with anyone because it feels good, but the Bible does not agree. God created sex for the confines of marriage only, and He calls us to control our passions and wait for marriage (1 Corinthians 7:2-3; Hebrews 13:4; 1 Thessalonians 4:3-4).

3. God wants each Person in the Marriage to Conscientiously fulfill their mate's sexual needs and desires. Strong sexual needs exist in both husband and wife. Sex in marriage is wonderful! But like all blessings, there can be an accompanying curse. Unfulfilled sexual needs sometimes lead to illicit relationships. God addressed this strong sexual desire and need in humans through the writings of Paul in 1 Corinthians 7:2-5. "But since there is so much immorality, each man should have his own wife, and each woman her own husband. The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband. The wife's body does not belong to her alone but also to her husband. In the same way, the husband's body does not belong to him alone but also to his wife. Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control."

If you're interested in more information or helpful links, feel free to visit my blog.

Blessings,

Trey

Cajunboy:::: I think that we're all in agreement Trey, as long as you put sex in the right perspective. Perhaps it IS better to discuss it, because for many here, it may be taboo since we seem to have quite a few here that are not married and about all they can relate to is, courtship that God speaks of . And this should only lead back to the Marriage planning again.

Yes, we should all discuss "Sex" as a pleasure and responsibility; both. But we should never attempt to shed the wrong light on the topic as we all know that all too many of us have battled with the hormone situation we all had to venture through. But to be able to look foward to the thought that we can share ourselves with another forever should be a joyous and fun occassion. I can honestly say, as a male and although it wasn't easy, both my wife and I were virgins...........until we were married. No, it wasn't easy and we had to keep very bust with other things to occupy our minds.....But I must say, it was all the worth it, when it finally occurred....

Blessings

Cajunboy

[Marnie]

i'm a bit late to respond, but it seems to me whoever wrote that thing contradicted themselves...

signifying unto us the mystical union that is betwixt Christ and his Church; that's mentioned in the first paragraph, and should have remained there, since that is truly the primary purpose of a union of husband and wife.

Ummmm....the marriage vows? lol "That thing" is the infamous Book of Common Prayer, a lot mainline churches use it, Methodist, Presbyterian, etc.

Your posts were excellent, LadyC. This one made me chuckle.