What About Belief?

[OneLight]

BELIEF/FAITH/OBEDIENCE to God's commands are pretty much one and the same. You cannot have any of them without ALL of them.

Belief and faith I believe are basically the same, but obedience, I believe, is one step beyond faith.

One can have faith and believe in the Word of God and still not obey it.

See what I'm saying?

NOT FOR SALVATION

Every single person in the world is guilty of sinning, which is not obeying His word. To say that you do not sin is a lie itself. Salvation is a gift from God, not received by works, but by His grace through our faith in His Son, Jesus Christ. You can never ever do enough works in a million lifetimes to wash your sins away. Only Jesus is capable of this.

Yes, again we ask that you turn your caps off.

[ALTACALL]

I think I'm making it sound complicated. Sorry, don't mean to. I'm just saying that for it to be TRUE, "belief/faith/" it must be obedience, therefore you have to have ALL of the components of BELIEF/FAITH/OBEDIENCE. They all go together.

In His Love,

Suzanne

I think you can have belief/faith without obedience.

Check this out...

Romans 1

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,

19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them.

These people were shown the truth and they believed....otherwise it wouldn't have been truth to them. They however did not act upon that truth and brought the wrath of God against them.

of coarse you can have belief in God without obedience.

it's sad how there is a member here in this thread who's passing scripture interpretation

but doesnt know she's hurting the grace concept.

there is THAT faith that acknowledges that there is a god. There are many

religions that believe that to be true. Most religions believe there is a "one god."

the scripture says "Jude 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. "

however believing there is a god does not save you. actually believing there is a god and being good does not save you either. so it is true

that works does not save you.

have you noticed that accepting Christ, which is what does save you, is not mentioned in this passage?

so "yes" there are many that will accept Christ but will not take doctrine in to demonstrate it. but NOT demonstratiing it does not mean they

are not really saved. it just means that God will whip them in shape.

I AM SO EMPRESSED WITH YOUR INSIGHT SUZANNE. ANDREW WOMMACK CALLS IT REVALATION KNOWLEDGE

[Smalcald]

Smalcald wrote:

But we already have direct passages about the role of works and salvation, we don't need to infer.

Like the rest, we were by nature objects of wrath. 4But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions

[ALTACALL]

I think I'm making it sound complicated. Sorry, don't mean to. I'm just saying that for it to be TRUE, "belief/faith/" it must be obedience, therefore you have to have ALL of the components of BELIEF/FAITH/OBEDIENCE. They all go together.

In His Love,

Suzanne

I think you can have belief/faith without obedience.

Check this out...

Romans 1

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,

19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them.

These people were shown the truth and they believed....otherwise it wouldn't have been truth to them. They however did not act upon that truth and brought the wrath of God against them.

of coarse you can have belief in God without obedience.

it's sad how there is a member here in this thread who's passing scripture interpretation

but doesnt know she's hurting the grace concept.

there is THAT faith that acknowledges that there is a god. There are many

religions that believe that to be true. Most religions believe there is a "one god."

the scripture says "Jude 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. "

however believing there is a god does not save you. actually believing there is a god and being good does not save you either. so it is true

that works does not save you.

have you noticed that accepting Christ, which is what does save you, is not mentioned in this passage?

so "yes" there are many that will accept Christ but will not take doctrine in to demonstrate it. but NOT demonstratiing it does not mean they

are not really saved. it just means that God will whip them in shape.

So, we can ignore the warning within the Word?

Hebrews 3:7 So, as the Holy Spirit says: "Today, if you hear his voice, 8 do not harden your hearts as you did in the rebellion, during the time of testing in the desert, 9 where your fathers tested and tried me and for forty years saw what I did. 10 That is why I was angry with that generation, and I said, 'Their hearts are always going astray, and they have not known my ways.' 11 So I declared on oath in my anger, 'They shall never enter my rest.'" 12 See to it, brothers, that none of you has a sinful, unbelieving heart that turns away from the living God. 13 But encourage one another daily, as long as it is called Today, so that none of you may be hardened by sin's deceitfulness. 14 We have come to share in Christ if we hold firmly till the end the confidence we had at first. 15 As has just been said: "Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts as you did in the rebellion." 16 Who were they who heard and rebelled? Were they not all those Moses led out of Egypt? 17 And with whom was he angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies fell in the desert? 18 And to whom did God swear that they would never enter his rest if not to those who disobeyed? 19 So we see that they were not able to enter, because of their unbelief.

So, you are saying that God will show us MORE FAVOR, and whip US into shape? But, too bad for the Israelites, because they just disobeyed/disbelieved, and He didn't want to spend the time "whipping them into shape"???

I think you need to think about what we are being warned of. Maybe you ought to go back and read my original post, to understand what is being spoken of?

1 Cor. 10:6 Now these things occurred as examples to keep us from setting our hearts on evil things as they did. 7 Do not be idolaters, as some of them were; as it is written: "The people sat down to eat and drink and got up to indulge in pagan revelry." 8 We should not commit sexual immorality, as some of them did--and in one day twenty-three thousand of them died. 9 We should not test the Lord, as some of them did--and were killed by snakes. 10 And do not grumble, as some of them did--and were killed by the destroying angel. 11 These things happened to them as examples and were written down as warnings for us, on whom the fulfillment of the ages has come. 12 So, if you think you are standing firm, be careful that you don't fall! 13 No temptation has seized you except what is common to man. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can stand up under it. 14 Therefore, my dear friends, flee from idolatry.

In His Love,

Suzanne

I agree. I especially like the way you have highlighted the words in red, showing that disobedience is being used as a synonym for unbelief. Believing is doing what he says in obedience to that belief. You can have belief in Christ without obeying him. It is when you believe in the fact that he died for us, but you don

[ALTACALL]

I think I'm making it sound complicated. Sorry, don't mean to. I'm just saying that for it to be TRUE, "belief/faith/" it must be obedience, therefore you have to have ALL of the components of BELIEF/FAITH/OBEDIENCE. They all go together.

In His Love,

Suzanne

I think you can have belief/faith without obedience.

Check this out...

Romans 1

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,

19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them.

These people were shown the truth and they believed....otherwise it wouldn't have been truth to them. They however did not act upon that truth and brought the wrath of God against them.

PAUL WAS NOT TALKING ABOUT DECIPLES, HE WAS TALKING TO DECIPLES ABOUT THE LOST

Who are the lost you are refering to?

Please turn off your caps.

The jews. the forefathers, the religeous leaders.keep reading on through chapter 1

[ALTACALL]

Completely agree jackied....and again proves my point that they ALL must be a part of the equation. You cannot have a portion missing of the 3.

In His Love,

Suzanne

Everyone seems to be agreeing with you with realizeing it.

[ALTACALL]

If you leave the path to eternal life, you won

[Guest man]

I think I'm making it sound complicated. Sorry, don't mean to. I'm just saying that for it to be TRUE, "belief/faith/" it must be obedience, therefore you have to have ALL of the components of BELIEF/FAITH/OBEDIENCE. They all go together.

In His Love,

Suzanne

I think you can have belief/faith without obedience.

Check this out...

Romans 1

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,

19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them.

These people were shown the truth and they believed....otherwise it wouldn't have been truth to them. They however did not act upon that truth and brought the wrath of God against them.

PAUL WAS NOT TALKING ABOUT DECIPLES, HE WAS TALKING TO DECIPLES ABOUT THE LOST

Who are the lost you are refering to?

Please turn off your caps.

The jews. the forefathers, the religeous leaders.keep reading on through chapter 1

These people had belief/faith but not obedience. They knew who God was and chose to ignore the warnings.

Eventhough they were lost, they still believed.

Thanks for turning off your caps.

[ALTACALL]

I quite don't see the misunderstanding here. Yes we are saved by grace and Our faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, but my responsibility doesn't stop there. Many many scriptures have warned us about the results of losing our faith. Rev. chapter two gives a prime example of those who LEFT THEIR FIRST LOVE, I believe I posted this in another thread, they couldn't have left something they never had in the first place. Obviously at one time they had been saved. The passage also states that God saw their good works and was pleased with them, sounds like they go hand in hand. And in Rev. 3:14 the Lord goes into detail of those who are luke warm, the results don't sound to pleasant for them. But in 1Timothy 6:12 the Lord tells us to "Fight the good fight of faith." Now would he tell us to fight the fight if there wasn't a war going on for our faith? And if we don't fight to keep it ? We lose it. We all know that satan has come to kill, steal, and destroy. Destroy what? Our physical lives, no. Thats not where our power lies. Our power comes from our FAITH in Jesus Christ. If the enemy can have our faith he has everything. The battle field is our mind, that's why in 2Chorinthians 10:3-5 the Lord has given us the weapons we nedd to counter attack the workings of the enemy. Finally in closing, the word "christian" means to be "Christ like." The word tells us that He came to be a servant, and we are to follow His example. John 10 :4 "And when he putteth forth his own sheep. he goeth before them and the sheep follow him, for they know his voice."

Are you listening all you once saved always saved people. maybe you are, maybe you're not. why take a chance?

[ALTACALL]

those scriptures dont support your interpretation.

What is your interpretation of the verses she quoted?

how does one start? lol

belief and faith.

"God destroys those that dont believe. (Jude 1:5)" well...what does that mean that they werent saved? or can God

take someone life that is saved for making a wrong one time decision but didn't believe for a fraction of a second?

You said her interpretation was wrong.

I was simply asking for your interpretation.

Where to start?.....go to the OP and work from there.

As for Jude 1:5...

5 But I want to remind you, though you once knew this, that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe.

He didn't destroy them all........just the ones who didn't believe.

xrockstar, you really do sound like you're looking for a theological fight and Suzanne is right and you are looking at a sliver in ones eye while having a beam in your own.