Did Jesus descend into hell?

[BlindSeeker]

The Father hates sin. Jesus, in all His sinlessness, took upon Himself all sin and its consequenses, 'death' for all men who repent in His Name. The Father, at the ninth hour did forsake His Son and let Him DIE! He had too or else Jesus's life and death would have meant nothing.

"And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me" (Matt. 27:46). If the Father did not forsake Jesus, why did Jesus Cry, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?"

"And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" (Mark 15:34). Again, If the Father did not forsake Jesus, why did Jesus Cry, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?"

Jesus often quoted Scripture and the statement in the paslms was a prophecy that Jeus would die, and that the Father would have to forsake Him in order for Him to die for mankind. Jesus died in our place. Anyone who dies in sin is forsaken by God. Jesus was sinless but He took upon Himself our sins and the Father resurrected Jesus on the third day as promised and as foretold by Jesus Himself. "For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." (Matt. 12:40).

Why would God forsake Jesus at the moment where He was going to be glorified and the devil condemned?

This insistence of some to say Jesus took on all our sin and became sin personified such that the Father could not gaze upon Him to me is a gross error on two counts; 1st, the omnipotence of God, and 2nd, the fact that Jesus remained the righteousness of God.

Jesus quoting Psalm 22 was merely pointing all the religious leaders there mocking Him to come down from the cross to the prophecy which defined the whole event . . . that those who had ears might hear.

Ps 22:14 I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels.

15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death.

16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.

17 I may tell all my bones: they look and stare upon me.

18 They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture.

Every religious leader would have reflected back to this psalm upon hearing Jesus quoting the words of David, "My God, My God, Why hast thou forsaken me?"

The Psalm even declares the following

[HAZARD]

"This is heresy plain and simple, for Christ did not die as an angel but a man. He did not spill some type of angel blood to cover the sins of the angels"

.

________________________________________________

Before anyone goes running off at the mouth and with absolutly no authority start accusing someone of heresy, no one said Jesus died for the angels. The Scriptures do plainly state that there were/are some angels cast down to hell and are there in chains because of sins committed, "For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;" (2 Peter 2:4), and Jesus did go and preach to them during the three days and nights He was dead. "By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;" (1 Peter 3:19). The only spirits in Hell would be fallen angels. Fallen men are not called spirit beings? To preach is to expound, to declare, to deliver a discourse on a subject. No one said Jesus went to Hell to save fallen spirits?

Forgive me for misreading you. I went back again and reread what you stated. You did not say that Jesus died for the angels. Now what I will say is this. There is no sure evidence that Jesus did preach to the angels. I read commentary from a dear brother and he agreed this was the accepted interpertation. But he went on to mention there were two more, one in which, holds that the spirts are those human spirits that disobeyed Noahs teaching. I am sure one mentioned that here. Now as to what I will agree to, I will not say agree to either interpertation. I will just agree to the Word as it is written and allow God to explain it.

Once again I ask that you forgive me for my previous words, and prayfully this does not hinder our fellowship.

Hi 'ruck 1b'

We remain friends forever, in Jesus name. Mate, I am not offended, I see the word heresy is sometimes trotted out a little quickly. Personally, I also believe we have no authority to call anyone heretics. Heretic is a strong statement which I would never be game to apply to anyone. Remember Paul when accused of herecy? "But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:" (Acts 24:14). The religious of his day accused him of herecy and it seems they were wrong.

As far as spirit beings go, Only God, all angles and demons have spirit bodies and are called spirits. We humans have physical bodies and are finite beings with God's Spirit in us, but we are not spirits. I dont believe the word Spirit is used anywhere in Scripture to describe human beings, fallen or otherwise? The difference between spirits and humans is substance. Spirit beings are created by God of an eternal substance, human beings are created from the dust a finite substance.

[Massorite]

The Father hates sin. Jesus, in all His sinlessness, took upon Himself all sin and its consequenses, 'death' for all men who repent in His Name. The Father, at the ninth hour did forsake His Son and let Him DIE! He had too or else Jesus's life and death would have meant nothing.

"And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me" (Matt. 27:46). If the Father did not forsake Jesus, why did Jesus Cry, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?"

"And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" (Mark 15:34). Again, If the Father did not forsake Jesus, why did Jesus Cry, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?"

Jesus often quoted Scripture and the statement in the paslms was a prophecy that Jeus would die, and that the Father would have to forsake Him in order for Him to die for mankind. Jesus died in our place. Anyone who dies in sin is forsaken by God. Jesus was sinless but He took upon Himself our sins and the Father resurrected Jesus on the third day as promised and as foretold by Jesus Himself. "For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." (Matt. 12:40).

Why would God forsake Jesus at the moment where He was going to be glorified and the devil condemned?

This insistence of some to say Jesus took on all our sin and became sin personified such that the Father could not gaze upon Him to me is a gross error on two counts; 1st, the omnipotence of God, and 2nd, the fact that Jesus remained the righteousness of God.

Jesus quoting Psalm 22 was merely pointing all the religious leaders there mocking Him to come down from the cross to the prophecy which defined the whole event . . . that those who had ears might hear.

Ps 22:14 I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels.

15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death.

16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.

17 I may tell all my bones: they look and stare upon me.

18 They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture.

Every religious leader would have reflected back to this psalm upon hearing Jesus quoting the words of David, "My God, My God, Why hast thou forsaken me?"

The Psalm even declares the following

[HAZARD]

Angels.

2 Peter 2:4; For IF GOD SPARED NOT THE ANGELS who sinned, but cast them down to Hell, and deliviered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;"

The angels who did not sin, as opposed to those who did sin, are still with God since He created them before the foundation of the world. What would would we call those who did not sin and are still with God? Would we call them saved, as opposed to being cast into Hell and deliverd into chains of darkness, or would we call them, just lucky?

And what would be the point of God casting them into Hell, delivering them into chains of darkness, and reserving these angels who sinned unto judgment if they were not first of all, sinless, saved, and unfortunately for them, just happened to sin? What would be the point? And, would those angels who sinned, and were cast into Hell and were delivered unto chains of darkness, not lost? and never saved at all? If they were never saved, then why reserve them unto judgment? Why not just leave them in hell forever. I mean, God said they did sin? And another question. Satan was created perfect, he sinned, he is no longer is perfect. He is the adversary of both God and man. Can we say he never lost what he never had? And what about his perfection? Didn't he loose his perfection, or maybe he never had perfection? There are angels in Hell according to the Scriptures and they are spirit beings and the Scriptures plainly state Jesus preached to spirits in Hell.

Haz.

[BlindSeeker]

Angels.

2 Peter 2:4; For IF GOD SPARED NOT THE ANGELS who sinned, but cast them down to Hell, and deliviered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;"

The angels who did not sin, as opposed to those who did sin, are still with God since He created them before the foundation of the world. What would would we call those who did not sin and are still with God? Would we call them saved, as opposed to being cast into Hell and deliverd into chains of darkness, or would we call them, just lucky?

And what would be the point of God casting them into Hell, delivering them into chains of darkness, and reserving these angels who sinned unto judgment if they were not first of all, sinless, saved, and unfortunately for them, just happened to sin? What would be the point? And, would those angels who sinned, and were cast into Hell and were delivered unto chains of darkness, not lost? and never saved at all? If they were never saved, then why reserve them unto judgment? Why not just leave them in hell forever. I mean, God said they did sin? And another question. Satan was created perfect, he sinned, he is no longer is perfect. He is the adversary of both God and man. Can we say he never lost what he never had? And what about his perfection? Didn't he loose his perfection, or maybe he never had perfection? There are angels in Hell according to the Scriptures and they are spirit beings and the Scriptures plainly state Jesus preached to spirits in Hell.

Haz.

No. It does not say that.

[BlindSeeker]

Jesus did not go to hell and preach to spirits / angels there . . .

See this post . . . and/or this one . . . and/or this one.

Edited July 1, 2008 by BlindSeeker

[Celt]

Clearly the argument here is not really about some creed declaring whether or not our Lord Jesus descended into hell to preach, but how one believes what happens after flesh death; and who Peter meant by the word 'spirits' (Greek pneuma) in 1 Pet.3:19.

We are not limited to assigning that Greek word 'pneuma' only to fallen angels, evil spirits and demons, or whatnot, because it's also the same Greek word used elsewhere in the New Testament for the spirit in man.

Luke 8:52-55

52 And all wept, and bewailed her: but He said, Weep not; she is not dead, but sleepeth.

53 And they laughed Him to scorn, knowing that she was dead.

54 And He put them all out, and took her by the hand, and called, saying, Maid, arise.

55 And her spirit came again, and she arose straightway: and He commanded to give her meat.

(KJV)

Luke 23:46

46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, He said, Father, into Thy hands I commend My spirit: and having said thus, He gave up the ghost.

(KJV)

Acts 7:59

59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.

(KJV)

I Jn 4:1-2

1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

(KJV)

Now I don't believe in a place called purgatory, but I do believe hell exists like Jesus showed in Luke 16 about the rich man. There Christ related a story about a great gulf fixed border in Paradise between hell where the rich man was, and on the other side of Paradise Abraham's bosom where Lazarus was. The rich man was able to look across that fixed border of separation over at Lazarus and Abraham, and even speak to Abraham.

Moreover, Peter describes hell as a prison in 1 Peter 3:19. Isaiah did also...

Isa 24:21-22

21 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the LORD shall punish the host of the high ones that are on high, and the kings of the earth upon the earth.

22 And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited.

(KJV)

Isa 42:6-7

6 I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.(KJV)

Rev 20:7

7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

(KJV)

God's Word compares the abode of the wicked dead called 'hell' to a prison.

1 Pet 3:18-20

18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

19 By which also He went and preached unto the spirits in prison;

What's the main subject of those two verses above? That Christ being Just suffered once for the sins of the unjust, so He might bring us to God. He was put to death in His flesh but quickened by The Spirit... "By which also He went and preached unto the spirits in prison". Verse 19 picks up that same subject of Christ suffering for the unjust. The "spirits in prison" there are the "unjust". They are not demons, not evil spirits, not angels. They are the spirits of the unjust, those in condemnation like the rich man of Luke 16.

20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

(KJV)

The fallen angels that rebelled we are told are held in chains unto the judgment of the great day (Jude). They are destined to perish along with Satan. The subject of verse 20 is about souls, since only eight souls were saved by water, meaning Noah and his family.

And the Greek word for "preached" is kerusso, which is especially about the preaching of The Gospel.

If those "spirits" were fallen angels, or demons, or evil spirits, why would Christ have need to preach The Gospel to those? Some claim Christ was only declaring His Victory to those spirits. But the context of those verses is about Christ suffering for the unjust, and those souls who were disobedient during the time the ark was preparing.

Eccl 12:5-7

5 Also when they shall be afraid of that which is high, and fears shall be in the way, and the almond tree shall flourish, and the grasshopper shall be a burden, and desire shall fail: because man goeth to his long home, and the mourners go about the streets:

6 Or ever the silver cord be loosed, or the golden bowl be broken, or the pitcher be broken at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern.

7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.(KJV)

When the "silver cord" that somehow keeps our soul and spirit attached to our flesh is loosed or broken, then our flesh body goes back to the earth where it came from, and our soul and spirit goes back to God.

1 Cor 15:44

44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

(KJV)

[Guest parpar]

It is my belief Jesus did not descend into hell but to the grave. The word 'sheol' can be translated either way, and that is probably where part of the hell doctrine came from. Although, I must admit the passage in Peter has always confused me because even if he did preach to those in hell as it seems to imply, that really wouldn't make any sense because judgement would have been sealed. My only speculation is He went to those who were in a place only mentioned as "Abraham's Bosom", which is also what Catholics call purgatory. The curtain in the temple was rent symbolizing we now have free access to God the Father through the blood of the Son. I believe this was also symbolic of what happened in the spirit world and the "curtain" between Abraham's Bosom and heaven was also ripped. In other words, Jesus did not actually minister to those in hell but to those whose bodies were in the grave and whose spirits were in Abraham's Bosom.

Hi Xan.

Perhaps what follows will be of help?

I was asked the question.

"Is it true that Jesus went to Hell when he died?"

In reply I said.

The answer to your question is no He did not, as is made clear in the verse below.

Jhn 19:30 So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, "It is finished!" And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.

Everything that Jesus had to do to save us was, "finished", before He died, the following verses are sometimes used to teach that Jesus went to Hell after His death.

1Pe 3:18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us[fn5] to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit,

1Pe 3:19 by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison,

1Pe 3:20 who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited[fn6] in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.

All this passage is telling us is that it was the Holy Spirit speaking through Noah, while the ark was being prepared, that preached to people alive at that time, who did not repent, and whose spirits are now in prison

parpar.

[Celt]

Perhaps what follows will be of help?

I was asked the question.

"Is it true that Jesus went to Hell when he died?"

In reply I said.

The answer to your question is no He did not, as is made clear in the verse below.

Jhn 19:30 So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, "It is finished!" And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.

Everything that Jesus had to do to save us was, "finished", before He died, the following verses are sometimes used to teach that Jesus went to Hell after His death.

1Pe 3:18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us[fn5] to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit,

1Pe 3:19 by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison,

1Pe 3:20 who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited[fn6] in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.

All this passage is telling us is that it was the Holy Spirit speaking through Noah, while the ark was being prepared, that preached to people alive at that time, who did not repent, and whose spirits are now in prison

parpar.

Might want to note the 1 Peter 3:19 verse again; it was Christ Who preached The Gospel to those "spirits in prison". That preaching wasn't in Noah's day. What 1 Peter 3:20 says was in Noah's day, was how those spirits were disobedient against God.

Edited July 8, 2008 by Celt

[BlindSeeker]

Perhaps what follows will be of help?

I was asked the question.

"Is it true that Jesus went to Hell when he died?"

In reply I said.

The answer to your question is no He did not, as is made clear in the verse below.

Jhn 19:30 So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, "It is finished!" And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.

Everything that Jesus had to do to save us was, "finished", before He died, the following verses are sometimes used to teach that Jesus went to Hell after His death.

1Pe 3:18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us[fn5] to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit,

1Pe 3:19 by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison,

1Pe 3:20 who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited[fn6] in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.

All this passage is telling us is that it was the Holy Spirit speaking through Noah, while the ark was being prepared, that preached to people alive at that time, who did not repent, and whose spirits are now in prison

parpar.

Might want to note the 1 Peter 3:19 verse again; it was Christ Who preached The Gospel to those "spirits in prison". That preaching wasn't in Noah's day. What 1 Peter 3:20 says was in Noah's day, was how those spirits were disobedient against God.

You may want to provide a logical answer then as to why Jesus went and spoke to "those spirits" which were disobedient in the days on Noah.

Why does Holy Writ focus in on only those spirits from that time?

What about all the spirits before and after Noah that were disobedient?