Do you realize this? A must see

[Axxman]

I believe ALL OF YOU are contributing to liberal scare tactics and conspiracy theories. You guys are simply repeating myths and mistruths from the liberal media designed to sway public perception. For example, under Bill Clinton the National debt was in worse shpe than it is now...but you NEVER hear a single negative thing about the National debt under Bill Clinton and I'd wager that most of you don't even realize the truth of that statement. The National Debt under President Bush is a constant complaint of the lib media in spite of the fact that the National debt is in better shape now than it EVER WAS under Clinton...its better than it was in 1950!!! And you guys just believe whatever the media feeds you.

Just what are you guys afraid of? Who is gonna come collect? DO you really believe that China is gonna own the US? This thread is filled with completely false statements and fear-mongering. Ron Pauls position on National debt is a lie and is just another reason among his many moral shortcomings that he will NEVER be President.

[faith pleases God]

I believe ALL OF YOU are contributing to liberal scare tactics and conspiracy theories. You guys are simply repeating myths and mistruths from the liberal media designed to sway public perception. For example, under Bill Clinton the National debt was in worse shpe than it is now...but you NEVER hear a single negative thing about the National debt under Bill Clinton and I'd wager that most of you don't even realize the truth of that statement. The National Debt under President Bush is a constant complaint of the lib media in spite of the fact that the National debt is in better shape now than it EVER WAS under Clinton...its better than it was in 1950!!! And you guys just believe whatever the media feeds you.

Just what are you guys afraid of? Who is gonna come collect? DO you really believe that China is gonna own the US? This thread is filled with completely false statements and fear-mongering. Ron Pauls position on National debt is a lie and is just another reason among his many moral shortcomings that he will NEVER be President.

I'm conservative, you're liberal. You want socialism, that's liberal. I want freedom that's conservative. I'm not afraid just aware. Republican-Democrat Bush-Clinton, you think they aren't the same. This system is monopolized. And yes, I do believe we are in serious trouble. Our national debt is worse than ever and is getting worse.

[jackie d]

I believe ALL OF YOU are contributing to liberal scare tactics and conspiracy theories. You guys are simply repeating myths and mistruths from the liberal media designed to sway public perception. For example, under Bill Clinton the National debt was in worse shpe than it is now...but you NEVER hear a single negative thing about the National debt under Bill Clinton and I'd wager that most of you don't even realize the truth of that statement. The National Debt under President Bush is a constant complaint of the lib media in spite of the fact that the National debt is in better shape now than it EVER WAS under Clinton...its better than it was in 1950!!! And you guys just believe whatever the media feeds you.

Just what are you guys afraid of? Who is gonna come collect? DO you really believe that China is gonna own the US? This thread is filled with completely false statements and fear-mongering. Ron Pauls position on National debt is a lie and is just another reason among his many moral shortcomings that he will NEVER be President.

your words and attitude reminds me of the guy who was quoted as having said "not even God can sink the Titanic.".........

[Axxman]

I'm conservative, you're liberal. You want socialism, that's liberal. I want freedom that's conservative. I'm not afraid just aware. Republican-Democrat Bush-Clinton, you think they aren't the same. This system is monopolized. And yes, I do believe we are in serious trouble. Our national debt is worse than ever and is getting worse.

LOL...how am I liberal? I'm not the one spreading liberal media mistruths about the National debt. Since when do I want socialism? LOL.

Why are we in trouble? How can you say our debt is worse and worse when it is CLEARLY not? How did Reagan triple the National debt and create an above average economy? I think you should answer these questions. Just what are you guys afraid of? Who is gonna come collect? Do you really believe that China is gonna own the US? Who paid for World War 2?

[faith pleases God]

I'm conservative, you're liberal. You want socialism, that's liberal. I want freedom that's conservative. I'm not afraid just aware. Republican-Democrat Bush-Clinton, you think they aren't the same. This system is monopolized. And yes, I do believe we are in serious trouble. Our national debt is worse than ever and is getting worse.

LOL...how am I liberal? I'm not the one spreading liberal media mistruths about the National debt. Since when do I want socialism? LOL.

Why are we in trouble? How can you say our debt is worse and worse when it is CLEARLY not? How did Reagan triple the National debt and create an above average economy? I think you should answer these questions. Just what are you guys afraid of? Who is gonna come collect? Do you really believe that China is gonna own the US? Who paid for World War 2?

These are your words:

I don't necessarily disagree with the label of communism...as in Christian Communist. I think there is some scriptural support for such an ideology. Of course there is support for Christian Fascism too. While fascism generally denotes intolerance (which I generally am)...

okay so you're facist/communist not socialist .

In real economic growth prices go down not up. Got to the store and tell me how much growth there is. Wages are not going up with inflation. The rates cuts are debasing our dollar. I have no fear of our economy. I look forward to its collapse. I speak these things to make others aware of why their dollar is about to fail them. Fear is your word not mine.

[redwing]

It's basically the result of our overwhelming consumer driven society. The me me me generation. But in reality, what are the world banks going to do? Call it in and crash the U.S. economy? The rest of the world will soon follow. Every time there is a jitter on Wall st, stocks go down world wide. Every ecomony in the world is plugged into Wall st. I think your debt will just balloon and balloon until the second coming

Not true. Our economic growth is artificial just like our rates and our home values. The world has 6 billion consumers (U.S.A. is 300 million) ready to consume and produce. We have been lent our lifestyles. It's produced by the world. Production, commodities and materials are true wealth. We don't produce much and our home based companies have gone global and don't need our nation for much. In fact they have cheaper labor, materials and taxes elsewhere. We have been used. As our economy faulters, others will replace it as a reserve and rise. We are arrogant to think the world is dependant upon us, it isn't. Without us consuming so much there will be more consumption for the rest of the world. And the banks will be happy to lend them a lifestyle.

If the United States has been "used" we did it to ourselves. But personally I believe it is the other way around, we have done the using. We have borrowed, made alliances with other countries in order to have profit and gain for our country, our government has bullied and conned these other countries and their own citizens nearly to the point of economic collapse. Even if it did start out as some kind of conspiracy theory the effects of what this country has been and done is evident.

Our country needs much prayer and a huge change of heart, mind and attitude.

[Axxman]

okay so you're facist/communist not socialist .

In real economic growth prices go down not up. Got to the store and tell me how much growth there is. Wages are not going up with inflation. The rates cuts are debasing our dollar. I have no fear of our economy. I look forward to its collapse. I speak these things to make others aware of why their dollar is about to fail them. Fear is your word not mine.

Thank you for correcting yourself...I believe it is an important distinction. It also makes me FAR more conservative than almost anyone on these forums.

You didn't answer the questions. Since the falling dollar and the National debt are are two different topics I won't address it here. Supply and demand become the determining factor of value for the USD...it has fallen before. Ironically...prices go up and down based on supply and demand as well. Economists would tell you high rates of inflation are caused by high rates of growth of the money supply.

[faith pleases God]

okay so you're facist/communist not socialist .

In real economic growth prices go down not up. Got to the store and tell me how much growth there is. Wages are not going up with inflation. The rates cuts are debasing our dollar. I have no fear of our economy. I look forward to its collapse. I speak these things to make others aware of why their dollar is about to fail them. Fear is your word not mine.

Thank you for correcting yourself...I believe it is an important distinction. It also makes me FAR more conservative than almost anyone on these forums.

You didn't answer the questions. Since the falling dollar and the National debt are are two different topics I won't address it here. Supply and demand become the determining factor of value for the USD...it has fallen before. Ironically...prices go up and down based on supply and demand as well. Economists would tell you high rates of inflation are caused by high rates of growth of the money supply.

But the are communist economics and liberal. Not conservative or true with a standard that's tangible.

That's what I'm trying to explain. The Fed cutting rates and injecting (printing) fake money into our system is an illusion of growth, it ISN'T growth itself. It's a manipulation. True growth is created by production. If they gave us all $1 million dollars on credit you would call that growth. It isn't you would see inflation go crazy and a temporary hold off until the economic bubble burst. We are in a time of true recesion that's being manipulated with #'s (artificial rate cuts) giving the illusion of growth.

[Axxman]

But the are communist economics and liberal. Not conservative or true with a standard that's tangible.

That's what I'm trying to explain. The Fed cutting rates and injecting (printing) fake money into our system is an illusion of growth, it ISN'T growth itself. It's a manipulation. True growth is created by production. If they gave us all $1 million dollars on credit you would call that growth. It isn't you would see inflation go crazy and a temporary hold off until the economic bubble burst. We are in a time of true recesion that's being manipulated with #'s (artificial rate cuts) giving the illusion of growth.

Again, I disagree. Not surprisingly, so do Greenspan, Paulson, Bernanke, or even Asia Fund Managers. Is the economy shrinking? Sure it is...but to keep going on with all the hysterics to score a political point is fruitless. Could the US go into a recession? Sure it could...but that is why the Federal reserve, the President, and Congress are making the necessary moves to avoid it. You can't complain about recession and say "I look forward to economic collapse." The reason you are complaining about rate cuts, and stimulus packages is because they will probably burst your dreams of economic crisis.

Also...it would be ridiculuous for the gov't to give us all $1 million dollars. Comparing a $30 trillion dollar loan to a $50 billion stimulus package is an extreme exaggeration. Besides, it only causes growth if people spend it.

On a personal note...I know that you and I have disagreed a couple of times in this political season. We clearly see things differently in that regard. I want you to know that i am okay with that and am merely debating the issues from my perspective. It is not my intention to make you angry, or to be condescending to you. I enjoy these convo's alot.

[faith pleases God]

But the are communist economics and liberal. Not conservative or true with a standard that's tangible.

That's what I'm trying to explain. The Fed cutting rates and injecting (printing) fake money into our system is an illusion of growth, it ISN'T growth itself. It's a manipulation. True growth is created by production. If they gave us all $1 million dollars on credit you would call that growth. It isn't you would see inflation go crazy and a temporary hold off until the economic bubble burst. We are in a time of true recesion that's being manipulated with #'s (artificial rate cuts) giving the illusion of growth.

Again, I disagree. Not surprisingly, so do Greenspan, Paulson, Bernanke, or even Asia Fund Managers. Is the economy shrinking? Sure it is...but to keep going on with all the hysterics to score a political point is fruitless. Could the US go into a recession? Sure it could...but that is why the Federal reserve, the President, and Congress are making the necessary moves to avoid it. You can't complain about recession and say "I look forward to economic collapse." The reason you are complaining about rate cuts, and stimulus packages is because they will probably burst your dreams of economic crisis.

Also...it would be ridiculuous for the gov't to give us all $1 million dollars. Comparing a $30 trillion dollar loan to a $50 billion stimulus package is an extreme exaggeration. Besides, it only causes growth if people spend it.

On a personal note...I know that you and I have disagreed a couple of times in this political season. We clearly see things differently in that regard. I want you to know that i am okay with that and am merely debating the issues from my perspective. It is not my intention to make you angry, or to be condescending to you. I enjoy these convo's alot.

The ones you're refering to as saying it's okay are the very one's behind the manipulation. This is like satan saying he has come in peace. I'm saying the recession is going to happen. I'm not complaining about it. I'm pointing out why it's going to and who (what) is at fault. I look forward to it because it will expose this false monopolized money system for what it is. Let everyone spend the $1 million when it's given and lets call it growth but only when they spend. The reason they call it growth is because when they spend it, they'll need to borrow more and then we can call that growth. Lets be reasonable, it is not sound money or minded to live in the red. For we will reap what we sow. It is sound to be in the black and be above, not in the red and under. Our country's liability is the Fed's asset and both are growing. Our public ruin is their private gain. This is foolish. And your Bernanke, Greenspan buddies want us to believe debt to them from us, is good for us. Just like Satan wants us to believe serving him is best, as he is our master.

BTW- I agree with you entirely. These discussions can become passioniate. I appreciate that as long as your okay with it. I believe that we can learn, glean and grow when done in love and with respect. I enjoy your point of view and I like my thoughts (beliefs) challenged.