Does Hidden Text Prove Shroud of Turin Real?

[kross]

Well, this is interesting.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,575949,00.html

If the calendar wouldn't have ben changed to measure BC and AD, would this be considered year 16 in the original Jewish or Greek calendar? She stated that she got the date, the year 16 off of the shroud.

Could someone answer this question?

[Guest shiloh357]

I see what you are saying as in Luke 23:55-56. 24:1. Mark 16:1.., we see the ladies bringing spices...in order to 'anoint' Him. There are several references to Joseph of Arimathea bringing a clean linen cloth (singular) eg Matt 27:59 and Mark 15:46. I find the text indicates that He was still buried according to Jewish custom, including wrapping the spices with the strips of cloth, which would have been impossible if they had simply placed a single cloth over Him.

yes, but the text indicates they were in a hurry, as the Sabbath was approaching so it was an incomplete job. They simply gave him a hurried burial to hold over until they had time to finish the job.

What is possible is that he had help from his mate Nicodemus, who would have wanted things done according to their traditions, and the burial included a quick wrapping of the spices on the L-rds body followed by the shroud...or the shroud could have been first. But then they did prepare a large quantity of spices John 19:39, which would have taken some time to do...so perhaps they did some, and the spices the ladies were bringing on the morning after shabbat, were actually left over from the 100lbs of spices that Nicodemus originally brought over

There really is no way to know what they did. The approaching Sabbath would seem to have precluded any time to do any kind of wrapping. The Sabbath would have taken precedence for them, especially for Nicodemus or Joseph of Arimathea.

Another thing that occurs to me is that it would probably have taken rather more time to produce the sort of image found on the cloth, than a mere three days...and this should be testable under similar conditions.

Well the image is a photopraphic negative which seems to preclude the image being made entirely from fluids present on the body coming in contact with the shroud.

[Botz]

What is possible is that he had help from his mate Nicodemus, who would have wanted things done according to their traditions, and the burial included a quick wrapping of the spices on the L-rds body followed by the shroud...or the shroud could have been first. But then they did prepare a large quantity of spices John 19:39, which would have taken some time to do...so perhaps they did some, and the spices the ladies were bringing on the morning after shabbat, were actually left over from the 100lbs of spices that Nicodemus originally brought over

There really is no way to know what they did. The approaching Sabbath would seem to have precluded any time to do any kind of wrapping. The Sabbath would have taken precedence for them, especially for Nicodemus or Joseph of Arimathea.

I don't necessarily believe that...I have often found that without necessarily entering the twilight world of speculation, we can garner a rough idea of what probably took place, when we consider all the facts at our disposal regarding many portions of Scripture...in this case the Bible clearly says they put spices in the wrappings:-

John 19:39 Nicodemus, who had first come to Him by night, also came, bringing a mixture of myrrh and aloes, about a hundred pounds weight. 40 So they took the body of Jesus and bound it in linen wrappings with the spices, as is the burial custom of the Jews.

So what is apparent is...yes the Sabbath/Day of Preparation fast approached, but they still had some time to wrap the body of Jesus in the traditional manner, maybe they could not finish it, which is why the women were coming with more spices after the Day of Preparation and the Sabbath....

The presence of Nicodemus is also significant, as I expect he was privvy to what the chief priests and Pharisees had been discussing, about getting a guard placed around the tomb and putting a seal on it, and whereas in Jesus' life he came to him surrepticiously, now in his death he was prepared to be there and help Joseph...irrespective of what other Pharisees might say or imagine.

Another thing that occurs to me is that it would probably have taken rather more time to produce the sort of image found on the cloth, than a mere three days...and this should be testable under similar conditions.

Well the image is a photopraphic negative which seems to preclude the image being made entirely from fluids present on the body coming in contact with the shroud.

Ah yes I see that now...it was a point I over-looked in the article.

[spiritman]

Well, this is interesting.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,575949,00.html

Thanks for posting this nebs The shroud is an interest of mine, and I love getting any new updated information. I think it's interesting that when in doubt the skeptics just pull out the old Radiometric dating card.

[humbleseeker]

I think its real its cool too see what Jesus face looked like when he was on earth.

[Guest shiloh357]

What is possible is that he had help from his mate Nicodemus, who would have wanted things done according to their traditions, and the burial included a quick wrapping of the spices on the L-rds body followed by the shroud...or the shroud could have been first. But then they did prepare a large quantity of spices John 19:39, which would have taken some time to do...so perhaps they did some, and the spices the ladies were bringing on the morning after shabbat, were actually left over from the 100lbs of spices that Nicodemus originally brought over

There really is no way to know what they did. The approaching Sabbath would seem to have precluded any time to do any kind of wrapping. The Sabbath would have taken precedence for them, especially for Nicodemus or Joseph of Arimathea.

I don't necessarily believe that...I have often found that without necessarily entering the twilight world of speculation, we can garner a rough idea of what probably took place, when we consider all the facts at our disposal regarding many portions of Scripture...in this case the Bible clearly says they put spices in the wrappings:-

John 19:39 Nicodemus, who had first come to Him by night, also came, bringing a mixture of myrrh and aloes, about a hundred pounds weight. 40 So they took the body of Jesus and bound it in linen wrappings with the spices, as is the burial custom of the Jews.

So what is apparent is...yes the Sabbath/Day of Preparation fast approached, but they still had some time to wrap the body of Jesus in the traditional manner, maybe they could not finish it, which is why the women were coming with more spices after the Day of Preparation and the Sabbath....

The presence of Nicodemus is also significant, as I expect he was privvy to what the chief priests and Pharisees had been discussing, about getting a guard placed around the tomb and putting a seal on it, and whereas in Jesus' life he came to him surrepticiously, now in his death he was prepared to be there and help Joseph...irrespective of what other Pharisees might say or imagine.

Another thing that occurs to me is that it would probably have taken rather more time to produce the sort of image found on the cloth, than a mere three days...and this should be testable under similar conditions.

Well the image is a photopraphic negative which seems to preclude the image being made entirely from fluids present on the body coming in contact with the shroud.

Ah yes I see that now...it was a point I over-looked in the article.

You make some good points. I was only questioning just how thorough they were with the initial wrapping since the text indicates they were in a hurry to prepare for the upcoming High Sabbath. Any wrapping they did might not have been complete and as such the women had to return with more spices.

I guess one of the reasons I don't see it as a midieval fake is that medieval art seems to lack a knowledge of human anatomy and the image on the shroud is anatomically correct. As to whether or not the image is that of Jesus, is another issue, and will probably never be solved.