The nature of the prophetic word

[nebula]

:uhh: Ergh!  This was not the message I was driving at, nor the answer I was looking for.

In writing, I presented a piece of my journey in what it means to hear the voice of the Lord, how to discern the revelation that comes from Him - in specific applications.  When the Scriptures say, "The word of the Lord came to . . ." how specifically did the prophet receive that word?  What was it like for the receiver?  In my life, I have struggled to put an application to the passage, "My sheep know my voice."  My first discovery was that my impression of how His voice speaks to me was different than my preconceived notion.  I realized that He spoke to me several times but I did not recognize it as Him - I thought it was my own concious or imaginings or whatever.  I attempted to write this down in practical terms so that maybe others can apply the applications into their own understanding.

Unfortunately, when you posted, all you mentioned was that "this is not the way God gave revelation in the Scriptures," but you did not mention how or why.  So, I was asking you to provide this.  What then is the wayGof gave revelation in Scripture?  I do not mean the end results; I mean when the revelation came, how did it come?  If you desire to argue that I am wrong, then please tell me with specifics (for that is what I understand and how I gave my first posting) how you recognize a word or a vision or a revelation that God has given you.  You say you know His voice - great!  Then please tell me how you know it.  What are some examples of the Lord speaking to you?  This is all I ask for.

I am tired of waiting for "whether the word comes to pass or not" to determine its validity.  So, what other means are there?

Or let me re-phrase this differently.  In my education classes, we have been learning there is a difference between the knowledge of cognition - knowing what something is - and the knowledge of application - how can I use this knowlege, how does it translate into practical situations, what does it mean in practice.  In reading what you have said, I saw an expression of "the knowledge of cognition."  What I was asking you for was "the knowledge of application."  Would you please provide that?

I mean not to question your place in God.  I just want to understand how you understand the receiving of God's revelation.  I mean, haven't you asked Him for some direction in your life, answers to questions, a greater understanding of what the Scriptures are saying?  Well then, how did these answers come to you?

And please, please don't throw any more power plays on me as a defense - if that is what you meant by it.  I've been walking with the Lord for almost three decades, read the entire Bible I don't know how many times,  listened to sermons out my ears since I was 5, etc., etc., etc.  Does that emphasize my argument to you any?  Probably not, right?  Well then, it's kind of pointless to get caught up in such schematics, don't you think?  OK?

[Matthitjah]

Brother Shadow,

Concerning John 21?

Did you ever examine it this way?

This is my understanding.

The disciples are out fishing. Not fishing for men but fishing they are not doing G-ds will.

They also are not prospering in it.

Then in the morning Jesus comes and stands on the shore calling to them" Have you any food?"

Had they prospered? No!

Now He commands them. Then they prosper greatly.Drawing in multitudes of fish.(They prospered in the Lord not in their own activity)

Who recognized the Lord? John the one He Loved. Why do you suppose He Loved Him more? He was able to recognize the Lord. He must have been in His will and walking in His Grace much.

Verse 7 even states that once Peter heard it was the Lord (He didn't reconize Him at first he had to be told it was the Lord). Peter puts on his outer garment and plunges into the sea (For he had taken it off). What outer garment? Who puts on a jacket to swim? The outer garment he had taken off was that of his spiritual armour. He had shed it and was walking once again in his own power .Failing the Lord. When he heard it was the Lord he put it back on. Plunging into the sea.(World).

Jesus proceeds to ask Peter 3 times" Do you Love me? exasperrating poor Peter. Why would the Lord ask this of Peter? Maybe Peter wasn't doing His Will. This you see from the Lords response to Peter's answers of affirmation.

Verse 18-19 is the Lord telling Peter you will walk in my Will. At the end of 19 He commands Peter " Follow Me.". I believe because Peter was not following Him.

Now when Peter turns and see's John following also. Why was John following? John was living in the Will of the Lord and heard the command recognizing the Lord's voice.Poor Peter still not getting it ask's "What about this Man?" Peter was still not in the Lords Will. Still worried about others and trying to rule the day in his own power.Even probably thinking if "I must die this way? What about him?" Trying to justify the Lords Will.

Then in verse 22 Jesus say's to peter "If I Will that he remain till I come, what is that to you? You follow ME."

So He's saying to Peter. Why are you concerned about him ? He's following my Will. Now you Follow My Will!

As far as John tarrying until the Lord comes. I think he meant until the Lord made His Revelation evident to John on Patmos.

Look at verse 23 and 24. Jesus did not say to him that he would not die. This is the disciple who is testifying these things (John). Don't you think John who recognized the Lord and was walking in His Will would know what the Lord said?????Hmmmmm

Sorry Nebula to hijack your thread.

Peace :il: Amen

[tsth]

Thank you Dr. Luke,

Great post, I really enjoyed reading it, and gleaned much from it.

In His Love,

Suzanne

[The Journey]

Neb,

[Guest shadow2b]

Brother Shadow,

Concerning John 21?

Did you ever examine it this way?

This is my understanding.

The disciples are out fishing. Not fishing for men but fishing they are not doing G-ds will.

They also are not prospering in it.

Then in the morning Jesus comes and stands on the shore calling to them" Have you any food?"

Had they prospered? No!

Now He commands them. Then they prosper greatly.Drawing in multitudes of fish.(They prospered in the Lord not in their own activity)

Who recognized the Lord? John the one He Loved. Why do you suppose He Loved Him more? He was able to recognize the Lord. He must have been in His will and walking in His Grace much.

Verse 7 even states that once Peter heard it was the Lord (He didn't reconize Him at first he had to be told it was the Lord). Peter puts on his outer garment and plunges into the sea (For he had taken it off). What outer garment? Who puts on a jacket to swim? The outer garment he had taken off was that of his spiritual armour. He had shed it and was walking once again in his own power .Failing the Lord. When he heard it was the Lord he put it back on. Plunging into the sea.(World).

Jesus proceeds to ask Peter 3 times" Do you Love me? exasperrating poor Peter. Why would the Lord ask this of Peter? Maybe Peter wasn't doing His Will. This you see from the Lords response to Peter's answers of affirmation.

Verse 18-19 is the Lord telling Peter you will walk in my Will. At the end of 19 He commands Peter " Follow Me.". I believe because Peter was not following Him.

Now when Peter turns and see's John following also. Why was John following? John was living in the Will of the Lord and heard the command recognizing the Lord's voice.Poor Peter still not getting it ask's "What about this Man?" Peter was still not in the Lords Will. Still worried about others and trying to rule the day in his own power.Even probably thinking if "I must die this way? What about him?" Trying to justify the Lords Will.

Then in verse 22 Jesus say's to peter "If I Will that he remain till I come, what is that to you? You follow ME."

So He's saying to Peter. Why are you concerned about him ? He's following my Will. Now you Follow My Will!

As far as John tarrying until the Lord comes. I think he meant until the Lord made His Revelation evident to John on Patmos.

Look at verse 23 and 24. Jesus did not say to him that he would not die. This is the disciple who is testifying these things (John). Don't you think John who recognized the Lord and was walking in His Will would know what the Lord said?????Hmmmmm

Sorry Nebula to hijack your thread.

Peace :il: Amen

heyyyyyyy doc----once again you want to spiritualize--symbolize scripture when it is clear what is being said by the speaker to the one ASking the question-----JESUS speaks directly to Peter & tells him how he would {die--crucifixation]

peter then asks JESUS what will this man do??[JOHN} it is quite clear that JESUS tells peter[in effect] what john does is none of your business--FOLLOW ME------bro. doc.your eschatology of WHAt JESUS is saying isNOT based on the scriptures as they state clearly what they mean & mean what they say, there is NO need for {interpretation symbolism,spiritualization......the ONLY way for scripture to be symbolic is when it is quite clear symbolizm is being used---like the beasts in daniel,--the beast,horns, great whore in REvelations----  sorry doc but some things do mean what they actually say---- i do respect your opinions & insights & we are brothers in the LORD---SOoooo GOD-BLESS-YOU-DR.LUKE---thank you for your contributions----shadow2b{Gary}--

[Guest shadow2b]

Hey, Shadow -

Oh!

[nebula]

Journey and shadow2be - Thanks for the clarification!  Now I understand what you guys were saying.  

shadow - I have come to learn not to stress too much over trying to make heads or tails out of what is written in Revelation.  Chances are, things won't be truly understood until they are upon us or past.  That's the funny thing about prophetic vision - unless the Lord reveals the interpretation to you, it is impossible to figure out, and even what He does reveal still leaves you feelilng   .

Oh, how the Lord LO-O-O-O-O-O-O-O-VES to frustrate the flesh!!

[George]

Hey Nebula,

As you walk with the Lord, and the more you grow a certain paradox forms.  You begin to grow closer to the Lord and the more you begin to learn and understand, but because you are getting closer to the Lord you begin to realize just how unworthy we are and you begin to realize how much we really don't know.  This is one of my favorite verses:

1 Corinthians 8:2  And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.

Don't worry about trying to figure it all out, the reality is that there's is absolutely NOBODY that has it all together perfectly!  If we did, then we would be in glory already!  But strive to find yourself approved before God and the Spirit will teach you all things. (1 John 2:27)

Your brother in Christ with much agape love,

George

[OneAccord]

Yeah, Nebula, the Lord is just keeping us busy trying to figure it all out until He comes.  Just so long as we don't pretend to have it figured out we'll be fine.

[Matthitjah]

Amen George,

Thank you for that post.

You know I seek much! :il:

Yet I keep getting walk in my light, Lean on Me.

So I still seek. Yet my walk is more enriched by the trust I have learned to place in Him.

If I concentrate on the next step and where He wants me to be, letting Him lead. I find myself more in His will and less concerned about knowing it all in advance. I then am more likely to see His will all around me. I can then act accordingly. This also teaches me more about the Lord as I walk.

Do you all realize we have all eternity to figure Him out? Even so it just might take that long.

GBU richly

Peace  :il: Amen