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Posted

I have three:

1. How is it that the Pope is seen as infallible and if he makes a declaration in the official format (I forget what it's called.)? Also to go along with that, if he makes a statement that is seen as infallible, how can he then change a statement that was once seen as infallible?

2. Explain for me how, at communion, the elements become Christ's body and blood given Jesus present condition. That of being alive and all.

3. Explain the apocrypha and why traditional Christianity doesn't recognize them as canon but the Catholic Church does.

In His Grip.

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Posted
I have three:

1. How is it that the Pope is seen as infallible and if he makes a declaration in the official format (I forget what it's called.)? Also to go along with that, if he makes a statement that is seen as infallible, how can he then change a statement that was once seen as infallible?

2. Explain for me how, at communion, the elements become Christ's body and blood given Jesus present condition. That of being alive and all.

3. Explain the apocrypha and why traditional Christianity doesn't recognize them as canon but the Catholic Church does.

In His Grip.

1. Something i ahve always had trouble understanding.

2. There is biblical basis for this. I believe Christ is present in the communion but donot believe in a literal changing of the Bread and Wine.

3. The aprocrypha was in the original cannonization, and was only remove by Luther during the Reformation of the church, you would have to do some research on Luther to see why he chose to remove them. The Original 1611 KJV includes the Apocrypha.

God Bless,

Dave


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Posted
Serotta,

But if you continue in the scripture to Lk 1:30 it states that Mary had "found favor", or in another interpretation of the Greek "obtained grace" from God. I personally find very little evidence in scripture for the position that Mary was without sin, and far more evidence that "ALL have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God" Romans 3:23 (emphasis added).

The Greek word used in Luke 1:28 is kecharistomene, and although I am not an ancient Greek scholar myself, it is my understanding that this word means more literally "You who have been made agreeable to God". This rendering seems to be in even for agreement with the idea that Mary was made special before the Announciation. We usually translate it as "Full of Grace", which also implies that she is not sinful, and makes a person wonder that if she is full of grace, how can this be consistant with her having Original Sin?

As for Romans 3:23, I would be cautious of interpreting this in a way that leaves room for no exceptions. We know that Christ did not sin, yet was human. Also there is a distinction between the state of sin, and active sinning. To commit a sin takes an act of the Will, whereas all men are born into a state of sin called Original Sin. We shouldn't interpret Romans to mean that every person has committed actual sin. Take for instance a little child who dies at the age of 3 months. Have they commited a sin? No, they have not, but they were still nevertheless born in a state of sin, but I hope you can see the difference.

I looked at 6 different translations, and only the 2 Catholic translations use the term "full of grace". All other say "highly favored".

We all agree that Jesus was both 100% God and 100% human, and yes He was the ONLY human without sin. But where in scripture do you make the jump to Mary being without sin. You've offered one verse that could possibly be interpretted in this way, while there are many verses that clearly state that ALL have sinned.


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Posted

Dr. Luke,

QUOTE

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Posted

Serotta,

Could you explain the difference between "mortal" sin and "venial" sin? What scripture reference is there for this distinction? Could you list the "mortal sins" and give scripture reference? Thank you.

First, let me define sin. It is an utterance, deed, desire, or omission contrary to the eternal law.

Some sins are more serious then others because they constitute a greater deviation from the eternal law. There are three criteria to make a sin Mortal.

1) It has to be a very grave matter

2) The person must have full knowledge that the act is contrary to God's law

3) The person must fully consent to the act, freely exercising his will

A venial sin is a less serious matter, or when one of the other criteria is not sufficiently met.

1 John 5:

16 He that knoweth his brother to sin a sin which is not to death, let him ask: and life shall be given to him who sinneth not to death. There is a sin unto death. For that I say not that any man ask.

17 All iniquity is sin. And there is a sin unto death.

As for a list of mortal sins, I could not give you a comprehensive list, but here are some that St. Paul mentions.

1 Corinthians 6:

9 Know you not that the unjust shall not possess the kingdom of God? Do not err: Neither fornicators nor idolaters nor adulterers:

10 Nor the effeminate nor liers with mankind nor thieves nor covetous nor drunkards nor railers nor extortioners shall possess the kingdom of God.


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Posted

Dave (dwinkjr),

I would also like to add to this Katholish, What about the Catholics baptism by desire? You say if a person is unbaptized or dies in "mortal sin" they will go to hell. But does not the Catholic church also teach of baptism by Desire? Meaning if one is not baptized by water but desired to do so they will still go to heaven?

Yes that is true, when I said unbaptized I meant either by sacramentally by water, or by Desire, or Blood, I was just not specific there.

I had mentioned this very briefly earlier in a response to Botz:

I wrote:

However, there are three kinds of Baptism, of water (the sacrament) but also by blood or desire. Thereby even the Incas before the arrival of Christopher Columbus had a chance to be saved, even if it wasn't a good chance. Just as Christ desires all men to be saved, He has esblished means by which all men have that chance.

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Posted
You got your work cut out for ya Katholish! HA! :P:rofl:

I know, three pages in as many days is a substantial response.


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Posted

Dan (dgolvach),

Dose the Catholic Church believe in purgatory?

Yes.

Purgatory is a place of purgation where all of the souls of the just that are saved and will eventually go to Heaven go to be rid of their attachment to sin (if any) and the temporal punishment due for sins already forgiven.

If so? How do you reconcile that with the Gospel? What scripture supports it?

There is repeated referrence in the Scriptures of a need for purification before a person can enter Heaven. I will just give one here.

1 John 1:

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all iniquity.

10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar: and his word is not in us.

However, the most explicit referrence to Purgatory in the Sacred Scriptures is in the Second Book of Machabees. Of course though, when Luther was trying to teach against indulgences, he naturally had to attack the idea of purgatory. Of course this would have been near impossible with such explicit Scripture to refute him, so he simply took it out of his Bible. (Which he was also tempted to do with the Epistle of James because it says that man is justified by Good works and not by faith alone, thank goodness that he did not remove this epistle as well)

2 Machabees 12:

38 So Judas having gathered together his army, came into the city Odollam: and when the seventh day came, they purified themselves according to the custom, and kept the sabbath in the same place.

39 And the day following Judas came with his company, to take away the bodies of them that were slain, and to bury them with their kinsmen, in the sepulchres of their fathers.

40 And they found under the coats of the slain, some of the donaries of the idols of Jamnia, which the law forbiddeth to the Jews: so that all plainly saw, that for this cause they were slain.

41 Then they all blessed the just judgment of the Lord, who had discovered the things that were hidden.

42 And so betaking themselves to prayers, they besought him, that the sin which had been committed might be forgotten. But the most valiant Judas exhorted the people to keep themselves from sin, forasmuch as they saw before their eyes what had happened, because of the sins of those that were slain.

43 And making a gathering, he sent twelve thousand drachms of silver to Jerusalem for sacrifice to be offered for the sins of the dead, thinking well and religiously concerning the resurrection.

44 (For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should rise again, it would have seemed superfluous and vain to pray for the dead,)

45 And because he considered that they who had fallen asleep with godliness, had great grace laid up for them.

46 It is therefore a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead, that they may be loosed from sins.

Did the thief on the cross who called out to Jesus for salvation take communion? or get Baptized?

He did not receive Holy Communion certainly, but I would probably say that he received Baptism of Desire.

If Jesus in the only way, how can there be a vicar for him?

Christ is the Head of the Church, however, as He ascended into Heaven and sits at the right hand of the Father, and no longer walks among us in bodily form, there is need of a visible head for the visible Church. The care of Christ's flock sometimes requires an active role which the successors of St. Peter have provided (though insofar as disciplinary matters have been concerned they had failed to do as good a job as one might have wished at a few points in history), this is way Christ told St. Peter to feed His sheep shortly before He ascended to the Father.


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Posted

Let me preceed my question by saying that I know very little about the Catholic faith so this may be a dumb question. Do catholics believe that there are books other than the Bible that are the christian's God-inspired source of instruction? Are there other books that catholics view as equal to the Bible and carry as much weight so to speak?


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Posted

Thanks for your answers to my questions Katholish I am having a think about them and will reply soon...in the meantime I see that you are doing your best to wade through loads of questions in a kind and considered manner...all the best. Botz. :P

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