Jostler

ok, I understand what you're trying to say, but I'll have to respectfully agree to disagree. The unholy union between divine beings who came down on Mt. Hermon and had relations with human women were in rebellion and wouldn't care one whit if their actions were covered by the sanctification of marriage or not. And those unions resulted in giant offspring.

That's a tremendously important study and I only recently (last couple of years) found out about it. I *think* i got introduced to it by one of Michael Heiser's videos but I can't recall for sure. But realizing that passage is something more like "men began to use the Lord's name in vain" certainly changes understanding of it. That may have been the very reason God made that prohibition part of the ten commandments. Speculation of course....but however it was manifesting it was offensive to God, not an expression of submission and devotion to Him.

I have no clue now I'm thoroughly confused as to exactly what point you're trying to make. How did marriage get into the conversation?

And thank God for that But it only applies to those who have received His gift of life and been transformed by the new birth And that includes male and female...children of God

I don't think the Scripture supports that interpretation at all friend. The Hebrew term translated as "sons of God" is "elohim" and it is never applied to men anywhere in the Old Testament. It describes the heavenly beings who present themselves at the divine court in Job and refers to angels elsewhere. Even in the New Testament where we see "sons of God" applied to men (of course its in Greek there..."sons of theos" it refers to something we BECOME after the new birth, and you can't "become" a son of God if you already were one. In our fallen state we are "sons of satan" and subjects in his kingdom just as Jesus said of the Scribes and Pharisees. It is not until the new birth that we are translated out of the kingdom of darkness and into the kingdom of the Son. Having died in Him and being resurrected to new life in Him (all the symbolism of water baptism) we are now completely removed from one family and placed in another. God's. As sons AND daughters. NOW we are something that we were not before. There was a change....a new birth

*BIG HUGS*

I agree. The implications of this kind of corruption are serious and (I believe) the consequences for it are imminent. Sobering stuff if you have any background in God's hatred for injustice. I wish I could recall the book and author, but years ago I read a study on just when God's judgement has historically fallen on rebellious nations. He outlined a progression of things in sequence that preceded judgement (and though I can't repeat the arguments and scriptural support any longer ) and if I recall the second to the last offense was when the courts cease to dispense justice and become tools of oppression. The final offense was when nations begin to legislate immorality. Our corrupted court system has been "legislating from the bench" for decades in grievous violation of our Constitution which assigns sole power to legislate to the Congress. The recent abominable legislation to allow abortion of babies at full term is an unequivocal "legislative" act by a legislature with the authority to pass laws. I suspect we're very close to the day the Lord will say "enough" and begin to judge. Sobering stuff. IMO every day that passes now that we don't see the overt hand of the Judge is a day of grace.

I'd think maybe you're more "on track" than it feels like to you right now When I read your post I was so struck by remembering a time when I was exactly where you are right now. I'd given myself to sinning for so long I too had some very persistent sins I just couldn't seem to get free from no matter how badly I wanted to. First let me show you something I hope you'll find encouraging. You have boldly done something you may not even fully understand. Your courage and vulnerability in being so open with things that you are struggling with is a kind of risk taking and transparency ...HONESTY... that He can work with. He loves us TOO much to leave us the way we are But what you've done is, at risk of being judged, is open up and ask brothers and sisters in the Lord for help. And He made provision for those willing to do that in His Word. If you'll notice, it is the one struggling who must initiate this encounter, and whether you consciously understood what you were doing or not, by confessing your struggles you set this in motion. Whether you knew or not the Spirit did :). Do you think it's possible He's already leading you into doing the things that will bring change and you're just not quite aware of it yet? I certainly do :). Dear Friend I promise you He has captivated me, drawn me to your situation and I WILL pray for you. I perceive it as a commission from Him. Maybe that's because I can so closely identify with your situation. I REMEMBER how horrible it felt and I now know we don't have to feel that way in Him. I can pray fervently because I'm praying from both an experiential connection to what you're feeling and it inspires a compassion accompanied by a sure knowledge He'll move you beyond this Bet me I want to share two things to open our conversation. One is a part of my story of how He delivered me out of that place you're now standing in. The second is a basic, simple bit of the Word that He might use to help you get your feelings (they're lying to you right now....real enough....tough to deal with....but lying) more in line with His truth...reality. First, my testimony. Pull up a chair this will take a minute I was fortunate enough to be raised in a family that introduced me to the things of God early. My mother and father were born again and placed importance on raising their kids with knowledge of Him. My dad made the effort to get me to memorize two passages of Scripture at two years of age. They were Psalm 37:4 and Proverbs 3:5-6. They've stuck with me all my life and it was during this massive and frustrating struggle against sin I experienced He trotted one of those passages out and changed my whole perspective on the fight. During this season I was truly grieved over my continual return to the sin I hated and ashamed to even try to pray. Somehow He gave me the strength to approach Him in prayer one more time and this time something happened. He brought this passage my father had made me memorize at the age of two to mind. I promise you that if you will simply not quit, He is just as eager and willing to manifest Himself in you just as powerfully as He did for my sake, as I am about to describe. I responded to His prompting by opening my Bible to Psalm 37:4 to read it again. I read it very slowly and when I hit the word "also" He ARRESTED me on that word. By now He had made His presence with me felt. I could literally feel the atmosphere had changed and He was there WITH me. And it was comforting and relaxing, in no way condemning. I have experienced Him this way several times in my life now and I honestly believe you can expect Him to do the same for you. Moving on, without words I knew He was asking me to really stop and think about what I was reading when He pulled me to an abrupt stop on the word "also". So I did. Delight yourself ALSO...."What is significant about that word?" I thought. Delight yourself ALSO, in the Lord.....ALSO. That means "in addition to". As soon as I thought "in addition to" for the second time in my life He spoke to my mind in words. It was not literal sound but words formed in my head that were just as real as if He was sitting across the table from me. I thought "In addition to what, Lord?" and He said "In addition to that sin you're delighting in." ??!! What??! As He continued to explain, number one He was NOT excusing the sin. He will never do that. But His meaning was pointing to the fact that my focus on that sin, had brought me to a place of feeling such shame that I couldn't read my Bible, couldn't pray and couldn't face Him. He made it clear that I needed to focus on and delight in Him in SPITE of those feelings. The feelings were lying. Now, He also opened up a "layer" of meaning from that verse I had never seen before. As a child and up to this point I had understood that passage: ...to mean that if I would delight myself in Him, He would fulfill my heart's desires. And it's true! He DELIGHTS in fulfilling every holy heart's desire any of His kids can come up with But there is a deeper layer of meaning contained there and it was this one He now opened for me for the first time. I was given to understand that if I would FOCUS on delighting in Him to the fullest extent I was able, He promised me He would work in that to GIVE ME the desires of the heart that were pleasing to Him. In other words, He wasn't ignoring the sin, He was saying that my focusing ON the sin more than on Him was actually empowering its hold on me and if I would focus on Him more instead He would take away the unholy DESIRE to sin and replace it with His desires for me so that I'd WANT the same things He wanted for me. He promised to transform my heart and not just fulfill the desires of my own but actually begin taking away the unholy desires that were plaguing me and replace them with desires He longed to fulfill for my sake He's no respecter of persons. There is not one single thing He'll do for me that He won't do for any one of His other children. This encounter with Him has been applied by me over and over when I'm confronted with unholy desires and He has been faithful to His promise. That's my testimony on that part....I hope He speaks to you through it. He is faithful. This dynamic is powerful and I came to understand this is why satan will inspire feelings of deep shame and desire to hide when he's managed to get us to give ourselves to sinning. If he can keep us from delighting in Him because of the shame and deep desire to "hide" from Him then we'll keep ourselves locked up in a prison of our own making. Notice that's one of the first things that hit Adam after he fell. He hid. Satan got him to hide from the ANSWER to his problem. The other thing I wanted to bring to bear is really simple, but difficult to apply. It takes some work, and in fact it is the ONLY work He assigned to US. EVERYTHING else is HIS work which we are to engage with, and when He says to, to such a degree that it's not us "working" at all but Him working through us. And the "work" He assigned us isn't even a physical act We are to enter into REST....ceasing from physical "doing" of ANYTHING that comes from our own inspiration. Another topic Maybe we can get into that later ....dunno...we'll see where He goes with this. But this is the "work" He assigned to us: The 'work' He assigned us is simply believing. Lets back up a verse and get the context for proof. Someone in the crowd had asked a genuine question and I believe Jesus genuinely answered with exactly the right answer. I'm assuming the question came from a real desire to serve and please God and Jesus genuinely responded. It's your BELIEF that your current emotions of guilt and shame are designed to attack. And there lies your "work". 1. It is HIS grace, which HE extended, apart from any "works" we can do 2. That has MADE us (past tense!....done deal!) 3. ACCEPTED. PERIOD. As we are, RIGHT NOW.....in all our faults and remaining sins. Any feeling that says otherwise is lying and deserves resistance I'll stop here. I love you and I am praying for you And I KNOW He'll hear me not because of who I am but because He SAID He would and He is faithful. Hang on soldier the ride gets wild and a lot more enjoyable from here

I'm not clear what your question is? I meant I intend to run "to" and engage (in HIM!) the forces arraying themselves against Him and His Word. As far as 1st Thessalonians 2:1-12 goes, here's my best understanding: Actually, I have to back up to 1 Thessalonians one because in this case the context is too important to overlook. Chapter one sheds a lot of light on exactly what Paul is talking about in Chapter 2 and he's still writing on the same topic in Chapter 2. Evidently, the Thessalonians were enduring some trials and hardships and Paul uses the first few verses to sow some perspective and encouragement into them in their suffering. In the seventh verse he points out that there will be "rest" from these trials when: So now he's identified a specific event and opened a specific topic which will remain his central theme through Chapter 2. And he begins to give specific characteristics of the event showing so far that this event willl 1.) reveal the Lord Jesus, and 2.) that His mighty angels will be accompanying Him when He is revealed. The purpose of His revealing is to execute vengeance.... by the way the Greek word for "mighty" angels in verse 7 does not demand but does strongly imply "warring" angles. This is not warm cuddly assembly in any case. It's manifesting in power to execute vengeance. We're beginning to get a picture of the Mighty Lion-King of Judah, not the Lamb. The end result of this vengeance is that His enemies are banished from His presence, glory and power forever. And it will result in Him being glorified IN His saints to a degree that we're going to marvel and admire Him in each other Man there's some revelation to unpack in THAT phrase too but if I head down that trail we'll be here for days But, again Paul identifies the central theme which will carry over to Chapter 2. THAT DAY. Our translators capitalized that because this term is elsewhere associated with "the Day of the Lord". On to Chapter 2... Same "day", same topic, a day of revealing Him, glorification in His saints, and GATHERING of the saints is now an added detail. Reading between the lines it seems likely someone was trying to shake the Thessalonian's faith by proclaiming He'd already come and they missed it. And here Paul calls the "Day" the Day of Christ (some translations use "Day of the Lord" here). I find it interesting that Paul finds it necessary to give a strong warning against being deceived in this next verse, just like Jesus did in Matt 24:23-28. I think they both knew by the Spirit satan was going to do all he could to confuse understanding of this topic. We certainly see a lot of confusion in the Body concerning it with all the different interpretations of pre-, mid-, post- and all that. To strengthen the reader against deception Paul gives two things that MUST happen before that "Day" (the coming of the Lord and our being gathered to Him) saying the Day CANNOT come until there has been a falling away and the man of sin (lawlessness) HAS been revealed. This next statement is an interpretation and therefore debatable, but I believe Paul is actually telling us exactly what constitutes the 'revealing' of the man of sin. When we see someone sitting in the temple of God proclaiming himself to be God....that's him. He's revealed and we'll know he's this Beast character. I'll just sort of gloss over the rest for time's sake and you can ask for more detail if I didn't answer something to your satisfaction. 1. There is a "restrainer" of some kind preventing the revealing of the man of sin until his "time". Which I understand to mean God is controlling the timing. When this restrainer is taken away (I assume by God) then the man of sin can reveal himself. And when he does it will be accompanied by all kinds of deceptive miracles, signs and wonders. Hard to miss IMO. And it appears there is a very sobering change in God's dealing with hardened hearts. They appear to be released into the power of the delusion who refused to love the truth. I'll stop there. If I failed to answer something please ask further.

To be honest, I suspect Lordship is the issue in view with water baptism. When we're born again we have experienced Him as saviour. I know some in the Body believe water baptism is necessary for salvation but I personally do not believe that is so. What makes water baptism mandatory (in my understanding) is the fact that Jesus commanded it. It's a matter of obedience and when we obey, we are in a very real sense being confronted with, and accepting His Lordship. My "Lord"is one who has the right to command me and expect my obedience. I do think you can receive Him as saviour and buck when it comes to His Lordship. I've done it from time to time in my life. In one sense we're bucking His Lordship every time we sin so I don't see it as a one and done thing. I have to periodically confess, repent and recommit to His Lordship if I choose to let sin in my life again. Some christians don't seem to ever realize the necessity of submitting to His Lordship and frankly I really wasn't all that aware of Jesus as Lord for many years after I was born again. I was born again at 8 yrs old in a mainline Baptist environment (please don't hear me bashing Baptists here...I'm not) and they taught the salvation message with power authority and accuracy....every Sunday :). That left me with the impression I had "arrived" and now I just needed to share my faith and wait for His return. It resulted in years of very little growth, and eventually just pretty much losing sight of spiritual things altogether for years. And I had no clue how to share my faith I really had little detailed Biblical understanding of what had happened to me. But He never left me and I never seriously questioned whether it HAD happened. It was not until I was well into adulthood that I began to realize there was so much more and that salvation was just the entry point to vast opportunities to grow. He identifies Himself by many names and I feel comfortable now tracking my growth (in part) by how many of His Names I have EXPERIENCED Him in. Not how many I've studied or know, but by how many He has literally manifested the power of in my life experience. At salvation I met Him as saviour. At baptism I at least acknowledged His right to command and at least superficially experienced Him as Lord. Over the years (I was a soldier) He very literally manifested as the Prince of Peace in circumstances that were anything but peaceful. Powerfully enough that the men around me noticed. Hahaha...they accused me of being fearless I didn't know how to tell them it wasn't fearlessness and it wasn't me. He'd simply assured me I was safer on a battlefield in the middle of a firefight IN His will than I ever could be sittting in my own living room apart from His will. Firefights didn't faze me much after that After taht I KNEW Him as my Prince of Peace...because I had experienced Him in the power of that Name. I can relate other specific events in my life where my power to provide was insufficient and impossibly so. He showed up as my Provider. And so on... It wasn't until I got connected to a charismatic church and received the baptism in the Holy Spirit that I really began to grow much. But, thank God for the baptists :0 Man they KNOW that blood I'd guess that 80% of the American Christians of my generation very likely got born again under the influence of a Baptist ministry And that's worth a lot

If I seemed to imply you should you have my sincerest apologies My intent was to simply observe that everything the Word has warned us is coming about the Beast and the mark is now technologically feasible and pretty much already in place. That character cannot touch me (or you) unless and until Father allows it. I ain't running nowhere, and in fact I'm quite eager to get on with it I EXPECT to see God's power manifest in keeping me right up until His plan says it's time for me to go home. I am looking forward to both seeing His power once again manifest among His people on a regular basis AND going home It's gonna be a wild and woolly ride I wouldn't miss for all the tea in China Due to some things I believe I've been shown I fully expect to run TO this battle, not away from it.

Why not frame it the other way? "How do I know that the universe couldn't have been formed by God?" This debate is older than you and me put together and it's unusual for it to change anyone's mind. I'd be accused of assuming God created the universe because the Bible tells me He did. Guilty as charged Yet there IS evidence apart from Scripture that is plenty to convince me. Secular cosmologists have produced studies that show that if the ratios of hydrogen, helium and oxygen out in the farthest reaches of the universe were just a little different than they are, life as we know it here would not be possible. We have a sun and moon that are such precise sizes, set at such precise distances, in orbits so precise as to allow the much smaller moon to occlude the sun periodically, which if you study it, has provided us information about the universe we could not have obtained if eclipses were not part of our solar/planetary/lunar cycle. The whole solar system seems to be deliberately constructed in a precise way that invites investigation and greater understanding of Creation. The logical, rational, mathematical precision of cosmic motions seem to beg me to look for an intelligence that designed them and set them in motion. Any cursory investigation of the theory of evolution reveals the absolute poverty of that theory's ability to explain life in ANY way. It doesn't take much of a dive into the actual evidence available to see where it points. There's been a HUGE propaganda program intending to convince us that the "science is settled" and it's anything but. And you don't have to be a scientist to investigate it. You just have to dig past the public propaganda one layer and what you find is understandable by just about anyone that made it past 7th grade physical science. I have a friend who God has been working with in incredible ways on this very topic. Maybe he'll show up and provide some more specific examples I have *always* loved science and I have always seen it in light of the above verse. Please forgive the analogy's pagan roots but I see science as a huge cosmic "easter egg hunt". God has hidden incredible nuggets of truth about Who He is in His creation and (I believe) He invites us to go searching for them. When I study creation I very often get this sense my Heavenly Father is enjoying my search just as an earthly father might take time to hide eggs and delight in seeing his child enjoy the hunt...all the while giving hints...."You're gettting warmer......" lol

That fits with some of my own observations. The control grid is already so tight, anyone who uses a credit card, a store rewards card, facebook, twitter, anything google is already so thoroughly tracked (and that includes any use of the internet) you could be found (geographically) and a team could be vectored on your current location in a matter of minutes if they decided to apply all the tech they have available to apprehending or killing any one of us. Artificial Intelligence hosted on quantum computers is already a reality and the data processing/correlation capabilities already deployed and functional are adequate to the task. It might still take a good bit of effort to bring all the necessary technology to bear on a single target, but it is there and capability is expanding at a breathtaking rate. The roll-out of 5g networks will represent a quantum leap in how quickly they can locate any one individual and that is proceeding very rapidly. Smartphones, smart TV's, even fitness/jogging aids (any appliance that has "smart" technology) ....it's a mind boggling list and mine is very incomplete. Smart meters.......and on and on. All of which provide info about who you are, what you do, where you are doing it and even what you buy and eat. Escape from the beast's control grid will be dependent on God's supernatural intervention in the very near future and we're close to it already. But GOD.... ! We're going to do one of three things in the near future. We'll take the mark, lose our heads for not taking it, or get so close to God His miraculous power is displayed for us and through us on a daily basis. That last bunch are gonna be used powerfully by Him to bring in a harvest the likes of which have never been seen

how is that your business? EVERY good thing God has given to men has been abused by some and become sin to the abuser. Why do you single out a glass of wine for condemnation? He gave us food and warned against gluttony. Yet we have a nation of OBESE people MANY of whom are Christians. There IS no Biblical problem with "healthy" drinking. If it's taken beyond what the Bible permits then it's no longer healthy. I'm a little surprised at how provoked I feel by this topic but consider this. There are some people in this thread that are in grave danger of adding to the Word which is JUST as bad as ignoring and denying any part of it. And they are coming dangerously close to charging Jesus Himself with sin. Both of those may well have consequences far more serious than i want to see anyone endure. I'd do a serious check-up on where you're coming from.

In my personal opinion your husband is missing an important Biblical priority. My personal understanding of God's design for the family is that focus changes when a man and woman come together in marriage. There is a LEAVING and a CLEAVING which I understand to mean I am leaving my Father and Mother's house AND their headship to form a new family unit that stands before God in its own right. IMO the wife has to now become the husband's first priority and his children second. That does nothing to negate "honor father and mother" but it does mean if there's a conflict of priority or loyalty, wife and children come first. But, as much as I believe that I honestly don't have an answer as to what you can do about it but pray that God reveal to your husband HIS design and priorities. I don't know your husband if his mom still has that much hold on him I doubt there is anything you can do to modify it. But, God is under no such limitation I would suggest you love him as best you are able and pray for God to set your house in Divine order.

By your definition everyone who has ever rejected Jesus has borne the mark, and yet the Bible seems to clearly demand understanding the mark as an end time phenomena that is taken or not taken by a definite exercise of our will. Your assertion doesn't fit Scripture well enough to satisfy me.

I think we're mincing words here. My understanding is that God created Adam as the very definition of human, exactly as He designed. It's not our humanity that is the issue, its the fallen nature and dead spirit Adam's fall left to us.

hahah....this is a question I am also currently holding up to Him That is such an enigmatic passage describing such a momentous event it boggles my mind it's only mentioned in that one verse. It's very relevant to some other important passages such as Rev 20:4 where we see a VERY specific set of saints defined by a VERY specific list of qualifications who are raised immortal for a very specific (and exclusive task) in a resurrection defined as the FIRST resurrection. If the Bible says FIRST I believe it means FIRST. So my question to Him is "If Rev 20:4 describes the first resurrection and specifically defines who participates in it, what the heck happened in Matt 27:51-53?" I have learnt to dearly love finding these apparent contradictions in the Word because every time I have in the past, and presented them to Him for understanding, He's resolved them in simply astonishing ways and every time I've learnt something incredibly important. Right now the trail He seems to have me sniffing down involves the OT symbolism found in the firstfruits offerings. It's a more complex topic than I knew having never studied it in detail before, but I'm seeing some parallels in the "sheaf" of grain the people were commanded to bring to the Lord and which the priest "waved" before the altar. We do have clear witness that Jesus is described as both firstfruits and first-born of the dead. Does the sheaf imply there were more "firstfruits" raised with Him? Perhaps. A sheaf is certainly more than one stalk of grain. Lots of other places even in the NT where firstfruits are defined and I'm yet far from familiarizing myself with all of them. It's a pretty big project. But, each harvest had three main parts, a firstfruit offering, followed by a main harvest and that followed by "gleanings" which He commanded be left behind for the poor to harvest. I feel certain in my heart I'm rooting around in the right place, but I know I don't have a complete answer yet either At this point my "best guess" is that these were old testament martyrs.

I don't claim to know exactly what form the mark is going to take, but my personal conviction is that it will be a physical mark of some kind. I feel I have been taught over time to take the Bible very literally unless the text demands otherwise and I see no such requirement in the texts dealing with the mark. In my lifetime alone, technology has begun to "inform" prophecy in ways never before seen in human history. I recall when barcodes first came out and people were astonished by the amount of information one could contain there was a huge surge in people who said a barcode tattooed on forehead or hand just had to be the mark. Since that time, technology has moved from barcodes to microchips and more recently we're seeing tattoos that can interact with technology. That link outlines just a fraction of the tech tattoo/biohacking sector and it's advancing so rapidly it's hard to keep up with it. Recently I began asking the Lord about the mark with a renewed interest and some very interesting thoughts have occurred since. I am NOT saying I have a full answer but it seems He began to answer my question by correcting a misguided assumption about the real goals satan is pursuing. Until recently, I have always (without conscious thought or analysis) somehow assumed that the general outlines of this ongoing spiritual combat between God's Kingdom and satan's attempts to set up his own involved a "competition" for the souls of men. I no longer believe that. Looking at what satan appears to be pushing hard in terms of genetic manipulation I am now convinced that satan is pursuing a kingdom in which NOTHING reflects even a marred image of the Creator. I am suspicious satan's intent is to totally wipe out everything that God would call "human" and replace it with living beings that do not in any way reflect God's image at all. Important revelation? Not sure yet. But it opens up some pretty interesting (to me anyway ) speculation as a follow-on. It's got me considering whether the mark in its final form might even have a genetic component that modifies DNA and actually removes the receiver from the category God defines as human. There is considerable correlation with this thinking and what occurred on Mt. Hermon when the watchers descended and had offspring by human women. Jesus Himself pointed to the days of Noah and indicated there would be a repeat of those circumstances around the time of His return, so in that sense it's a thought compatible with Scripture. Other related thoughts involved why God considers taking the mark a final act from which there is no recovery. God loves mercy and there are so many examples where He almost begs men to give Him the slightest excuse to extend it. Only in the most egregious of circumstances does He seem to block access to mercy. Why the sharp dividing line with the mark? Is it possible that those who receive the mark have had their DNA modified to a degree that removes them from God's definition of "human"? Could DNA be modified to a point the person ceases to reflect God's image? The more I've thought about it the more it makes sense that satan would want to populate his kingdom with beings who reflected HIS image, not God's. If genetic manipulation placed a being "beyond human" would Jesus blood still cover them? I don't think it would. If that were true, then the sharp line God has drawn at taking the mark makes perfect sense. If someone has entered a state "other than human" then it seems logical enough to me to assume they are also beyond redemption. The technology exists already and is already being used in terrifying ways. If you're not familiar with CRISPR CAS-9 technology you might want to check into it. People are already using kits you can buy for a few hundred dollars to "hack" their own DNA. The "push" for acceptance of Human 2.0 and the integration of genetic manipulation, technology and biology and a host of other fundamental changes to human capabilities is quite visible in popular media now. The truly concerning thing about CRISPR technology is that it is capable of changing DNA at the germ line, which simply means offspring will inherit the changes. If parents are no longer human, their children won't be either. Another interesting thing that's entered my pondering on this topic is found in Revelation: This is arguable, but it seems this bowl judgement involves grievous sores and only affects those who have taken the mark. Is this due to their bodies rejecting genetic modifications? Just an interesting thought so far Please don't think I'm presenting this as any kind of proof This is NOT meant to be presented as truth. It's an example of a 'work in progress' as I hold some questions up before the Lord for answers. Don't put too much stock in it. I don't But it's a familiar process to me and I have no doubt in my mind He will eventually confirm or deny my speculations. For now this is just as far as I've gotten with it...

Point taken. That's a pretty definite change I didn't immediately think of. But one that is well explained by Scripture itself.

He sure did And many of the terms of that covenant were pretty clearly pre-figured in the OT. Jesus did exactly what the OT predicted He would. I'm curious what conflicts the OP thinks he sees

I find that one of the most miraculous proofs of the divine origin of Scripture is the fact that some 43 different authors, living and writing thousands of years apart, wrote a single story so coherent it is simply not within the realm of human ability to accomplish it I suspect if we examine something specific instead of your general assertion we'll find there's an answer you haven't noticed yet

I didn't mean to give you the impression I have never read the Apocrypha. I may not have read all of it but I know I've read Tobit, Sirac, I think I started 1 Esdras and never finished it but I read 1st and 2nd Macabees. I've read Enoch and The Gospel of Barnabas. All are ancient texts and have historical interest and have served to "flesh out" my understanding of what was circulating among early believers and in Enoch's case was obviously very familiar to pre-Christian Israelites. But I do not take doctrine from any of them. I personally place the 66 books of the Bible as we now have it on a pedestal so high every other text that ever was needs a spyglass to look up to it. I've studied how we got that cannon, why certain books were not included and what the "litmus tests" for inclusion were deeply enough to be convinced that the Holy Spirit Himself oversaw that process. You made one statement that I do significantly disagree with: I simply have not found that to be even close to true. Over the years as I have petitioned the Lord for understanding, He has been able to answer so many questions fully and completely that I am fully confident He can answer all the ones that remain the same way. Or He can guide me to an extra-canonical text if it's necessary. So far He hasn't done that...ever. I am supremely confident that I will not exhaust the revelation contained in those 66 books in this life time and I am even deeply suspicious that we may never exhaust it in eternity Yes, I do put the Bible on a plane of it's own and unless the Spirit Himself changes that for me it will stay there. If He has led you in another way I can't speak to that and can't judge it for sure. Be blessed I could go into more detail about my reservations with the Gospel of Nicodemus but see little point in it? I prefer to spend that time studying what I already have full confidence in.

The name Rothschild may well be closer to the heart of the efforts to establish one world government and the beast system than any other name we know. I suspect there are more powerful names but they have never and will never allow themselves to be publicly known. The Rothschild empire is truly one of the darkest we know by name.