caughtinside Posted March 25, 2008 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 120 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/15/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 25, 2008 Strangely, I just had a conversation with a friend of mine where we were debating the merits of seeking material fulfillment. He's not a Christian, but he seems to think it's impossible to achieve true happiness through just 'doing what makes you happy' or 'fulfilling your dreams'. I'm still a believer, I just wanted to comment. Hey Grungekid, Did your friend say why he thought it was impossible? Me, I don't see any guarantees in any path, but certainly possibilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grungekid Posted March 25, 2008 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 660 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/01/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/06/1990 Share Posted March 25, 2008 Strangely, I just had a conversation with a friend of mine where we were debating the merits of seeking material fulfillment. He's not a Christian, but he seems to think it's impossible to achieve true happiness through just 'doing what makes you happy' or 'fulfilling your dreams'. I'm still a believer, I just wanted to comment. Hey Grungekid, Did your friend say why he thought it was impossible? Me, I don't see any guarantees in any path, but certainly possibilities. Agreed. That's what I was trying to tell him. Supposedly his ideas revolve around his Bhuddist religion, and stereotypes of the Bhuddist monks as enlightened and spiritually free individuals who are 'happy' without anything, but 'Fightclub' was a huge inspiration to him, and if you're aware of the film's central themes, you can tell just what was influencing his thinking. While I appreciate the ideas expressed in certain parts of the film, I was actually disappointed with it, and definitely disagreed on several key points with what it preached. For one, we've moved past Nieztche and his humanistic ethic is actually widley accepted here in Western Culture. Second, it's apparent from the behavior of the two main characters that, once they are 'freed' intellectually, they are warped into Klybold-style terrorists, as though that is the ultimate realization of humanity. I, being a firm adherent to the Christian faith, a fan of 90's 'inward-looking' alternative rock, and someone who is aware of the evils of sociopaths, gulags, and governments in times past, can fully appreciate that humans are far from perfect, and seem to be inherintly evil. But the movie glorified it, and portrayed it as though it were being suppressed, and we needed to release it; to act on it. And that, I am disgusted and annoyed with. All that in mind, I spent most of the period questioning him, and perhaps I was a little too passive. I didn't feel I did my job in the conversation, and at the end I sort of let off and told him I was just playing the devil's advocate. He didn't seem to mind to deeply that I was semi-disagreeing with him. I was really only saying anything at all to counter something he said to start it all off: "plans are only a false sense of security." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kat8585 Posted March 26, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 1,360 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 7,866 Content Per Day: 1.23 Reputation: 26 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/22/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/18/1946 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Andy Rooney is an athiest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caughtinside Posted March 26, 2008 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 120 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/15/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 26, 2008 from http://media.www.tuftsdaily.com/media/stor...n-1489558.shtml "I am an atheist," Rooney said. "I don't understand religion at all. I'm sure I'll offend a lot of people by saying this, but I think it's all nonsense." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caughtinside Posted March 26, 2008 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 120 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/15/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 26, 2008 Grungekid, I only saw the movie once, but I did notice the nihilism you write about. Could there be a glimmer of hope in how Norton's character put the gun to his head and pulled the trigger--not a suicide attempt but an attempt to kill off that nihilistic part of himself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted March 26, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.92 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Douglas Adams I'm not sure I would include Douglas Adams in a list of people who have found peace and happiness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caughtinside Posted March 27, 2008 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 120 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/15/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 27, 2008 Well, I'm not sure I would include Mother Teresa. He certainly doesn't fit into artsylady's cherry-picked list of people who fizzled hard. Going beyond such extreme examples, it does get a bit tricky for us to decide on the quality of others' lives. Adams did have a tough love life. But he also lived a productive life, advocated for the environment, and was well-respected. So, who can say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillingToDie Posted March 27, 2008 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 29 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 710 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/01/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/16/1984 Share Posted March 27, 2008 Grungekid, I only saw the movie once, but I did notice the nihilism you write about. Could there be a glimmer of hope in how Norton's character put the gun to his head and pulled the trigger--not a suicide attempt but an attempt to kill off that nihilistic part of himself? That's how I saw it. And to be fair, only Tyler was the terrorist, which was the result of his extreme anarcho-nihilism. I must say though, that Tyler made some excellent points about our present culture. Very thought provoking movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ateam Posted March 27, 2008 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 22 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/08/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 27, 2008 I wasnt going to answer but I notice I was stamped a non believer. I might as well be an atheist, huh? I digress. Excluding artlady, the people whom I assume art labled athiests, and everyone in the whole wide world, thought these special people can not have everything. Certainly not immortality. Therefore this thread failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artsylady Posted March 27, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 171 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 4,813 Content Per Day: 0.64 Reputation: 150 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/26/2003 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 27, 2008 Someone mentioned the Dalia Lama? Just saw this on msn. http://news.sympatico.msn.ctv.ca/TopStorie...in_dalai_080326 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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