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Guest HIS girl
Posted

Oh I see - I find it hard that you don't understand yet. I can't explain it any other way than what I have already presented. I know I'm not as articulate as others on WB - but I haven't typed my thoughts in mud you know..

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Posted
Oh I see - I find it hard that you don't understand yet. I can't explain it any other way than what I have already presented. I know I'm not as articulate as others on WB - but I haven't typed my thoughts in mud you know..

So does #1 apply to John 6:37 or #2? I am not trying to pervert anything you are saying I am just trying to understand what it is that you are saying. I see lots of contradictions in your ideas. I am sure you don't.

LT


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Posted
And if you throw that lifeline to someone that is unconscious in the water how can you condemn that person for not grabbing hold?

You changed the scenario. You added to what was said, thus changing the message.

Your assumption and analogy do not account for the inability of the man in the water to help himself. So how do you answer??????

The death of Christ on the Cross is an open invitation to anyone who wants to accept it.

No one is held back. Everyone has the ability to grab hold of that Lifeline.

No one, "is unconscious in the water".

And this is where you and I differ. I didn't change anything in my original question but added some of the attributes of God. The God I believe in cannot fail and never does anything half way. He never tries to do something - He does whatever He pleases and accomplishes His will. The life line to a man in the water only is as good as an understanding of the true nature of fallen man.

Man is dead spiritually. If you do not know this you do not know the scriptures. Man is as dead spiritually as the man in the graveyard grave, incapable of rising up in life.

LT

If man is spiritually dead then why does the bible speak of the spirit of a dead man going back to God where it came from only when he dies?

Posted
Man is dead spiritually. If you do not know this you do not know the scriptures. Man is as dead spiritually as the man in the graveyard grave, incapable of rising up in life.

Ok, when does man become spiritually undead?

What has to happen?

Guest HIS girl
Posted
Oh I see - I find it hard that you don't understand yet. I can't explain it any other way than what I have already presented. I know I'm not as articulate as others on WB - but I haven't typed my thoughts in mud you know..

So does #1 apply to John 6:37 or #2? I am not trying to pervert anything you are saying I am just trying to understand what it is that you are saying. I see lots of contradictions in your ideas. I am sure you don't.

LT

It is those that have accepted Salvation of their own freewill - note verse 40. This shows Salvation is for ALL mankind.

IMO larry for you to think that God selected YOU over Joe Blow, shows to me your elitist attitude and I think that stinks - sorry but I had to say that.


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Posted
Oh I see - I find it hard that you don't understand yet. I can't explain it any other way than what I have already presented. I know I'm not as articulate as others on WB - but I haven't typed my thoughts in mud you know..

So does #1 apply to John 6:37 or #2? I am not trying to pervert anything you are saying I am just trying to understand what it is that you are saying. I see lots of contradictions in your ideas. I am sure you don't.

LT

It is those that have accepted Salvation of their own freewill - note verse 40. This shows Salvation is for ALL mankind.

IMO larry for you to think that God selected YOU over Joe Blow, shows to me your elitist attitude and I think that stinks - sorry but I had to say that.

I do not want to put word in your mouth and I really don't understand why you are so evasive. I think you are saying it is #1.

1. Chosen - Before Creation as in God's Mind to have us here for a relationship - ALL men who have and are yet to be born - ALL. (He chose to make man - not make man exclusive to seperate them).

2. Chosen - those who are His (Jesus) AFTER Salvation. The elect.

If it is #1 then my question to you is:

How is it that it is the will of the Father that Jesus looses none of the ones give to Him? I see this passage as homogeneous from start to finish. The way you interpret it it would have to jump back and forth between your 2 definitions.

Joh 6:39 And this is the Father

Guest HIS girl
Posted

It is a hard verse to interpret I won't deny. It is Gods will that all men come to Him - God has given Jesus authority to judge all mankind - would Jesus have to judge men who are prechosen for Paradise with God?

See it's questions like that, that bring me to question the pre-eleted notion.


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Posted
Man is dead spiritually. If you do not know this you do not know the scriptures. Man is as dead spiritually as the man in the graveyard grave, incapable of rising up in life.

Ok, when does man become spiritually undead?

What has to happen?

When Adam died in the garden he died spiritually. He died physically 900+ yrs later, which was still within the Year as God sees a year(2Pe 3:8


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Posted
It is a hard verse to interpret I won't deny. It is Gods will that all men come to Him - God has given Jesus authority to judge all mankind - would Jesus have to judge men who are prechosen for Paradise with God?

See it's questions like that, that bring me to question the pre-eleted notion.

Why do you use the term pre-chosen and pre-elected? I do not recognize those term in the bible. The terms that are there are chosen and elected. It appears you are making a distinction that is not there.

Take your statement above.

If God will that ALL men come to Him, won't they all come to Him. God never fails to accomplish His purpose/will. God is perfect in all aspects. Would He will something that He cannot accomplish?

If we believe what God reveals about Himself it will grate against the natural mind and thinking of man. Man want's a god that he can understand. The God of the bible says to believe Him and what we need to understand He will reveal to us. We won't understand everything, even when we see Him in Glory, because we are finite and He is infinite.

LT

Posted
Man is dead spiritually. If you do not know this you do not know the scriptures. Man is as dead spiritually as the man in the graveyard grave, incapable of rising up in life.

Ok, when does man become spiritually undead?

What has to happen?

When Adam died in the garden he died spiritually. He died physically 900+ yrs later, which was still within the Year as God sees a year(2Pe 3:8

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