Marriage

[Guest shiloh357]

Please...

What'sa matter?

Can't find no one to argue with?

I was just responding to your last response to me. I guess you can't find anythnig substantive to say.

[Guest HIS girl]

G.A.P - there is enough good advice here for you to feel a tug in the right direction.... actually MORE than a tug.

[Guest zabby]

If "sex" made people married, then adultery, fornication, incest would be impossible, as every time you had sex you would be having it with a spouse.

Marriage is a covenant. That covenant is consumated in the bedroom, but sex is not the covnenant itself.

The absence of a prescribed ceremony is pointless, as it is not the ceremony itself that marries to people. It is their covenant to one another before God that is the basis of marriage.

Exactly my point.

Thank you.

No that was not your point. Your posts indicate that you think sex makes a person married. Your "point" was pretty much torpedoed.

That's an assumption on your part.

Show me where I indicated that having sex is the equivalent of being married.

Stop pretending to be obtuse.

The fact is that your remarks were made in the context of discussing fornication. Your question pertained to two people having sex and implying that they might actually be married. Your question clearly indicated a view (albeit a false one) that sex was how people were "married" in Bible times. It is a commonly held misconception by many modern Christians and it was evident in what you posted.

I was discussing the definition of marriage.

Read my questions again.

You stated this.

as it is not the ceremony itself that marries to people. It is their covenant to one another before God that is the basis of marriage.

That's what I was trying to get her to see.

It had nothing to do with fornication.

Please... It has everything to do with fornication. People who are simply living together are not married simply because they have engaged in sex. Marriage is a covenant and the OP had no such covenant, which means the OP was not married. His Girl states that she was convicted to leave a similar situation. If they were genuinely married in God's eyes then there would have been no such conviction.

Marital relations simply consumates the covenant of marriage. It is not the basis of the marriage and it is not the covenant in and of itself. It is the sign of the covenant of marriage (aside from the wedding ring).

Sex does not make people married. If it did, then there would be no such thing as "pre-marital sex."

As for your "questions," in post#34, they were designed to cast doubt on the notion that the couple in question was not married. Your line of questioning implied that they might very well be married in the eyes of God even though we claim that sex outside of marriage is fornication.

A major whole exists in your previous line of reasoning and now you are back pedaling and trying to pretend that you didn't really say what you said.

Shiloh this is Zabby

Now I do not know what on earth you are talking about??? I believe marraige consists of 3 parts civil, cerimonial, and consumation. I believe that based on God's Holy Word. I woul like to ask what are your credentials in the study of the Word are you a Pastor? Clergy of any kind? What degree do you hold in of from Bible college? or is this all just your opinion? My credentials are Masters in Theology and Pastored for many years still teach resigned my credentials from Assembly of God, And Foursquare International. My ordination of course never goes away just my active license because I wanted it too. What are you crede tials if any? Please Do you hold a Doctorate? PHD? In Bibilcal studies? I guess the greater question I have is that I do not see or read LOVE from your posts just anger;.... and I wonder where is the fruit of the HOly Spirit? I do not see it... I do not back peddle for anyone.......... I love our Lord Jesus and pray that you are blessed in your personal walk....

[Guest HIS girl]

If "sex" made people married, then adultery, fornication, incest would be impossible, as every time you had sex you would be having it with a spouse.

Marriage is a covenant. That covenant is consumated in the bedroom, but sex is not the covnenant itself.

The absence of a prescribed ceremony is pointless, as it is not the ceremony itself that marries to people. It is their covenant to one another before God that is the basis of marriage.

Exactly my point.

Thank you.

No that was not your point. Your posts indicate that you think sex makes a person married. Your "point" was pretty much torpedoed.

That's an assumption on your part.

Show me where I indicated that having sex is the equivalent of being married.

Stop pretending to be obtuse.

The fact is that your remarks were made in the context of discussing fornication. Your question pertained to two people having sex and implying that they might actually be married. Your question clearly indicated a view (albeit a false one) that sex was how people were "married" in Bible times. It is a commonly held misconception by many modern Christians and it was evident in what you posted.

I was discussing the definition of marriage.

Read my questions again.

You stated this.

as it is not the ceremony itself that marries to people. It is their covenant to one another before God that is the basis of marriage.

That's what I was trying to get her to see.

It had nothing to do with fornication.

Please... It has everything to do with fornication. People who are simply living together are not married simply because they have engaged in sex. Marriage is a covenant and the OP had no such covenant, which means the OP was not married. His Girl states that she was convicted to leave a similar situation. If they were genuinely married in God's eyes then there would have been no such conviction.

Marital relations simply consumates the covenant of marriage. It is not the basis of the marriage and it is not the covenant in and of itself. It is the sign of the covenant of marriage (aside from the wedding ring).

Sex does not make people married. If it did, then there would be no such thing as "pre-marital sex."

As for your "questions," in post#34, they were designed to cast doubt on the notion that the couple in question was not married. Your line of questioning implied that they might very well be married in the eyes of God even though we claim that sex outside of marriage is fornication.

A major whole exists in your previous line of reasoning and now you are back pedaling and trying to pretend that you didn't really say what you said.

Shiloh this is Zabby

Now I do not know what on earth you are talking about??? I believe marraige consists of 3 parts civil, cerimonial, and consumation. I believe that based on God's Holy Word. I woul like to ask what are your credentials in the study of the Word are you a Pastor? Clergy of any kind? What degree do you hold in of from Bible college? or is this all just your opinion? My credentials are Masters in Theology and Pastored for many years still teach resigned my credentials from Assembly of God, And Foursquare International. My ordination of course never goes away just my active license because I wanted it too. What are you crede tials if any? Please Do you hold a Doctorate? PHD? In Bibilcal studies? I guess the greater question I have is that I do not see or read LOVE from your posts just anger;.... and I wonder where is the fruit of the HOly Spirit? I do not see it... I do not back peddle for anyone.......... I love our Lord Jesus and pray that you are blessed in your personal walk....

Zabby, HOW do you see anger in shiloh's posts? I'm confused.....VERY.

[Guest shiloh357]

Now I do not know what on earth you are talking about??? I believe marraige consists of 3 parts civil, cerimonial, and consumation.

I think you are missing the point I was making to man. My posts to him stated that marriage is not based on sex. Sex is not what "makes" a person married. Marriage is a covenant between a husband and wife to one another and made by both to God and in God's presence. Sex is the consummation of marriage.

There is popular but misheld view among some that in the Old Testament days once two people had sex they were essentially married before God. My posts to man did not in anyway diminish the ceremonial, or civil aspect of a wedding/marriage. I was simply addressing specific issue.

I woul like to ask what are your credentials in the study of the Word are you a Pastor? Clergy of any kind? What degree do you hold in of from Bible college?

Irrelevant.

My credentials are Masters in Theology and Pastored for many years still teach resigned my credentials from Assembly of God, And Foursquare International. My ordination of course never goes away just my active license because I wanted it too.

Again, that is irrelevant to the discussion.

I guess the greater question I have is that I do not see or read LOVE from your posts just anger;....

I am not angry at all. I am simply honest.

I do not back peddle for anyone

I didn't say you were. I was talking to man, not you. You might want to check the post and make sure you are aware of who is speaking to whom.

[Guest zabby]

If "sex" made people married, then adultery, fornication, incest would be impossible, as every time you had sex you would be having it with a spouse.

Marriage is a covenant. That covenant is consumated in the bedroom, but sex is not the covnenant itself.

The absence of a prescribed ceremony is pointless, as it is not the ceremony itself that marries to people. It is their covenant to one another before God that is the basis of marriage.

Exactly my point.

Thank you.

No that was not your point. Your posts indicate that you think sex makes a person married. Your "point" was pretty much torpedoed.

That's an assumption on your part.

Show me where I indicated that having sex is the equivalent of being married.

Stop pretending to be obtuse.

The fact is that your remarks were made in the context of discussing fornication. Your question pertained to two people having sex and implying that they might actually be married. Your question clearly indicated a view (albeit a false one) that sex was how people were "married" in Bible times. It is a commonly held misconception by many modern Christians and it was evident in what you posted.

I was discussing the definition of marriage.

Read my questions again.

You stated this.

as it is not the ceremony itself that marries to people. It is their covenant to one another before God that is the basis of marriage.

That's what I was trying to get her to see.

It had nothing to do with fornication.

Please... It has everything to do with fornication. People who are simply living together are not married simply because they have engaged in sex. Marriage is a covenant and the OP had no such covenant, which means the OP was not married. His Girl states that she was convicted to leave a similar situation. If they were genuinely married in God's eyes then there would have been no such conviction.

Marital relations simply consumates the covenant of marriage. It is not the basis of the marriage and it is not the covenant in and of itself. It is the sign of the covenant of marriage (aside from the wedding ring).

Sex does not make people married. If it did, then there would be no such thing as "pre-marital sex."

As for your "questions," in post#34, they were designed to cast doubt on the notion that the couple in question was not married. Your line of questioning implied that they might very well be married in the eyes of God even though we claim that sex outside of marriage is fornication.

A major whole exists in your previous line of reasoning and now you are back pedaling and trying to pretend that you didn't really say what you said.

Shiloh this is Zabby

Now I do not know what on earth you are talking about??? I believe marraige consists of 3 parts civil, cerimonial, and consumation. I believe that based on God's Holy Word. I woul like to ask what are your credentials in the study of the Word are you a Pastor? Clergy of any kind? What degree do you hold in of from Bible college? or is this all just your opinion? My credentials are Masters in Theology and Pastored for many years still teach resigned my credentials from Assembly of God, And Foursquare International. My ordination of course never goes away just my active license because I wanted it too. What are you crede tials if any? Please Do you hold a Doctorate? PHD? In Bibilcal studies? I guess the greater question I have is that I do not see or read LOVE from your posts just anger;.... and I wonder where is the fruit of the HOly Spirit? I do not see it... I do not back peddle for anyone.......... I love our Lord Jesus and pray that you are blessed in your personal walk....

Zabby, HOW do you see anger in shiloh's posts? I'm confused.....VERY.

I say it by the way subjects are stated. Of course Shiloh just wrote to tell me that he was not posting to me.. my email said he was. In fact I was sent an email notification telling Shiloh had just responded to my post. Now as for Man I will not even distrub my self with man he seems to me to argumentative I do not come here to aruge. I am leaving the post alone because it is hard for me to know who is posting what because if Shiloh was talking to man it came directly to me....... Sorry for the confusion..

[Guest zabby]

Now I do not know what on earth you are talking about??? I believe marraige consists of 3 parts civil, cerimonial, and consumation.

I think you are missing the point I was making to man. My posts to him stated that marriage is not based on sex. Sex is not what "makes" a person married. Marriage is a covenant between a husband and wife to one another and made by both to God and in God's presence. Sex is the consummation of marriage.

There is popular but misheld view among some that in the Old Testament days once two people had sex they were essentially married before God. My posts to man did not in anyway diminish the ceremonial, or civil aspect of a wedding/marriage. I was simply addressing specific issue.

I woul like to ask what are your credentials in the study of the Word are you a Pastor? Clergy of any kind? What degree do you hold in of from Bible college?

Irrelevant.

My credentials are Masters in Theology and Pastored for many years still teach resigned my credentials from Assembly of God, And Foursquare International. My ordination of course never goes away just my active license because I wanted it too.

Again, that is irrelevant to the discussion.

I guess the greater question I have is that I do not see or read LOVE from your posts just anger;....

I am not angry at all. I am simply honest.

I do not back peddle for anyone

I didn't say you were. I was talking to man, not you. You might want to check the post and make sure you are aware of who is speaking to whom.

Shiloh if you were not talking to me then why did I get the email alearting me to the fact that you had responded to a post I made? And for me if we are questioning one the others opinions education and ministerial experience does matter and is relavant at least to me it is... I would not in any way interfere with a conversation you ae having with Man as I do not respond to man PERIOD. No offence was intended -I got the notice in my email and I understood you where talking to me not man.. Sorry!

[Guest shiloh357]

Shiloh if you were not talking to me then why did I get the email alearting me to the fact that you had responded to a post I made?

If you are subsribing to this thread, you will get E-mail alerts to ALL responses in this thread regardless of who they are too. The purpose of that is to alert you to all responses, not just those who are responding to you. I realize it may say that people are responding to you, but that is just a default alert. It alerts you to ALL responses regardless.

If you will read my remarks, you will see I was responding to man and man alone. I have not addressed you in this thread until now. It is important in a messageboard environment to double check and make sure you know to which person you speaking, and who is speaking to you. Many unfortunate misunderstandings occur when people mistake one poster for another.

And for me if we are questioning one the others opinions education and ministerial experience does matter and is relavant at least to me it is...

It is not material in this discussion and anyway, even an advanced education in theology does not guarantee an accurate biblical worldview.

No offence was intended -I got the notice in my email and I understood you where talking to me not man.. Sorry!

Not a aproblem. I am not offended. I just recognized that you might have gotten some of the conversation confused.

[Guest man]

quote] I just recognized that you might have gotten some of the conversation confused.

Like the one she claims to have had with me.

[Guest HIS girl]

Okay....

Has everyone kissed and made up?

Good!!...