The Vision of A.A. Allen on the Destruction of America

[Guest StElsewhere]

Can you trust a nut who did the following...

A. A. Allen "scammed" his followers by asserting that he could command God to "turn dollar bills into twenties." (A. A. Allen, The Secret to Scriptural Financial Success (Miracle Valley, AZ: A. A. Allen Publications, 1953); quoted in Harrell, 75)

Allen was also known to have urged his followers to send for his "prayer cloths anointed with the Miracle Oil" (A. A. Allen, "Miracle Oil Flows at Camp Meeting," Miracle Magazine, June 1967, 6-7; quoted in Harrell, 200)

Allen offered "Miracle tent shavings" as points of contact for personal miracles. (Reported in "New Revival Tent Dedicated in Philadelphia," Miracle Magazine, September 1967, 15; quoted in Harrell, 200)

Allen even "launched a brief 'raise the dead' program." Of course, it died.(Reported in "New Revival Tent Dedicated in Philadelphia," Miracle Magazine, September 1967, 15; quoted in Harrell, 199)

Allen told adherents that God had given him "a new anointing and a new power to lay hands on the believers who gave $100.00 towards the support of our missionary outreach and bestow upon each of them POWER TO GET WEALTH." (Hank Hanegraaff, Counterfeit Revival, 1997 citing David Edwin Harrell, Jr., "All Things Are Possible: The Healing and Charismatic Revivals in Modern America" (Bloomington: Indiana University Press, 1975), 200)

A.A. Allen dogmatically claimed that he could raise people from the dead. He actually launched a "raise the dead" campaign in the mid-sixties. Thankfully it died when his disciples refused to bury their departed, and their departed refused to come back from the dead. (Hank Hanegraaff, Counterfeit Revival, 1997 citing Michale Moriarity, "The New Charismatics" (grand Rapids, MIC: Zondervan, 1992), 2 and David Edwin Harrell, Jr., "All Things Are Possible: The Healing and Charismatic Revivals in Modern America" (Bloomington: Indiana University Press, 1975), 199)

Allen was eventually kicked out of the Assemblies of God denomination when he jumped bail after being arrested for drunk driving. (Reported in "New Revival Tent Dedicated in Philadelphia," Miracle Magazine, September 1967, 15; quoted in Harrell, 70-71)

More info here, here, and here.

It seems like so many others...they changed...I look at the date of the vision...1954...well before any shananagins...in the 60's... and all you say is probably true...but it was all subsequent...and does not negate the vision...Let me ask you...do you think America won't face God's judgment for her sins?

[Joshua-777]

Can you trust a nut who did the following...

A. A. Allen "scammed" his followers by asserting that he could command God to "turn dollar bills into twenties." (A. A. Allen, The Secret to Scriptural Financial Success (Miracle Valley, AZ: A. A. Allen Publications, 1953); quoted in Harrell, 75)

Allen was also known to have urged his followers to send for his "prayer cloths anointed with the Miracle Oil" (A. A. Allen, "Miracle Oil Flows at Camp Meeting," Miracle Magazine, June 1967, 6-7; quoted in Harrell, 200)

Allen offered "Miracle tent shavings" as points of contact for personal miracles. (Reported in "New Revival Tent Dedicated in Philadelphia," Miracle Magazine, September 1967, 15; quoted in Harrell, 200)

Allen even "launched a brief 'raise the dead' program." Of course, it died.(Reported in "New Revival Tent Dedicated in Philadelphia," Miracle Magazine, September 1967, 15; quoted in Harrell, 199)

Allen told adherents that God had given him "a new anointing and a new power to lay hands on the believers who gave $100.00 towards the support of our missionary outreach and bestow upon each of them POWER TO GET WEALTH." (Hank Hanegraaff, Counterfeit Revival, 1997 citing David Edwin Harrell, Jr., "All Things Are Possible: The Healing and Charismatic Revivals in Modern America" (Bloomington: Indiana University Press, 1975), 200)

A.A. Allen dogmatically claimed that he could raise people from the dead. He actually launched a "raise the dead" campaign in the mid-sixties. Thankfully it died when his disciples refused to bury their departed, and their departed refused to come back from the dead. (Hank Hanegraaff, Counterfeit Revival, 1997 citing Michale Moriarity, "The New Charismatics" (grand Rapids, MIC: Zondervan, 1992), 2 and David Edwin Harrell, Jr., "All Things Are Possible: The Healing and Charismatic Revivals in Modern America" (Bloomington: Indiana University Press, 1975), 199)

Allen was eventually kicked out of the Assemblies of God denomination when he jumped bail after being arrested for drunk driving. (Reported in "New Revival Tent Dedicated in Philadelphia," Miracle Magazine, September 1967, 15; quoted in Harrell, 70-71)

More info here, here, and here.

It seems like so many others...they changed...I look at the date of the vision...1954...well before any shananagins...in the 60's... and all you say is probably true...but it was all subsequent...and does not negate the vision...Let me ask you...do you think America won't face God's judgment for her sins?

All who do not believe in Jesus Christ will receive judgment for their sins, Jesus payed the price for our sins. Judgment will come upon this whole world, not just America.

[Guest StElsewhere]

Can you trust a nut who did the following...

A. A. Allen "scammed" his followers by asserting that he could command God to "turn dollar bills into twenties." (A. A. Allen, The Secret to Scriptural Financial Success (Miracle Valley, AZ: A. A. Allen Publications, 1953); quoted in Harrell, 75)

Allen was also known to have urged his followers to send for his "prayer cloths anointed with the Miracle Oil" (A. A. Allen, "Miracle Oil Flows at Camp Meeting," Miracle Magazine, June 1967, 6-7; quoted in Harrell, 200)

Allen offered "Miracle tent shavings" as points of contact for personal miracles. (Reported in "New Revival Tent Dedicated in Philadelphia," Miracle Magazine, September 1967, 15; quoted in Harrell, 200)

Allen even "launched a brief 'raise the dead' program." Of course, it died.(Reported in "New Revival Tent Dedicated in Philadelphia," Miracle Magazine, September 1967, 15; quoted in Harrell, 199)

Allen told adherents that God had given him "a new anointing and a new power to lay hands on the believers who gave $100.00 towards the support of our missionary outreach and bestow upon each of them POWER TO GET WEALTH." (Hank Hanegraaff, Counterfeit Revival, 1997 citing David Edwin Harrell, Jr., "All Things Are Possible: The Healing and Charismatic Revivals in Modern America" (Bloomington: Indiana University Press, 1975), 200)

A.A. Allen dogmatically claimed that he could raise people from the dead. He actually launched a "raise the dead" campaign in the mid-sixties. Thankfully it died when his disciples refused to bury their departed, and their departed refused to come back from the dead. (Hank Hanegraaff, Counterfeit Revival, 1997 citing Michale Moriarity, "The New Charismatics" (grand Rapids, MIC: Zondervan, 1992), 2 and David Edwin Harrell, Jr., "All Things Are Possible: The Healing and Charismatic Revivals in Modern America" (Bloomington: Indiana University Press, 1975), 199)

Allen was eventually kicked out of the Assemblies of God denomination when he jumped bail after being arrested for drunk driving. (Reported in "New Revival Tent Dedicated in Philadelphia," Miracle Magazine, September 1967, 15; quoted in Harrell, 70-71)

More info here, here, and here.

It seems like so many others...they changed...I look at the date of the vision...1954...well before any shananagins...in the 60's... and all you say is probably true...but it was all subsequent...and does not negate the vision...Let me ask you...do you think America won't face God's judgment for her sins?

All who do not believe in Jesus Christ will receive judgment for their sins, Jesus payed the price for our sins. Judgment will come upon this whole world, not just America.

Agreed...like I said...this thread is about America!

[Guest speaker]

If you read very carefully Hebrews 1:1-2, you will see that God does not speak to mankind by visions anymore, but through the words of Christ. We have the complete revealed Word of God available to us, delivered to us, once for all ( Jude 3). Everything God wants us to know is in the Bible. There nothing new to be revealed. People who now claim to have visions from God are being deluded and/or are trying to delude others.

Edited September 21, 2007 by speaker

[Guest StElsewhere]

If you read very carefully Hebrews 1:1-2, you will see that God does not speak to mankind by visions anymore, but through the words of Christ. We have the complete revealed Word of God available to us, delivered to us, once for all ( Jude 3). Everything God wants us to know is in the Bible. There nothing new to be revealed. People who now claim to have visions from God are being deluded and/or are trying to delude others.

And by what authority do you make this claim...that God doesn't speak to man through visions today?...you stated it...now back it up...

[Guest speaker]

If you read very carefully Hebrews 1:1-2, you will see that God does not speak to mankind by visions anymore, but through the words of Christ. We have the complete revealed Word of God available to us, delivered to us, once for all ( Jude 3). Everything God wants us to know is in the Bible. There nothing new to be revealed. People who now claim to have visions from God are being deluded and/or are trying to delude others.

And by what authority do you make this claim...that God doesn't speak to man through visions today?...you stated it...now back it up...

You obviously didn't bother to read Hebrews 1:1-2.

[Guest StElsewhere]

If you read very carefully Hebrews 1:1-2, you will see that God does not speak to mankind by visions anymore, but through the words of Christ. We have the complete revealed Word of God available to us, delivered to us, once for all ( Jude 3). Everything God wants us to know is in the Bible. There nothing new to be revealed. People who now claim to have visions from God are being deluded and/or are trying to delude others.

And by what authority do you make this claim...that God doesn't speak to man through visions today?...you stated it...now back it up...

You obviously didn't bother to read Hebrews 1:1-2.

Let's read it together shall we:

Hbr 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

Hbr 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by [his] Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

So where do you read that the two points ... are mutually exclusive? And in your understanding ...Jesus stopped speaking...when?... Do enlighten me!

[Guest speaker]

Hebrews 1:1-2 --In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, who he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe."

Matthew 17:1-5 --After six days Jesus took with him, Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. There He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus. Peter said to Jesus, "Lord it is good for us to be here. If you wish, I will put up three shelters--one for you, one for Moses and one for Elijah." While he was still speaking, a bright cloud enveloped them, and voice from the cloud said, "This is my Son, whom I love, with him I am well pleased. Listen to Him!"

If you can't see that God wants us to listen to the recorded words of Jesus instead of looking for visions like Moses and Elijah did, you are stumbling over what is right in front of you just as Peter did and he was corrected by God.

I pray God will open the eyes of your understanding.

speaker

[Guest StElsewhere]

Hebrews 1:1-2 --In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, who he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe."

...Correct...but where do you see...where the LORD stopped speaking through His Holy Ghost?

Matthew 17:1-5 --After six days Jesus took with him, Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. There He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus. Peter said to Jesus, "Lord it is good for us to be here. If you wish, I will put up three shelters--one for you, one for Moses and one for Elijah." While he was still speaking, a bright cloud enveloped them, and voice from the cloud said, "This is my Son, whom I love, with him I am well pleased. Listen to Him!"

So in your understanding...transfiguration equals ...no communication from on high?...Please back that up with scripture!

If you can't see that God wants us to listen to the recorded words of Jesus instead of looking for visions like Moses and Elijah did, you are stumbling over what is right in front of you just as Peter did and he was corrected by God.

If that is true...then Hosea is a lie...READ:

Hsa 12:10 I have also spoken by the prophets, and I have multiplied visions, and used similitudes, by the ministry of the prophets.

I pray God will open the eyes of your understanding.

So you don't believe that America is going to be punished for all her flagrant sins before the True and Living God?...Now who really needs their eyes opened?

[Guest speaker]

Hebrews 1:1-2 --In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, who he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe."

...Correct...but where do you see...where the LORD stopped speaking through His Holy Ghost?

That scripture doesn't say the Lord stopped speaking through His Holy Ghost. It says that the days when He audibly spoke(and in visions) to the prophets is OVER. We are now to listen to the words of His Son. We have those words written in the New Testament by writers who were inspired (in-breathed) by the Holy Ghost.

Matthew 17:1-5 --After six days Jesus took with him, Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. There He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus. Peter said to Jesus, "Lord it is good for us to be here. If you wish, I will put up three shelters--one for you, one for Moses and one for Elijah." While he was still speaking, a bright cloud enveloped them, and voice from the cloud said, "This is my Son, whom I love, with him I am well pleased. Listen to Him!"

So in your understanding...transfiguration equals ...no communication from on high?...Please back that up with scripture!

That is not my understanding, but your misunderstanding. This vision was to instruct Peter and the other apostles that the Old Law and its ways were ending and they were no longer to follow its precepts, but to follow what Christ taught. God was now communicating to us through the Son. God has delivered His final message to us through Christ and the inspired writers of Christ's message.

If you can't see that God wants us to listen to the recorded words of Jesus instead of looking for visions like Moses and Elijah did, you are stumbling over what is right in front of you just as Peter did and he was corrected by God.

If that is true...then Hosea is a lie...READ:

Hsa 12:10 I have also spoken by the prophets, and I have multiplied visions, and used similitudes, by the ministry of the prophets.

Again you show your lack of understanding about "rightly dividing the word of truth". What happened to the Old Testament prophets belonged to the Old Covenant. We are not to follow the Old Testament today because Christ brought the New Covenant, having nailed the old to his cross.

I pray God will open the eyes of your understanding.

So you don't believe that America is going to be punished for all her flagrant sins before the True and Living God?...Now who really needs their eyes opened?

And again, you misunderstand. I have not said I "don't believe that American is not going to be punished for all her flagrant sins before the True and Living God". That is your false conclusion. This whole discussion was about whether people receive visions from God today. I have shown scriptures that show God does not communicate with us in that way. He communicates to us through the inspired word.

I repeat, with love and compassion, I pray God will open your eyes to understand His written word.

Speaker

Edited September 26, 2007 by speaker