Women pastors

[Marnie]

I would at this stage revert back to Paul's letter to Tmothy, where in my mind, at least, Paul was instructing a young man, what to look for when setting up a ministry,

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

I might be wrong, but Paul was telling Timothy what he, Paul, would put up with, such as the first eight words of the sentence suggests. Just because Paul wouldn't allow it, does not mean that it was not permissable for any other apostle.

Just as an aside, I think some people misunderstand the meaning of authority. Of any church I have attended, I have never considered any preacher, male or female has any authority over me, as far as my spiritual or physical actions or thoughts are concerned. Christ is the only One who has authority over me. I may be dislodged from a congregation, or George may be able to ban me from posting on Worthy, but that is where the authority stops.....I think. at the same time I would not join a church that has an ordained female priest or vicar or pastor in charge of a congregation., but as I have mentioned I don't mind a woman who has been invited by the church leaders, addressing the meeting.

e

Thank you Eric. I was going to bring that up. We are of a similar mind on this.

I feel like there is a whole historical/cultural/grammatical context that is being ignored in Pauline theology in this discussion.

[Guest]

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

John 3:16

"There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."

Romans 8:1

"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works."

2 Timothy 3:16-17

Oh No!

Handmaidens Speaking God's Words

And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God,I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams: And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:

Acts 2:17-18

Pray

Rejoice

See that none render evil for evil unto any man; but ever follow that which is good, both among yourselves, and to all men.

Rejoice evermore.

Pray without ceasing.

In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.

Quench not the Spirit.

1 Thessalonians 5:15-19

Whatever Is A Guy To Do

Girls Talking Directly With Their Father In Heaven

And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

Matthew 23:9

Oh Lord

Something Accuses Your Little Ones At Worthy

Thank You Lord Jesus - Praise Your Holy Name

Yes And Amen - In Your Time

You Are Worthy

Maranatha

Hallelujah

And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

Revelation 12:10

A Brother Might Prayerful Consider The Honor Of The Daughters Of Zion

Folks Not Of God's Kingdom May Even Try To Dishonor God's Daughters

Too Dumb

See.....

The LORD Jesus Wins

Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves.

Philippians 2:3

Dear Sisters Keep On Keeping On!

Your Brothers Love You And Hold You Up The The Throne.

Amen! Amen! Amen!

But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

Jude 1:20-21

Even When For His Name's Sake You Are Cursed And Condemned

Sister Warriors

Stand Fast

Obey God Rather Than Men

Saying, Did not we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name? and, behold, ye have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this man's blood upon us.

Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.

Acts 5:28-29

Be Blessed Beloved Of The KING

The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:

The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:

The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.

And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them.

Numbers 6:24-27

Love, Your Brother Joe

[exrockstar]

I would at this stage revert back to Paul's letter to Tmothy, where in my mind, at least, Paul was instructing a young man, what to look for when setting up a ministry,

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

I might be wrong, but Paul was telling Timothy what he, Paul, would put up with, such as the first eight words of the sentence suggests. Just because Paul wouldn't allow it, does not mean that it was not permissable for any other apostle.

Just as an aside, I think some people misunderstand the meaning of authority. Of any church I have attended, I have never considered any preacher, male or female has any authority over me, as far as my spiritual or physical actions or thoughts are concerned. Christ is the only One who has authority over me. I may be dislodged from a congregation, or George may be able to ban me from posting on Worthy, but that is where the authority stops.....I think. at the same time I would not join a church that has an ordained female priest or vicar or pastor in charge of a congregation., but as I have mentioned I don't mind a woman who has been invited by the church leaders, addressing the meeting.

e

so further on it says:

15 Yet she will be saved through(Y) childbearing

[EricH]

I would at this stage revert back to Paul's letter to Tmothy, where in my mind, at least, Paul was instructing a young man, what to look for when setting up a ministry,

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

I might be wrong, but Paul was telling Timothy what he, Paul, would put up with, such as the first eight words of the sentence suggests. Just because Paul wouldn't allow it, does not mean that it was not permissable for any other apostle.

Just as an aside, I think some people misunderstand the meaning of authority. Of any church I have attended, I have never considered any preacher, male or female has any authority over me, as far as my spiritual or physical actions or thoughts are concerned. Christ is the only One who has authority over me. I may be dislodged from a congregation, or George may be able to ban me from posting on Worthy, but that is where the authority stops.....I think. at the same time I would not join a church that has an ordained female priest or vicar or pastor in charge of a congregation., but as I have mentioned I don't mind a woman who has been invited by the church leaders, addressing the meeting.

e

A couple of thoughts:

1. Although Paul uses the personal pronoun he does not indicate (as he does in other passages) that this command is not from God.

2. Just because a person does not recognize authority, does not mean that there is no authority.

[Ovedya]

These forums do not compare with a genuine meeting of a local church.

I agree Ovedya. That isn't my point. My point is that if one sticks precisely to the interpretation of 1 tim.2:12 that it means women cannot teach, preach, or exercise authority over men, then one has to also stick to the lack of parameters. It doesn't say ONLY in church. It just says not to.

Just keep in mind that I don't believe that is the correct interpretation. So I really do not have a problem with a woman giving her opinions, correcting men, teaching men, etc. Disrespect I have some problems with. But I have to remember that myself.

The verses are in context with the meeting of the church, as is the one in 1 Corinthians. Women are not permitted to teach or assert authority over a man.

[firehill]

I would at this stage revert back to Paul's letter to Tmothy, where in my mind, at least, Paul was instructing a young man, what to look for when setting up a ministry,

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

I might be wrong, but Paul was telling Timothy what he, Paul, would put up with, such as the first eight words of the sentence suggests. Just because Paul wouldn't allow it, does not mean that it was not permissable for any other apostle.

Just as an aside, I think some people misunderstand the meaning of authority. Of any church I have attended, I have never considered any preacher, male or female has any authority over me, as far as my spiritual or physical actions or thoughts are concerned. Christ is the only One who has authority over me. I may be dislodged from a congregation, or George may be able to ban me from posting on Worthy, but that is where the authority stops.....I think. at the same time I would not join a church that has an ordained female priest or vicar or pastor in charge of a congregation., but as I have mentioned I don't mind a woman who has been invited by the church leaders, addressing the meeting.

e

A couple of thoughts:

1. Although Paul uses the personal pronoun he does not indicate (as he does in other passages) that this command is not from God.

2. Just because a person does not recognize authority, does not mean that there is no authority.

Just God's standard:

Now for those who still believe that 1 Timothy 2:12 is a universal law that forbids all godly Christian women from teaching correct biblical doctrine to men, I challenge you to find another universal law by God that is framed in the words of a man saying

[Vickilynn]

Shalom,

1 Timothy

8 I desire then that in every place the men should pray, lifting holy hands without anger or quarreling; 9likewise also that women should adorn themselves in respectable apparel, with modesty and self-control, not with braided hair and gold or pearls or costly attire, 10 but with what is proper for women who profess godliness

[Scarletprayers]

firehill,

The blog site you keep posting is by a person who by her own admission has no credentials to back her up, thats not totally against her, as there have been and will continue to be, plenty of people who have done great work for God with no formal training, and if God touches you and gives you those gifts, who needs them anyway. The fact that she shamelessly promotes her 4 DVD set on almost every page does tend to give one pause, is she about correcting error or $$$$$

She sites a translation of the Bible by one Dr. Ann Nylan, this one I do have a possible problem with, she has (that I can find so far) no peer review on her translation, and I am always hesitant when I hear someone has found and other wise unknown "text" of the Bible. It could be true, I know it happens as the Dead Sea Scrolls are proof that it can.

I'm going to try to keep looking at what she has written as well as some of the other people she sites, because I would actually like to know the truth, not just think that I know the truth because thats what I was taught.

[Vickilynn]

firehill,

The blog site you keep posting is by a person who by her own admission has no credentials to back her up, thats not totally against her, as there have been and will continue to be, plenty of people who have done great work for God with no formal training, and if God touches you and gives you those gifts, who needs them anyway. The fact that she shamelessly promotes her 4 DVD set on almost every page does tend to give one pause, is she about correcting error or $$$$$

She sites a translation of the Bible by one Dr. Ann Nylan, this one I do have a possible problem with, she has (that I can find so far) no peer review on her translation, and I am always hesitant when I hear someone has found and other wise unknown "text" of the Bible. It could be true, I know it happens as the Dead Sea Scrolls are proof that it can.

I'm going to try to keep looking at what she has written as well as some of the other people she sites, because I would actually like to know the truth, not just think that I know the truth because thats what I was taught.

Shalom SP!

[Ovedya]

I would at this stage revert back to Paul's letter to Tmothy, where in my mind, at least, Paul was instructing a young man, what to look for when setting up a ministry,

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

I might be wrong, but Paul was telling Timothy what he, Paul, would put up with, such as the first eight words of the sentence suggests. Just because Paul wouldn't allow it, does not mean that it was not permissable for any other apostle.

Just as an aside, I think some people misunderstand the meaning of authority. Of any church I have attended, I have never considered any preacher, male or female has any authority over me, as far as my spiritual or physical actions or thoughts are concerned. Christ is the only One who has authority over me. I may be dislodged from a congregation, or George may be able to ban me from posting on Worthy, but that is where the authority stops.....I think. at the same time I would not join a church that has an ordained female priest or vicar or pastor in charge of a congregation., but as I have mentioned I don't mind a woman who has been invited by the church leaders, addressing the meeting.

e

A couple of thoughts:

1. Although Paul uses the personal pronoun he does not indicate (as he does in other passages) that this command is not from God.

2. Just because a person does not recognize authority, does not mean that there is no authority.

Just God's standard:

Now for those who still believe that 1 Timothy 2:12 is a universal law that forbids all godly Christian women from teaching correct biblical doctrine to men, I challenge you to find another universal law by God that is framed in the words of a man saying