Seventh Day Adventists

[Nero's Fiddle]

I have a friend who is SDA as well, as I mentioned in an earlier post.

Obviously, I do not know your friend, but my friend has been taught by her SDA church (according to OFFICIAL DOCTRINE) that accepting Jesus Christ washes away only past sins.

She has been taught that salvation after that acceptance is to be earned... ie, it is a work-based religion. Rather than trusting solely in the power of the Lord, they believe that they personally either merit or forfeit their own salvation based on their own works.

And that IS a problem, as no human being is capable of measuring up to God's perfection. The Jews tried... And we still needed a Savior. :sweating:

Saved by HIS grace,

NF

[Guest yod]

I used to think it was just another denomination who happened to go to church on Saturdays (I also observe the Shabbat) but as I met more and more of them...and listened to their teachers on the SDA radio station....I began to hear a different gospel.

This "sunday is the mark of the beast" thing is more insidious than it seems. It puffs up and divides. It forces a type of legalism that is EXACTLY what the circumcision debate was like in the early church. It is in a word...judaizing at it's worst. The really bad thing is that they think they are the new Chosen People who have replaced Israel. That belief/doctrine is always a big fat red flag!

At the laity level of any church are lots of people who don't really understand the doctrines and theology of their denomination. They started going because of a personal relationship with someone there or another such reason. I'm certain there are precious saints in the SDA...and I happen to know a few myself....but overall the teachings of this denomination are borderline heresy at best.

Full blown cultic at worst. Ask David Koresh.

These verses come to mind.....

Galatians 3:3 Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh?

Galatians 5:4 You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.

[wordsower]

Have you, personally, been approached by an SDA and been accused of having the mark of the beast because you worship on Sunday? Or, like so many others, is this just "one of those things you heard"?

If you live in TN, I know for a fact that indeed there are massive billboards that say:

Saturday is the Lord's Day

Sunday is the Mark of the Beast

for free brochure call .......

They are everywhere, and not just TN as I've heard several from other states comment on them.

And, yes, since I left the church many have told me that I will receive the mark of the beast unless I go back to the Sabbath.

You are surely free to your opinion, I just want to educate, even those like your friend that don't know. I'm sure there are saved people in that denomination as denomination doesn't save us. In my upbringing, there were a few I can think of that lived sincerely for Jesus but many more that were miserable. That man in CA that just murdered his whole family was SDA per his daughter and John Lee Malvo, the sniper was raised SDA. In my mother's church a friend of hers shot her 2 daughters and herself because her husband left her.

These extreme behaviors do not come from a relationship with Jesus.

Teaching that we all, believers and non are currently under judgement that started in 1844 and the atonement isn't finished yet is another gospel.

Jesus paid it all, it is finished.

[RGR]

That man in CA that just murdered his whole family was SDA per his daughter and John Lee Malvo, the sniper was raised SDA. In my mother's church a friend of hers shot her 2 daughters and herself because her husband left her.

And Jimmy Swaggart was Pentecostal and committed sexual sin. Jim Bakker was Pentecostal and committed fraud and sexual sin. Robert Tilton claimed Pentecostalism I believe and he committed fraud. Therefore, according to your attack on the SDA's, the same rationale should mean that since I'm Pentecostal, I am a swindler and an adulterer. The argument does not hold water.

[Guest yod]

I totally agree with you Ronald.......

you are a swindler and an adulterer

[JP1]

Have you, personally, been approached by an SDA and been accused of having the mark of the beast because you worship on Sunday? Or, like so many others, is this just "one of those things you heard"?

Um, they don't exactly hide it. When I went to Florida last year I saw billboards all up and down I-75 proclaiming that Sunday worship is the mark of the beast.

It's common knowledge about them. Kinda like you know that Baptists baptize by full immersion, not sprinkling, and that Catholics believe in purgatory. It's part of their doctrine.

Either your friend is just being nice to you and considerate of your feelings because of the friendship, or doesn't know what she has gotten herself into.

[wordsower]

Ronald, I agree, you can't lump a religion simply based on it's member's behaviors.

My point, which I didn't make clear, is that the lifestyle, the condemnation, the constant fear makes people crazy. I remember at age 8 or 9 we had a meeting at church where they turned off the lights and played an audio tape of a girl that was living in the last days and running for her life and the government was after her because she was a Sabbath keeper and they finally got her and put her in the electric chair and then the Lord came. It was from a little book they published called "Now" - very popular among SDA's. I was SCARED to death! I would pray that I would die, I was always told I would never make it to high school or college, that the Lord would come first.

I'm telling you, it's dangerous, it's crazy, it's abuse and it's a cult. Think what you want. I was a part of it.

I'm not on a witch hunt. I have a new life. I have freedom in Christ. I just want them all to know the truth. All I ever heard is "we have the truth." No! Jesus is the way, the Truth and the life, no man comes to the Father except by Him, not the SDA church. I pray for them to know truth. I love my family I don't want them or anyone else deceived by these lies. They are in bondage and I hate it. When I got saved I asked God why in the world I had to go through all of that, why couldnt' I just be born Baptist or something. He told me that He would use me to preach the gospel and recover the sight of the blind. I pray for His leading and that I don't come across as being against them. I understand that I don't wrestle with flesh and blood but against evil itself.

[wordsower]

Investigative Judgement

Doctrine so crazy I never understood it:from www.truthorfables.com

The Investigative Judgment is a complex doctrine, unique only to the Seventh-day Adventist Church. It is complex because the Scriptures have been twisted and manipulated to make this doctrine appear Biblical. Most SDA Church members probably would not be able to explain it without SDA/EGW material in front of them to guide them.

The doctrine of I J has been the most controversial and debated doctrine within the SDA Church since it's invention. Ellen White put her visionary stamp of approval on the I J. and the SDA Church cannot discard this doctrine without admitting Ellen G. White was a false prophet. They have a tiger by the tail.

I hope to make the EGW's Investigative Doctrine simple to understand so that sincere Christians can see that it is without Bible foundation, and that it was the invention of religious fanatics.

Part 1.

How Did the Investigative Judgment Begin?

Thousands of people from all denominations took part in the "Advent Movement" also known as "The Millerite Movement" and also "The Great Disappointment". These misguided people believed that Christ would return to earth and save them and destroy the wicked including those that rejected William Miller's "date setting" with hell fire raining down from heaven. The first date set for the "end of the world" was in the fall of 1843, then the spring of 1844 and finally they settled on October 22, 1844.

Needless to say all these failure dates passed without the Savior's return. Hence the term, "The Great Disappointment". The failure of Christ not returning to earth divided the Millerites into two groups. The largest group was led by Wm. Miller who renounced his belief of anything prophetically happening in 1844 and also renounced the SHUT DOOR DOCTRINE. The Millerites went back to holding evangelistic meetings and winning souls for Christ.

The splinter group led by Ellen G. Harmon (later the wife of James White), James White, Captain Joseph Bates and others held on to the SHUT DOOR DOCTRINE, that the door of salvation to the world was closed. They called themselves, "The Little Flock".

There was a rift between the Millerites and the Whites/Bates group. "The Little Flock" were trying to prove to the Millerites that they were not mistaken about the 1844 date and THE SHUT DOOR and that something happened. Ellen White blamed God for the failure for Christ not returning, as she claimed that God put his hand over the figures of the chart and they could not see their mistake. EGW claimed the figures were correct, but the event was wrong. She went on to say that instead of Christ coming to earth to cleanse the Sanctuary on earth, he move from the holy to the most holy apartment in 1844 to begin an Investigative Judgment to cleanse the Sanctuary in Heaven.

It was shortly after the October 22, 1844 DISAPPOINTMENT that the Investigative Judgment theory developed. The I J is not an ancient doctrine from the Bible but is of modern origin.

Ellen White Explains The Investigative Judgment

Please read carefully and understand what Ellen White says to us from her book, The Great Controversy. In the chapter which deals with the event "that was foretold in prophecy to take place at the termination of the 2300 days in 1844," she writes:

Ellen G. White

"Attended by heavenly angels, our great High Priest enters the holy of holies, and there appears in the presence of God, to engage in the last acts of His ministration in behalf of man - to perform the work of investigative judgment, and to make an atonement for all who are shown to be entitled to its benefits.

"...So in the great day of final atonement and investigative judgment, the only cases considered are those of the professed people of God. The judgment of the wicked is a distinct and separate work, at a later period" (The Great Controversy, 1950 edition, page 480).

"As the books of record are opened in the judgment, the lives of all who have believed on Jesus come in review before God. Beginning with those who first lived upon the earth, our Advocate presents the cases of each successive generation, and closes with the living. Every name is mentioned, every case closely investigated. Names are accepted, names rejected". (The Great Controversy, 1950 edition, page 483). "At the time appointed for the judgment

[Work in Progress]

Just to clarify, Wordsower, my comment about being directly approached about the Sabbath was to JP1, in response to what he said to me.

I also wanted to make the point that, because a few evil people were SDA's does not mean a thing. More horrendous (and notorious) criminals had some sort of "hellfire/Bible thumping" background than all other 'religions' combined. Actually, knowing you, I"m surprised you used that as an argument.

I'm sorry you were raised the way you were, it must have been terrifying for you. If only you knew my friend though, instead of just assuming things about her, you would laugh if you knew about the day she was out for blood because her little one's pre-school showed the class something totally inappropriate and scared the poor little guy. She was livid and had a few words for the teacher, lol. Just as all of us Christians were not raised in the warped "christian" way that some serial killers were, I'm sure not all SDA's are raised with the same methods. All I know is what I see/hear in my friend. Our children were interested in each other at one time and I couldn't have asked for a better daughter in law and would have been proud to have her. She glows with the upbringing in the faith. And she was not discouraged from my son because we are not SDA, btw.

[wordsower]

WIP,

I explained why I mentioned those things in the next post. I wasn't trying to say all SDA's are nuts. My cousin and aunt, for instance, are SDA but they are VERY open-minded and don't follow every little thing the church says. They don't adhere to the Sabbath as told to, they have a lot of questions about soul-sleep etc. they still study and do allow for the Holy Spirit to lead. The church they attend is charismatic and totally opposite of the conference, they expect to be thrown out of the conference at any time because they stand for grace and wear jewelry and whatever else. I'm not worried about them.

As an adult I wasn't brainwashed into it either. I went sometimes out of a sense of obligation but I didn't keep the rules and I didn't think I was saved. Ultimately, I believed more in the power of God to save me and He led me to His truth.

If your friend loves Jesus and knows Him then I'm not worried about her either.

When I finally submitted my life to Jesus and asked Him to save me, I knew that denomination had nothing to do with my salvation. I think as long as a person believes that leaving a denomination will affect their salvation, they are depending on the denomination and that is where the problem comes. It's subtle, it's a fine line, but it is Jesus + something = salvation and that is not the way Jesus works. He alone saves and nothing else is acceptable.

Didn't mean to offend you. Blessings.