Why America MUST fall

[~candice~]

Oldzimm Australians have never,as a whole,put the high value on gun ownership the Usa does.

I guess a lot of that has to do with the differences between how our respective countries were founded, huh?

Yes, I think that makes a huge difference!

If they were to take guns off you, they would be removing something that was central to your foundation. To take guns off us... well, OK, whatever, LOL. That's how it feels to us, no big deal.

I'm scratching my head trying to think of an analogous right they could take off us that would cause a resistance, but I can't think of one.

Also, note that our rights are not enumerated like yours are... we do not have an explicit bill of rights nor do we have a constitution that spells out rights... our rights are held to be self evident (as yours) but are implicit, and are only explicitly stated when a case [relevant to rights] goes through the high court and receives a ruling.

[nebula]

I'm scratching my head trying to think of an analogous right they could take off us that would cause a resistance, but I can't think of one.

No more Vegemite?

[~candice~]

I'm scratching my head trying to think of an analogous right they could take off us that would cause a resistance, but I can't think of one.

No more Vegemite?

I'm thinking more along the lines of the Boxing Day Test .

[Bold Believer]

Oldzimm Australians have never,as a whole,put the high value on gun ownership the Usa does.

I guess a lot of that has to do with the differences between how our respective countries were founded, huh?

Yes.

Try taking away our booze though and see what happens!

Michael Duffy, a journalist writing in 2006, says

The Rum Rebellion has slipped into historical oblivion because it is widely misunderstood. It is popular belief that the autocratic Bligh was removed because he threatened the huge profits that were being made from trading in spirits by the officers of the NSW Corps and by businessmen such as John Macarthur. This view suggests it was nothing more than a squabble between equally unsavoury parties.

The conflict had greater depth than that of a mere squabble, however. Essentially it was the culmination of a long-running tussle for power between the government and private entrepreneurs, a fight over the future and the nature of the colony. The early governors wanted to keep NSW as a large-scale open prison, with a primitive economy based on yeomen ex-convicts and run by government fiat.[6]

Duffy goes on to say that the Rebellion was not thought of at the time as being about Rum:

... almost no one at the time of the rebellion thought it was about rum. Bligh tried briefly to give it that spin, to smear his opponents, but there was no evidence for it and he moved on.

Many years later, in 1855, an English Quaker named William Howitt published a popular history of Australia. Like many teetotallers, he was keen to blame alcohol for all the problems in the world. Howitt took Bligh's side and invented the phrase Rum Rebellion, and it has stuck ever since.[6]

Some historians reject the idea that the conflict concerned Bligh's policy: deposing him because of his policy would have been pointless as the new Governor would simply continue the policy. They see the main cause to have been Bligh's attitude towards the gentry of NSW, and his failure to accept them as his social equals.

The Biography of Early Australia[clarification needed] dismisses Macarthur's complaints as ridiculous and quotes Evatt as saying that legally Macarthur was guilty of two out of the three charges brought against him including sedition.[8] Both consider that Bligh was wholly justified in his actions because he was the legitimate authority. In addition, imprisoning people and threatening to do the same to the court when they failed to yield to the will of said authority would seem to be legally problematic. Duffy states that had Johnston arrived when summoned on 25 January the Rum Rebellion probably would never have happened.

What would set off you Ozzies?

The OZ government ordering all Kevin Bloody Wilson recordings destroyed! That man needs Christ. Or the government ordered closing of the Foster's beer factory.LOL

Any government that strips its citizens of their right to bar arms is tyrannical. Sorry. If "They" are that afraid of you as a citizenry that they deem you unworthy of bearing arms for self-defense in time of need (especially since police can't be everywhere) there is something afoot.

[~candice~]

If you are going to set up a standard by which the only way a country can be labelled free is if they are free in ALL regards, then your country will also fail the test.

The lack of rights to bear arms does not render us living under tyranny.

They are not "afraid" of us.

[He giveth more grace]

Get the big picture here! It's all about globalization! The sons of men are going back to plan A - the tower of Babel.

That is one people, one government. I don't understand the ramification of Babel and what they wanted to accomplish, but I have been thinking a lot about Babel lately.

[oldzimm]

If you are going to set up a standard by which the only way a country can be labelled free is if they are free in ALL regards, then your country will also fail the test.

The lack of rights to bear arms does not render us living under tyranny.

They are not "afraid" of us.

That is the difference between our two countries, my government is afraid of the citizens. That is why our government keeps trying to sneak in new gun laws.

Nebula is right, it is all how our countries were founded. When the USA was born we just got done fighting an government that was oppressive, so our founding fathers came up with the individuals Bill of Rights. Our founding fathers knew there could always be a chance that the Federal Government could become oppressive, so they put in the 2nd amendment in the Bill of Rights (the right to bear arms). Obama could be a good example why we have the 2nd amendment. The only time we need the 2nd amendment is when Big Brother tries to take it from us.

Oh by the way candice, I personally feel brown eggs taste better then white.

[~candice~]

Yes, I understand how much your foundation affects your perspective on the issue of bearing arms. This is fine, our foundation affects our perspective too .

[Bold Believer]

If you are going to set up a standard by which the only way a country can be labelled free is if they are free in ALL regards, then your country will also fail the test.

The lack of rights to bear arms does not render us living under tyranny.

They are not "afraid" of us.

That is the difference between our two countries, my government is afraid of the citizens. That is why our government keeps trying to sneak in new gun laws.

Nebula is right, it is all how our countries were founded. When the USA was born we just got done fighting an government that was oppressive, so our founding fathers came up with the individuals Bill of Rights. Our founding fathers knew there could always be a chance that the Federal Government could become oppressive, so they put in the 2nd amendment in the Bill of Rights (the right to bear arms). Obama could be a good example why we have the 2nd amendment. The only time we need the 2nd amendment is when Big Brother tries to take it from us.

Oh by the way candice, I personally feel brown eggs taste better then white.

Or when Joe Burglar decides to hit YOUR house. Or when Sam Serial Killer decides to make you his next victim. Or when Robby Rapist thinks you're hot and decides to pay you a visit. Or when Petey Pervert decides to grab you one day. Or when Stevey Stick-up man thinks you're a good target. The Second Amendment is for more than just defending against an out of control government. It's for personal protection too. The police can't be everywhere, the Supreme Court has already told us that. So ultimately, we are responsible for own personal safety.

[oldzimm]

If you are going to set up a standard by which the only way a country can be labelled free is if they are free in ALL regards, then your country will also fail the test.

The lack of rights to bear arms does not render us living under tyranny.

They are not "afraid" of us.

That is the difference between our two countries, my government is afraid of the citizens. That is why our government keeps trying to sneak in new gun laws.

Nebula is right, it is all how our countries were founded. When the USA was born we just got done fighting an government that was oppressive, so our founding fathers came up with the individuals Bill of Rights. Our founding fathers knew there could always be a chance that the Federal Government could become oppressive, so they put in the 2nd amendment in the Bill of Rights (the right to bear arms). Obama could be a good example why we have the 2nd amendment. The only time we need the 2nd amendment is when Big Brother tries to take it from us.

Oh by the way candice, I personally feel brown eggs taste better then white.

Or when Joe Burglar decides to hit YOUR house. Or when Sam Serial Killer decides to make you his next victim. Or when Robby Rapist thinks you're hot and decides to pay you a visit. Or when Petey Pervert decides to grab you one day. Or when Stevey Stick-up man thinks you're a good target. The Second Amendment is for more than just defending against an out of control government. It's for personal protection too. The police can't be everywhere, the Supreme Court has already told us that. So ultimately, we are responsible for own personal safety.

Yes Bold Believer that just about covers it......................Oh yea! I like hunting and the shooting sports too and there is the other hobbies that go with it, such as reloading my own cartridges. I like it when I can come up with a recipe that will put three shots in a one inch circle at 100 yards.