Esther4:14

It is bizarre that the news would cover a story like this. It sounds like the teacher was teaching the boy to dissociate. Dissociation is a very common defense mechanism. It is like driving on auto pilot. That is a function of dissociation (self hypnosis). Extreme forms of dissociation are caused by traumatic events. Jean Charcot, a French neurologist of the 19th century spent years studying the subject of hypnosis in patients considered to be afflicted with hysteria. Sigmund Freud found that patients he worked with afflicted with hysteria would often speak of what he called premature sexual experiences, which later morphed Oedipal complex because it was frowned upon to suggest that clients of Sigmund Freud (white woman) were victims of sexual assault. Jean Charcot seemed to think there was a relationship between hysteria and the capacity for hypnosis and spent a great deal of time on the subject. In this case, there is no reason to believe that this boy was the victim of anything traumatic that induced his capacity to dissociate as this is something everyone has the capacity to do as a natural mechanism of self defense. But, my purpose in referencing the history of the study of hypnosis is to label the phenomenon that caused such a tragedy with a more accurate definition, which is dissociation-what the mind does naturally in traumatic circumstances. The trendy term "hypnosis" is like trying to sell heroin in a candy wrapper. Wanting to be hypnotized, is like wanting to go to war and come back with PTSD. Dissociation (hypnosis) is a survival mechanism, not a toy. Peace.

I agree with you. Scripture clearly shows that God conceded to build the temple according to the desire that David had to build Him a temple when he became king. "Then David said to Nathan the prophet, “Look, I am living in a palace made of cedar wood, but the Ark of God is in a tent!” 3 Nathan said to the king, “Go and do what you really want to do, because the Lord is with you.” (2 Samuel 7:2-3). I think this was somewhat admirable of him to want to use his resources for the Lord as opposed to other ways he could have spent his fortunes. Nonetheless, the Lord's agreement to have a temple built at the request of the man after His own heart (1 Samuel 13:14) could not be considered His own command to serve any other purpose than to show favor towards David at the time that the temple was built. He did not consider David capable of building a temple because he has shed much blood, but He promised him that this would be accomplished through his son Solomon (1 Chronicles 22:9). Therefore, it is clear that He did not command a temple to built, but conceded to give this opportunity to a man who became a camel trying to get through the eye of a needle overnight (Mark 10:25). I think you make a good point here.

According to the law, there was an offering for unintentional sin (numbers15:27). So, it is possible that there was some degree of unintention on the part of Eve in eating the apple. It is possible that her action was not as defiant as it has been viewed and still be a sin. The intention or unintention of the action does not change whether something is a sin or not, even in the case of murder, which is why Israel was to have towns of refuge for anyone who killed someone accidentally or without malice (numbers 35:6). However, I do think it is hard for us to gauge her degree of intention because she does admit to knowing she was not supposed to eat the apple. Therefore, according to the law He gave His people, I would say this is a difficult case. When Moses was around, he would personally bring difficult cases like this to be judged individually by God Himself (deuteronomy 1:17), which He has done in this case assigning judgement to Adam, Eve, and the serpent. In conclusion, it is possible that their intention was weighed into their judgement because sin committed unintentionally would still be considered sin, not innocenece because of unintention.

I am kind of a sucker for John Milton, and I will use every opportunity I get to rave about him. So, I think that his portrayal of the Genesis account of Adam and Eve is the best illustration of the subject of submission that I have ever heard in my life. Sometimes, talking about Adam and Eve gets a little redundant because we run out things to say pretty quickly. But, he takes this brief account from scripture and turns it into this beautiful piece of art. It is very long poem, but I highly recommend reading it if you have the chance. Anyways, in Paradise Lost, there is Adam, and there is Eve. They were happy, and in love, and getting ready to start their day working in the garden. Milton portrays Eve as being rather industrious and it her idea that they will get more work done if they separate for a time (Proverbs 31:13-16). Adam doesn't think it is a good idea because they have been warned of the serpent in the garden. She insists she will be okay, and because Adam loves her, he gives her the freedom to work on her own for the day. Therefore, I think that submission represents freedom. Through Adam’s submission to Eve’s request, Eve was given freedom, which is a word that is often missing from our vocabulary whenever we discuss the subject of submission. “For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore, and do not submit again to a yoke of slavery.” (Galatians 5:1).

Hmm, interesting. Just wondering, but when would the next one be?

I think some people have itching ears and search for someone to teach them rather than read scripture themselves. I am baffled every time I have ever seen a Joel Osteen service when you see the hundreds of people there holding up their bibles and reciting this chant about being what the Bible says and all that jazz. Then Joel Osteen proceeds to give a inspirational speech that has nothing to do with the Bible and only uses like 2 verses to support his speech. But, people would rather do this than read the Bible, which is a shame. However, even with the plethora of false teaching that is present, I do think that people are too quick to call something false teaching at times. I also question whether many self appointed human litmus tests of false teaching, are actually capable of identifying false teachers or whether they error because of lack of patience and a unwillingness to listen and understand what someone is trying to say. Sometimes these people sound more bossy than wise. So, there are two sides of the pendulum that make it difficult to do any kind of forward motion in our understanding of prophecy. Some people are speeding like drunk drivers, others are stuck pulling their emergency brake everytime someone opens their mouth, and the body of Christ is stuck never seeming to get where we need to go.

I was at church tonight and we did a cardboard testimony, which I participated in. I didn't want to so much. I was very nervous and didn't know whether I had put the right words down, but I was also nervous about sharing what I was saved from in front of all the people there when I am no longer that way, and it has been years since I was saved. I am a Christian now, whatever that means. But, I did it anyway because this is what I did at first. I reminded myself that I was nervous when I did the same thing at first and this is how Jesus has continued to show Himself to me and how I have continued to grow as a Christian-and I did it. My cardboard sign said on one side, "I felt dirty," and on the other side, "I feel clean." This represents my first love, sharing my testimony, because when I became a Christian, I didn't notice prophecy. I didn't understand anything about the genealogies or the history of Israel. I only knew that Paul could tell people that he was the least of all the Lord's people, and He was able to preach to the gentiles for Christ (Ephesians 3:8). Because I knew then that there was no way I was every going to be able to say anything better than this, and I wanted to do something for Him too. I like the way He talked to Pharisees. I could relate it to the many adults I felt behaved hypocritically, and I wanted to do something for Him-even if I knew I was unworthy to tie His shoes (John 1:27). "They triumphed over him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony; they did not love their lives so much as to shrink from death," (Revelation 12:11). I could go on and on for days on this subject, but I will stop here with a simple reminder for all of us that we never get too old to share where we were when we started walking with Christ. In fact, it is an essential to continuing to grow spiritually to keep doing the things we did at first. Peace.

In Ephesians 6:12 Paul teaches that believers in Christ that we do not fight against flesh and blood, but against principalities, which would seem like a contradiction because a ruler is flesh and blood. Therefore, what I think he is saying that we are really battling against is oppression and not each other. In James 2:6, James has rebuked the people for showing favoritism to the rich because, "Is it not the rich who are exploiting you? Are they not the ones who are dragging you into court?," and this is what Paul is saying that our struggle is against-the oppression of principalities. In 1 Samuel 8, we learn there is a significant difference between the authority of God and the authority of a king. The people are warned" "This is what the king who will reign over you will claim as his rights: He will take your sons and make them serve with his chariots and horses, and they will run in front of his chariots. 12 Some he will assign to be commanders of thousands and commanders of fifties, and others to plow his ground and reap his harvest, and still others to make weapons of war and equipment for his chariots. 13 He will take your daughters to be perfumers and cooks and bakers. 14 He will take the best of your fields and vineyards and olive groves and give them to his attendants. 15 He will take a tenth of your grain and of your vintage and give it to his officials and attendants. 16 Your male and female servants and the best of your cattle and donkeys he will take for his own use. 17 He will take a tenth of your flocks, and you yourselves will become his slaves. 18 When that day comes, you will cry out for relief from the king you have chosen, but the Lord will not answer you in that day.” But the people refused to listen to Samuel. “No!” they said. “We want a kingover us. 20 Then we will be like all the other nations, with a king to lead us and to go out before us and fight our battles.” (1 Samuel 8:11-20). This description represents the oppression of the principalities that we fight against, not each other. We do not want to choose a principality to be our king the way Israel did, and the way that many will when the beast requires a mark demonstrating allegiance to him. We want to fight against this coming oppression by putting on the full armor of God (Ephesians 6:13).

"Do not call anyone on earth your father; for One is your Father, He who is in heaven" (Matthew 23:9).

Well there's his meal ticket and protection from financial ruin.

Nobody "threw a stone" at you Esther4:14 I'm not going to be in collusion with that distortion. I was trying to reason with you concerning your response and you responded with over the top outrage and offence. I'm sorry you suffered abuse but you are not alone in that circumstance. I was referring to what persecuted Christians and other religious minorities have suffered and what they have faced hopelessly in lands where Islam and Sharia law have been enforced. I have heard first hand reports from them saying that they felt abandoned in their despair from the Christians in the West that have seemingly taken no notice of their torment , suffering and deaths. If you really knew what it was like to suffer in the way you described, you would never speak so callously to someone who is telling you I can understand from experience such suffering. And, it may come as a very big surprise to you, but a lot of the information about the nature and practice of Islam resembles a cult and there are tons of cults in the US. There might even be more people belonging to cults who have their own representation of what a Dhimma is, which would be anyone who is not initiated, and guess what. Many of these people will go to church on Sunday because they have the same secret plan to infiltrate and break down the communion of believers as proponents of Islam do as you have described. I know this because I knew many of them growing up and it is just funny that they don't cover that story in the news. Very strange. Because it is happening everyday.

Yes we can, and we all should get away from the personal attacks which are unprofitable. The issue facing Christians throughout the world today is how should they respond to the demonic attacks of radical Islamist Jihadis who are essentially devoid of all humanity and have a clear cut agenda of destroying America, the free world, Christians and Jews? Islamists believe they are serving Allah, but in fact they are serving Satan, and are controlled by demons (which most of us have not realized). But how else can we understand their brutal and unspeakable atrocities against children, women, and innocent civilian men, as well as everything that is civilized including ancient monuments and artifacts? The second prong of Jihad is to flood the West with Muslim migrants and destroyed western values and culture by bringing Sharia Law to non-Muslims. The best example of how Christ dealt with demons (from which we can learn a lesson and apply it here) is the incident with the Gadarene demoniac. There were a legion of demons with this demented soul, and the Lord purposed to cast them out (Mt 8:28-34; Mk 2:3-12; Lk5:18-26). The demons realized that they were to be cast out so they asked to be allowed into a herd of swine, and the swine and the demons ran down a steep place and "perished in the waters". Thus grace, mercy and peace came to the man who was possessed, but judgment on the demons themselves. How can this be applied today? 1. The nations of the world must destroy ISIS, Al-Qaeda, and all other Muslims terrorist groups (including Assad's terrorists). 2. Western countries must not allow Muslim migration to continue. 3. The USA must seal its border to all who seek to destroy it. 4. The general populations of western countries must to educated yo learn the dangers of Radical Islam. I agree with everything you say until you start trying to apply this principle to today. The demons were terrified of Jesus and did not want to be in His presence. The presence of Jesus is repellent to the presence of demons and when the disciples had difficulty doing this same thing, Jesus told them, "Because of the littleness of your faith; for truly I say to you, if you have faith the size of a mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move; and nothing will be impossible to you.…(Matthew 17:19). Therefore, we should work on the basic principles because simple things require more faith sometimes, and we would repel demons. I also will say again that I don't disagree with keeping Islam out of the US because it would be ideal to be under His authority alone and in His kingdom. But, the method that we approach this subject should start with principles of repentance and faith. Unfortunately, all the faith in the world will not inevitably protect us from the coming judgement. This judgement that is coming cannot be avoided. It is His will. Therefore, I would caution the assumption that we are capable of waging war to prevent the inevitable. There are other methods of fighting a spiritual battle that we have as believers in Christ than using what is available to us in the material world we are temporary residents of.

Thank you other one, I would imagine that your words are very sincere as our discussion did not reflect anything personal prior to the post that I was referring to in my response to Oakwood that was ignored. You did not say anything that suggested that I was deluded or at risk of having my head chopped off, or at risk of being kidnapped by ISIS. Therefore, you were not the reason that I felt that I was being stoned throughout the thread and decided to leave the discussion prior to someone not seeming to notice this or choosing to overlook it and continuing to bring it up. "He who conceals a transgression seeks love, But he who repeats a matter separates intimate friends." (Proverbs 17:9). With respect to your opinion that you have just shared with me, and recognizing again that you were not who offended me, I would like to share that the repeated responses towards me after sharing my personal experience further solidifies what I was trying to get across in my first post on repentance in the thread. It would seem that as Christians, whether you disagree with me or not. If you see someone who has said what you are in agreement with, and they have already said what you want to say to the person who is sharing a testimony of deliverance from violence, it would seem that someone with discernment to make crucial decisions about the direction the church should take in response to Islam, would know how to do the simple things like not continuing to wound the wounded. "The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he has anointed me to proclaim good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim liberty to the captives and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty those who are oppressed," (Luke 4:18). These are just basic things that people do not seem to know; yet, they want to lead us into supporting war with an idolatrous nation; and, I refuse to follow the opinion of people who demonstrate that they are incapable of passing such a simple test as a believer in Christ.

However, this seem to be exactly what I am saying whenever I emphasize discernment and repentance so that we will know His will... In particular, referencing my experience with violence. It disturbs me that no matter how I present this with numerous scripture, I still am made out to be a pacifist because I am not speaking on the subject in the same way that you are. I am not parroting the same gruel the media is dishing out that we are sopping up with bread. I am a Christian. I do not want to be predictable to some focus group. Therefore, I go back to basic principles of repentance and let the news people of Fox talk about terrorists the way some of the people here are talking about them. That is exactly what I said in the illustration of Jesus going to the cross. Jesus didn't jump up and down during the day saying "take me to the cross so I can save people. It is my destiny because I am awesome!" I means seriously. But, He also wasn't vulnerable until it was the will of God that He should go. It just feels like people keep putting words in my mouth saying that I am saying what I am not. I am not over here inviting my former abusers to lunch either, but I do not live in fear that they are a threat to me when I walk in obedience to Christ.

You probably mean well Esther but your opinion is naïve and so misguided I'm sure people having your attitude would be a great comfort to the captured, terrorized, tortured, raped, sexually enslaved, crucified, and persecuted Christians in Pakistan, Egypt, Iraq, Syria, Nigeria. Or going back to Germany would you have stood against Nazism when you saw it gathering power? would you have tried to warn others of the dangers of the Nazi Party? Would you have stood up for Jews, the homosexuals , the gypsies, anyone else that the Nazi Party hated and went after? would you have risked your life and your family to hide them, or used your money to help the underground? Or would you have waited silently for Jesus to deliver them? Are you kidding me? This has to be about the most insulting, degrading, and foul response that I have ever heard from another Christian in my entire life. Let me explain to you something. You do not know me. You do not know the battles that I have already overcome. I grew up around severe abuse already. I have been raped throughout my childhood you completely disrespectful person. Maybe you should slow your roll before you go about talking about things you don't know about because I already know from experience about many of the things you listed. You don't know about them, which is why you would speak carelessly about them and I would never that do that. It is a wonder people become Muslim when there are people like you in the church. I could be angry every day of my life, but I have learned that it takes more strength to have faith and show love towards others than you have in your pinky finger apparently. When did Jesus ever talk to someone this way. This is why I follow Him and not you. I do stand against something with faith. Therefore, comments comparing me to the apathy in Germany is ridiculous and insulting. They continued in their daily lives in arrogance. I specifically said effective faith required taking a personal inventory and confessing sin. This is the way He will deliver us; or He could if this apostate, militant Christianity weren't spreading like wildfire. Why don't we all go burn down a mosque and sing hymns. What a stand we would make for Jesus that way. He would be so proud! Jesus says to become as living sacrifices (Romans 12:1). That is what I am supposed to do. I can support what I said with scripture. You can't support anything that you just said to me in your self righteous rant. Understanding and applying scripture is not naivete. Waving your little militant Christian flag around as though He is proud of you is naive. "The naive inherit foolishness, But the sensible are crowned with knowledge." (Proverbs 14:18). Christians are meant to stand against evil. Your pacifist words are foolish. If all Christians were like you, Christianity would have gone extinct years ago and Christ would have died for nothing. Have you forgotten the Crusades? If we did not drive the Muslims out of Europe centuries ago we would all be reading the Q'uran by now. I don't know if you have noticed, but I have ignored 5 responses in this thread directed at me with similar comments to what you are saying. So, let me ask you something. What is your real motivation for throwing yet another stone at me? Do you not think that the 5 that have been thrown were enough? I stopped sharing and responding in this thread because a while back, I responded to Davida about my personal experience with violence and the way that this influences my opinion towards the subject. I was a victim of severe violence like the violence discussed as the basis for the approach and opinion towards islamization. However, instead of finding repentance to be a foundation that we could all agree upon and spread our wings towards finding solutions that did not reflect the opinion that it is okay to act in violence if violence is being used against you, my testimony was buried under criticism and I was told how naive I was and this and that. Repentance is a basic precept that is the foundation of everything we do as Christians. It would be very easy to build upon by suggesting that: through repentance, we make ourselves living offerings capable of knowing His will (Romans 12:1). In my experience of repentance, the Lord has shown me that it is His will through scripture... There are just so many better ways to respond to the subject of repentance in response to threat of danger that doesn't jump to the assumption that I am deluded and don't know what I am talking about and I better rebuke her quickly to protect someone from hearing what she has said even if she is a victim of severe violence or not. And, in response to your attack on my call to repentance, which is what I believe every prophet did before the people were taken into captivity. Every single one said that we should return to the Lord in repentance who can help us and prevent the calamity that will come upon us if we continue down the road we are going. Citing the crusades as the key to your argument countering mine is an odd choice considering how contrary their approach was to the apostles who built the church with no army... In fact, Paul was writing letters to the churches when he was in prison, not trying to find a way to escape and form a army against the Romans for their rejection of Christ. One of my favorite verses of all time is from Matthew 26:55. Jesus says, "Am I leading a rebellion, that you have come out with swords and clubs to capture me? Every day I sat in the temple courts teaching, and you did not arrest me." I have known since the first day I read this verse that there is nothing that can happen to my life before it's time. I do not need to fear being taken by ISIS if that is not what the Lord has established will happen to me. For the young girl that I was coming out of a dangerous environment, these words were very comforting. Beyond this, the argument for how we should respond to Islam seems to contradict the lessons that we learn from our Savior on the day that He was taken from the cross. Peter took out his sword and was ready to defend Jesus from being taken and Jesus told him not to this. So, how do we apply this lesson to our discussion on this subject. Additionally, Islam is a idolatrous religion. Very clear. I knew this when I was a baby Christian. They are like Philistines. David said in response to Goliath, "For who is this uncircumcised Philistine, that he should defy the armies of the living God?” (1 Samuel 17:26); and, he successfully defeated the giant with a sling shot (1 Samuel 17:39-51). The prayer of the righteous man avails much (James 5:16). Therefore, we should be looking at ways that we are being deceived rather than distracted by uncircumcised Philistines, so to speak. For instance, the name ISIS implies to me that they are in alliance with someone that is not from Islam. What does the name of the Egyptian god Isis have to do with Islam, especially when they are so adamant about there only being one god and his name being Allah. Therefore, ISIS seems to be like the street dealers that get arrested rather than the main dealer. They are like someone's middle men or scapegoat so that they will continue to appear clean. ISIS is like someone's whitewash (Matthew 23:25). My guess is that they are in alliance with someone who is promoting that the story of the virgin birth is plagiarized from the Egyptian myth of Isis. So, there are different ways that this is a strategy to recruit people to think a certain way that would take too long to fully develop here. There is the group of Zeitgeist fans for example, who do not follow mainstream media. Therefore, they integrate this message of Isis in a presentation that tickles the ears of the ones who suspect that 9/11 was an inside job. They are going to see the threat of ISIS differently than Christians who think that things like Zeitgeist are conspiracy theories. But, through it all, there will be able to be a way to control the opinion of everyone in order to achieve a certain goal. They are also able to control and develop a profile of what a person who professes to be Christian believes to a certain extent. Like a international dating service. They can populate a few interests and predict how you will behave if you are given certain information. Therefore, rather than confirming their opinion of you as militant Christians who see idolatrous groups as a threat to their freedom, maybe it is time to start considering how we walk away from all of this and "come out her my people" (Revelation 18:4) because we are starting to sound like a nation of drunkards (Revelation 18:3). We also seem to forget that the Spanish-American war was incited by the media. In other words, we went to war because of what the media was teaching us about the enemy. But, that doesn't happen anymore in a world that is even much more secular than it was before? I also believe that Hitler's propaganda film "Triumph of the Will" is a very sobering reminder of how nationalism can garner support for praising wickedness. Who is the real enemy? ISIS or the leader telling us when we need to go to war with the threat that the media has created. Finally, there is a very big difference between being a pacifist who is not aware of a wolf, and someone who wants to seek the Lord's guidance in a deeper way through repentance because of what the prophecy has to teach about the deception that will increase in the last days (Matthew 24:24). What does the name of the Egyptian god have to do with Islam? Well, Isis is an acronym. It was not meant to be called Isis.... that's just a coincidence. Or is it? Even if it is deliberate. Let's ask the question again. What does the name of the Egyptian god have to do with Islam? Answer: It's the same god. Allah, the god of Islam is none other than Baal. It is the same crescent moon that is used as a symbol. All false gods come from Satan. Whether it be Quetzalcoatl, Isis, Set, Shiva, Baal, Zeus or Allah. Allah was a Pagan Moon god long before Mohammed was born. The Black stone of Allah (which is housed in the Kaaba in Mecca is a meteorite. We know that much. It fell from the sky which is probably why people started worshipping it in the first place. Although Western forensic experts have been forbidden from analysing it by the Saudi government, we know that it is a meteorite. Muslim documents tell us this. It dates back centuries - possibly Millennia. Allah was the god of the Q'araysh tribe which was Mohammed's own tribe. Mohammed usurped the god and made it his own, declaring it to be the god of Islam and with great blasphemy he declared it to be the god of Abraham too. He declared that Jesus was just a prophet of Islam, did not die on the cross and was not the son of God. He denied that Jesus was the Messiah. Considering that the death and resurrection is ESSENTIAL to salvation, to deny the deity of Jesus Christ is the work of Satan. Islam is Satanism under another name. It is religion of deception. It is Satan's most powerful religion on Earth, more powerful than any of his other religions. We are warned by the Bible to beware of false prophets and that we shall know them by their fruit. Despite the Muslim claim that Islam is a religion of peace, reality tells us otherwise. The fruits of Mohammed's teachings are terrorism, murder, rape, enslavement, theft and lies. We do not need to find a connection between Isis and the Egyptian god. ISIS, the terrorist organisation are practising true Islam.. They are the 'real' Muslims. They follow the teachings of the Q'uran as it should be followed. The Q'uran teaches war, conquest and subjugation. As for Hitler, well he was a great admirer of the religion of Islam. He even had a Muslim Arab leader named Amin al-Husseini to help him plot the Holocaust! Where is scripture to support your views. I have seen many people talking about this subject, but they never use scripture. Maybe it is because scripture does not support this militant view that people have towards Islam. It might be more effective if we had more consideration for the oppressed and the broken hearted, which I am, which you do not seem to be concerned with at all because you completely ignored the acknowledgment I gave to being the sixth person to throw a stone at me post contributing my own experience with violence. I am thinking that this is a giant red flag. It is really a sad show of Christianity throughout this thread.

You probably mean well Esther but your opinion is naïve and so misguided I'm sure people having your attitude would be a great comfort to the captured, terrorized, tortured, raped, sexually enslaved, crucified, and persecuted Christians in Pakistan, Egypt, Iraq, Syria, Nigeria. Or going back to Germany would you have stood against Nazism when you saw it gathering power? would you have tried to warn others of the dangers of the Nazi Party? Would you have stood up for Jews, the homosexuals , the gypsies, anyone else that the Nazi Party hated and went after? would you have risked your life and your family to hide them, or used your money to help the underground? Or would you have waited silently for Jesus to deliver them? Are you kidding me? This has to be about the most insulting, degrading, and foul response that I have ever heard from another Christian in my entire life. Let me explain to you something. You do not know me. You do not know the battles that I have already overcome. I grew up around severe abuse already. I have been raped throughout my childhood you completely disrespectful person. Maybe you should slow your roll before you go about talking about things you don't know about because I already know from experience about many of the things you listed. You don't know about them, which is why you would speak carelessly about them and I would never that do that. It is a wonder people become Muslim when there are people like you in the church. I could be angry every day of my life, but I have learned that it takes more strength to have faith and show love towards others than you have in your pinky finger apparently. When did Jesus ever talk to someone this way. This is why I follow Him and not you. I do stand against something with faith. Therefore, comments comparing me to the apathy in Germany is ridiculous and insulting. They continued in their daily lives in arrogance. I specifically said effective faith required taking a personal inventory and confessing sin. This is the way He will deliver us; or He could if this apostate, militant Christianity weren't spreading like wildfire. Why don't we all go burn down a mosque and sing hymns. What a stand we would make for Jesus that way. He would be so proud! Jesus says to become as living sacrifices (Romans 12:1). That is what I am supposed to do. I can support what I said with scripture. You can't support anything that you just said to me in your self righteous rant. Understanding and applying scripture is not naivete. Waving your little militant Christian flag around as though He is proud of you is naive. "The naive inherit foolishness, But the sensible are crowned with knowledge." (Proverbs 14:18). Christians are meant to stand against evil. Your pacifist words are foolish. If all Christians were like you, Christianity would have gone extinct years ago and Christ would have died for nothing. Have you forgotten the Crusades? If we did not drive the Muslims out of Europe centuries ago we would all be reading the Q'uran by now. I don't know if you have noticed, but I have ignored 5 responses in this thread directed at me with similar comments to what you are saying. So, let me ask you something. What is your real motivation for throwing yet another stone at me? Do you not think that the 5 that have been thrown were enough? I stopped sharing and responding in this thread because a while back, I responded to Davida about my personal experience with violence and the way that this influences my opinion towards the subject. I was a victim of severe violence like the violence discussed as the basis for the approach and opinion towards islamization. However, instead of finding repentance to be a foundation that we could all agree upon and spread our wings towards finding solutions that did not reflect the opinion that it is okay to act in violence if violence is being used against you, my testimony was buried under criticism and I was told how naive I was and this and that. Repentance is a basic precept that is the foundation of everything we do as Christians. It would be very easy to build upon by suggesting that: through repentance, we make ourselves living offerings capable of knowing His will (Romans 12:1). In my experience of repentance, the Lord has shown me that it is His will through scripture... There are just so many better ways to respond to the subject of repentance in response to threat of danger that doesn't jump to the assumption that I am deluded and don't know what I am talking about and I better rebuke her quickly to protect someone from hearing what she has said even if she is a victim of severe violence or not. And, in response to your attack on my call to repentance, which is what I believe every prophet did before the people were taken into captivity. Every single one said that we should return to the Lord in repentance who can help us and prevent the calamity that will come upon us if we continue down the road we are going. Citing the crusades as the key to your argument countering mine is an odd choice considering how contrary their approach was to the apostles who built the church with no army... In fact, Paul was writing letters to the churches when he was in prison, not trying to find a way to escape and form a army against the Romans for their rejection of Christ. One of my favorite verses of all time is from Matthew 26:55. Jesus says, "Am I leading a rebellion, that you have come out with swords and clubs to capture me? Every day I sat in the temple courts teaching, and you did not arrest me." I have known since the first day I read this verse that there is nothing that can happen to my life before it's time. I do not need to fear being taken by ISIS if that is not what the Lord has established will happen to me. For the young girl that I was coming out of a dangerous environment, these words were very comforting. Beyond this, the argument for how we should respond to Islam seems to contradict the lessons that we learn from our Savior on the day that He was taken from the cross. Peter took out his sword and was ready to defend Jesus from being taken and Jesus told him not to this. So, how do we apply this lesson to our discussion on this subject. Additionally, Islam is a idolatrous religion. Very clear. I knew this when I was a baby Christian. They are like Philistines. David said in response to Goliath, "For who is this uncircumcised Philistine, that he should defy the armies of the living God?” (1 Samuel 17:26); and, he successfully defeated the giant with a sling shot (1 Samuel 17:39-51). The prayer of the righteous man avails much (James 5:16). Therefore, we should be looking at ways that we are being deceived rather than distracted by uncircumcised Philistines, so to speak. For instance, the name ISIS implies to me that they are in alliance with someone that is not from Islam. What does the name of the Egyptian god Isis have to do with Islam, especially when they are so adamant about there only being one god and his name being Allah. Therefore, ISIS seems to be like the street dealers that get arrested rather than the main dealer. They are like someone's middle men or scapegoat so that they will continue to appear clean. ISIS is like someone's whitewash (Matthew 23:25). My guess is that they are in alliance with someone who is promoting that the story of the virgin birth is plagiarized from the Egyptian myth of Isis. So, there are different ways that this is a strategy to recruit people to think a certain way that would take too long to fully develop here. There is the group of Zeitgeist fans for example, who do not follow mainstream media. Therefore, they integrate this message of Isis in a presentation that tickles the ears of the ones who suspect that 9/11 was an inside job. They are going to see the threat of ISIS differently than Christians who think that things like Zeitgeist are conspiracy theories. But, through it all, there will be able to be a way to control the opinion of everyone in order to achieve a certain goal. They are also able to control and develop a profile of what a person who professes to be Christian believes to a certain extent. Like a international dating service. They can populate a few interests and predict how you will behave if you are given certain information. Therefore, rather than confirming their opinion of you as militant Christians who see idolatrous groups as a threat to their freedom, maybe it is time to start considering how we walk away from all of this and "come out her my people" (Revelation 18:4) because we are starting to sound like a nation of drunkards (Revelation 18:3). We also seem to forget that the Spanish-American war was incited by the media. In other words, we went to war because of what the media was teaching us about the enemy. But, that doesn't happen anymore in a world that is even much more secular than it was before? I also believe that Hitler's propaganda film "Triumph of the Will" is a very sobering reminder of how nationalism can garner support for praising wickedness. Who is the real enemy? ISIS or the leader telling us when we need to go to war with the threat that the media has created. Finally, there is a very big difference between being a pacifist who is not aware of a wolf, and someone who wants to seek the Lord's guidance in a deeper way through repentance because of what the prophecy has to teach about the deception that will increase in the last days (Matthew 24:24).

It is entirely possible that there is little or no systematic and in-depth teaching in the churches on God the Holy Spirit. But the Holy Spirit has everything to do with the Christian's life from regeneration to ultimate perfection. Obedience to the Holy Spirit is sanctification (walking in the Spirit), and cannot be separated from obedience to the Word of God (Heb 4:12,13). Obedience to the Holy Spirit is also the willingness to repent when we are shown the errors of our beliefs and our actions. Unfortunately, when Christians show other Christians their sins and errors (as is required), many of those who should repent fail to do so, and instead resist the Holy Spirit, simply because He is invisible and a mere brother or sister is speaking. You will note this from time to time on Christian forums (including this one). Stephen was a man full of faith and full of the Holy Ghost, but when he spoke out the sins of his people, they not only resented his speech, but they killed him for speaking the truth (Acts 6:1-8:3). So it is today in Christendom. More often than not, you will find Christians arguing to defend themselves, rather than submitting to the judgment of the Holy Spirit. But God does not generally render summary execution today (as in the case of Ananias and Sapphira). On the other hand, he warns every Christian thus "TODAY, IF YE WILL HEAR HIS VOICE, HARDEN NOT YOUR HEARTS" (Heb 3:7-4:8). I find it interesting that this is your take on the discussion topic. I don't suppose you think that your words apply to you though, but are simply a rant about the frustration that no one is listening to your criticisms which would so vastly improve their lives. Maybe, what people need more on a board like this is love and not the self righteous legalism from a batch of people who feel they have graduated from basic principles of repentance and are called to serve as crossing guards on a online forum bearing daily frustrations that no one is listening to them. Oh my! What has the church become? "Above all, keep loving one another earnestly, since love covers a multitude of sins" (1 Peter 4:8). Esther , I found no Judgement in the post you cited none. Maybe you are not familiar with the concept of spiritual abuse. Most of what Ezra refers to as some sort of command he and some others have been given to show people their errors, I would call spiritual abuse-not loving rebuke. His post is just a means of justifying and somewhat reminding the populace here that some consider themselves capable of teaching others here about their errors, and whether they find this offensive or not reflects their own hardness of heart-not the error of the one delivering the message. In reality, most of what people seem to feel that they are designated to correct, are things that don't really matter, and things that I have found people are capable of correcting on their own if they are allowed to grow in the Lord. I have corrected many errors without someone's rebuke because someone welcomed me into fellowship with them and encouraged me to seek the Lord. When the apostles rebuked some who were performing miracles in His name, He responded to them by telling them there was no need to do this just because they weren't traveling with them. He said that no one doing something in His name will be able to speak badly of Him for long (Mark 9:38-39). In other words, someone who is still learning things does not need to be rebuked because they will grow in Him as they seek to share the message of the Gospel. Paul teaches in Romans 14:1 "Now accept the one who is weak in the faith, but not for the purpose of passing judgment on opinions." Again, it would appear that it is the simple things that take the most faith. I trust Him to teach others what they need to repent of; therefore, I don't need to rebuke them for not listening to me the way Ezra used the post to promote his own agenda and permission to behave the way he does. That is why we have the Holy Spirit to begin with-to teach and correct. Again, most of what appears to be the rebuke of those who are approved by some divine command on the board, appears to be spiritual abuse. Since using this board, I have been called deluded, foolish, beyond help, and told that I was at risk of having my head chopped off. Somehow or the other I don't call this loving rebuke or consider that this bears any resemblance of someones concern for the eternal destiny of my soul. In the secular world, there is a concept called online etiquette. Online etiquette is a new concept that conveys ways to improve communication between people who are not able to see the expression of the person talking because in real life, we communicate with body language as much as words. So, there are things like not using all caps because it conveys the impression that you are yelling; or, not bolding comments like "obedience to the Holy Spirit is also willingness to repent when we are shown the errors of our beliefs or actions," as though this was the most important part of what someone has to say because of a personal resentment they are holding. Like they are venting their own frustration for this sentence in particular rather than teaching something that is simply their reflections on the opening post. Fortunately, on the board here at worthy there is something called the 10 commandments of online witnessing, which is one of the best guidelines for online etiquette for a Christian forum that I have ever seen. So, I know that most of what I have seen that doesn't reflect this, does not always reflect the opinion of the ones who are managing the board in their manner of speaking to other brothers and sisters in Christ.

It is entirely possible that there is little or no systematic and in-depth teaching in the churches on God the Holy Spirit. But the Holy Spirit has everything to do with the Christian's life from regeneration to ultimate perfection. Obedience to the Holy Spirit is sanctification (walking in the Spirit), and cannot be separated from obedience to the Word of God (Heb 4:12,13). Obedience to the Holy Spirit is also the willingness to repent when we are shown the errors of our beliefs and our actions. Unfortunately, when Christians show other Christians their sins and errors (as is required), many of those who should repent fail to do so, and instead resist the Holy Spirit, simply because He is invisible and a mere brother or sister is speaking. You will note this from time to time on Christian forums (including this one). Stephen was a man full of faith and full of the Holy Ghost, but when he spoke out the sins of his people, they not only resented his speech, but they killed him for speaking the truth (Acts 6:1-8:3). So it is today in Christendom. More often than not, you will find Christians arguing to defend themselves, rather than submitting to the judgment of the Holy Spirit. But God does not generally render summary execution today (as in the case of Ananias and Sapphira). On the other hand, he warns every Christian thus "TODAY, IF YE WILL HEAR HIS VOICE, HARDEN NOT YOUR HEARTS" (Heb 3:7-4:8). I find it interesting that this is your take on the discussion topic. I don't suppose you think that your words apply to you though, but are simply a rant about the frustration that no one is listening to your criticisms which would so vastly improve their lives. Maybe, what people need more on a board like this is love and not the self righteous legalism from a batch of people who feel they have graduated from basic principles of repentance and are called to serve as crossing guards on a online forum bearing daily frustrations that no one is listening to them. Oh my! What has the church become? "Above all, keep loving one another earnestly, since love covers a multitude of sins" (1 Peter 4:8).

The Holy Spirit is synonymous with wisdom. In Luke 11:13 He says, "if you who are evil know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your father in Heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him." James teaches us, "if any of you lacks wisdom, you should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to you." Therefore, when we ask for wisdom, we are asking for the Spirit. When we ask for the Spirit, we are asking for wisdom, and He wants to give this to us generously if we ask Him. Therefore, we can learn more about the Spirit from the description of wisdom given in Proverbs. In Proverbs 8:22-23 we learn: "The Lord possesed me at the beginning of His way, before His works of old. From everlasting I was established, From the beginning, from the earliest times of the earth. We also know that the Spirit is the water He will give so we will never thirst again (John 4:14). Therefore, if the Holy Spirit is synonymous with wisdom, than it is when we receive wisdom and understanding that we are satisfied. Therefore, we were blessed when He sent us His wisdom to help all who believe until He returns (John14:26).

Well then let me be very clear. From experience, I am very concerned with not being put in situations like that again. From experience, what I posted works to prevent this! I live in the evidence of the effectiveness of it every day. What I shared has been thoroughly tested and where is scripture to support anything that you claim because what I claim was a plan of escape I found from starting in a place of bondage that you have probably never experienced in your entire life.

Islam is ANTI-CHRISTIAN and anti-everything in your world. Wake up, Esther. Watch your mouth. You are nothing but a bully. I went out of my way to post something kind and edifying and this is what you post. I wont watch anything on your say so, Esther, you aren't running this forum. I'm telling you the truth; if it tastes bitter that's on you. Your post was actually anti-Christian. Calling me a bully is tenyearoldish. Look at that she just keeps going. You just have to have the last word every time don't you. I wonder what that means? What do they say about people who have to have the last word? Just keep spewing your hate like you are doing Him a favor.

Islam is ANTI-CHRISTIAN and anti-everything in your world. Wake up, Esther. Watch your mouth. You are nothing but a bully. I went out of my way to post something kind and edifying and this is what you post.

You probably mean well Esther but your opinion is naïve and so misguided I'm sure people having your attitude would be a great comfort to the captured, terrorized, tortured, raped, sexually enslaved, crucified, and persecuted Christians in Pakistan, Egypt, Iraq, Syria, Nigeria. Or going back to Germany would you have stood against Nazism when you saw it gathering power? would you have tried to warn others of the dangers of the Nazi Party? Would you have stood up for Jews, the homosexuals , the gypsies, anyone else that the Nazi Party hated and went after? would you have risked your life and your family to hide them, or used your money to help the underground? Or would you have waited silently for Jesus to deliver them? Are you kidding me? This has to be about the most insulting, degrading, and foul response that I have ever heard from another Christian in my entire life. Let me explain to you something. You do not know me. You do not know the battles that I have already overcome. I grew up around severe abuse already. I have been raped throughout my childhood you completely disrespectful person. Maybe you should slow your roll before you go about talking about things you don't know about because I already know from experience about many of the things you listed. You don't know about them, which is why you would speak carelessly about them and I would never that do that. It is a wonder people become Muslim when there are people like you in the church. I could be angry every day of my life, but I have learned that it takes more strength to have faith and show love towards others than you have in your pinky finger apparently. When did Jesus ever talk to someone this way. This is why I follow Him and not you. I do stand against something with faith. Therefore, comments comparing me to the apathy in Germany is ridiculous and insulting. They continued in their daily lives in arrogance. I specifically said effective faith required taking a personal inventory and confessing sin. This is the way He will deliver us; or He could if this apostate, militant Christianity weren't spreading like wildfire. Why don't we all go burn down a mosque and sing hymns. What a stand we would make for Jesus that way. He would be so proud! Jesus says to become as living sacrifices (Romans 12:1). That is what I am supposed to do. I can support what I said with scripture. You can't support anything that you just said to me in your self righteous rant. Understanding and applying scripture is not naivete. Waving your little militant Christian flag around as though He is proud of you is naive. "The naive inherit foolishness, But the sensible are crowned with knowledge." (Proverbs 14:18).

Yes, I do and I don't really see that what you all are doing is much more effective... How is it that in all that I said about love and confession as Christians, you only respond with the same militant attitude that is being displayed here towards Islam. It only solidifies my opinion that the church has lost its first love and that is what I am more worried about than Islam.

As believers in Jesus, of course no one wants to see this happen. I am a believer because I love the way that the Bible teaches us that He leads people. There is no one else like Him. I would never want to follow anyone else for anything in the world. There is no one else like Him. It deserves to be said twice. However, as a result of my high opinion for His leadership, I believe that this article only displays more reason to love others more and to make sure that our hearts are right with Him because things like this are happening around us. Sometimes it is the simple things that require the most faith. I like to take personal inventory by journaling about my struggles with pride, and being frustrated with others, and things people have done that hurt me. I am continually amazed how He shows His love for me when I do these simple things that mean nothing to anyone else. It is foolishness to a person without the Spirit (1 Corinthians 2:14). But, it has been the most effective approach I have found to finding life and having it more abundantly (John 10:10). Scripture says the "blessed are the pure in heart for they shall see God" (Matthew 5:8). "He who loves purity of heart, and whose speech is gracious, will have the king as his friend," (Proverbs 22:11). "Therefore let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need" (Hebrews 4:16). From my experience, it takes more faith to depend on His protection resulting from a pure heart than it does to try and gather votes from a soap box. I am willing to bet that the method that requires more faith will lead to greater rewards. However, from the looks of it, many appear to have lost their first love. "Yet I hold this against you: You have forsaken the love you had at first. Consider how far you have fallen! Repent and do the things you did at first. If you do not repent, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place." (Revelation 2:4-5). In conclusion, when fighting a spiritual battle such as this; as Christians, we do three simple things. We love more, we confess our sins, and we wait in confidence that He is faithful and just to deliver us (1 John 1:9). It is very, very simple. Anyone, making it more complicated than this, is not teaching from the Gospel.