There Is No Seven Year Tribulation

[Guest]

.... leave ya'll to your (*ahem*) "discussion". (*cough*)....

:24:

All the days of the afflicted are evil:

but he that is of a merry heart hath a continual feast. Proverbs 15:15

[Matthitjah]

Punishment of Israel for what?

I won't even answer that as the bible historically states the reasons very plainly. It's all in your bible, so you can now go there and read it.

That is anti-semitic LDS Religious tripe.

Please, I'm not LDS nor am I anti-Semitic. I support the new state of Israel very plainly and openly, as I'm sure most of these fine posters here do.

Now.... we should get back to the subject at hand, and the mathematics involved. There's no room with mathematics to jest.

No, please do expound on the thought of the punishment since you profess knowledge. Is the whole purpose of the tribulation to punish Israel?

[Matthitjah]

Is this what your talking about when you say "Jacobs trouble?"

Jer 30:7

Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.

[Guest]

i never do understand why people feel it's so important to cram their view of the tribulation/rapture/etc down others throats. this is not critical to salvation. what is critical is what we believe about Jesus. and hopefully everyone reading this is on the same page there, so regardless of how it all happens, we WILL see each other in the next millenium.

in the meantime, i find these "discussions" wholly unedifying. so i choose not to read them. but i just really can't help but ask, why IS it that others feel it is their job to debate the dickens out of a non-essential doctrine? especially when it usually boils down to everyone insulting each other. very unchristlike.

Many of these people, most of these people are not cramming, they are sharing. Personally, I do not see a lot of insulting going on either, maybe I am not looking for it. People discuss all sorts of things on the forums which are not about salvation, food comes to mind. That is fine, the bible talks about food too. About three out of ten verses in the bible, contain prophetic content. I might be going out on a limb here, but my thought is that if God in His wisdom thought that making the bible 30% prophetic, it might just be that He intended that we learn and understand some things about non essential prophecy. For those who have no interest in the topic or in the debate, they of course have the choice to not seek out threads where that is the topic! I hope that wasn't to unchristlike.

But there might be more than one understanding of that truth. With issues like this, both can't be right; yet each believe that what they believe is the correct interpretation and firmly grounded in Scripture. Neither group will be moved from their position until the time has come and the Lord explains it to us.

I have no idea why you think that Parker. Perhaps some have no desire to change their view, and refuse to be enlightened. I am a former premie and now a postie, and know plenty of posties who are also former premies, Therefore, your premise is categorically false.

[sdktlk]

In all the discussions of times and dates one would think that the statement of our Lord would be of import. "Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, and saying, THE TIME IS FULFILLED, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel." (Mar 1:14-15)

As we know every Word the Lord Jesus spoke is of great import, and He would not have said "the time is fulfilled" without it pointing to some specific "time frame" that could be understood by those who heard Him. That being the case would it not seem important to understand His proclamation, with respect to what "time" was now brought to the full, made replete, completed. What say you?

[OneLight]

In all the discussions of times and dates one would think that the statement of our Lord would be of import. "Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, and saying, THE TIME IS FULFILLED, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel." (Mar 1:14-15)

As we know every Word the Lord Jesus spoke is of great import, and He would not have said "the time is fulfilled" without it pointing to some specific "time frame" that could be understood by those who heard Him. That being the case would it not seem important to understand His proclamation, with respect to what "time" was now brought to the full, made replete, completed. What say you?

The time for salvation for through Him are we saved. Jesus was surely not saying the tribulation ...

[sdktlk]

In all the discussions of times and dates one would think that the statement of our Lord would be of import. "Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, and saying, THE TIME IS FULFILLED, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel." (Mar 1:14-15)

As we know every Word the Lord Jesus spoke is of great import, and He would not have said "the time is fulfilled" without it pointing to some specific "time frame" that could be understood by those who heard Him. That being the case would it not seem important to understand His proclamation, with respect to what "time" was now brought to the full, made replete, completed. What say you?

The time for salvation for through Him are we saved. Jesus was surely not saying the tribulation ...

No, nothing to do with the tribulation. Our Lord's statement was pointing to a specific TIME fulfillment. The one's that were present at beginning of the Lord's ministry should have been able to understand what TIME He was speaking of if they were worshiping God in Truth. We can see an example of understanding the "time" recorded in Daniel, for we see it written, "In the first year of his reign I Daniel understood by books the number of the years, whereof the word of the LORD came to Jeremiah the prophet, that he would accomplish seventy years in the desolations of Jerusalem." (Dan 9:2)

We see in this that Daniel, being a true servant of God, "UNDERSTOOD BY BOOKS" what TIME it was. So also should have those who were present at the beginning of the Lord's ministry. For it is written, "Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. KNOW THEREFORE AND UNDERSTAND, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem UNTO/UNTIL the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks." (Dan 9:24-25)

Those that were present should have known and understood that the 69 weeks were completed, as all the information necessary to know that fact was, and is, contained in Books, and that the last week was at hand wherein, "And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself." (Dan 9:26a) The Hebrew word kârath, here interpreted "cut off" means specifically "to cut covenant," and we know the Lord did cut covenant, but not for Himself, He did it for us.

All those who seemed to be somewhat at the time of Jesus should have understood what time it was "by books" but they did not.

[OneLight]

You are partially correct. If Daniel could understand, then why not the rest? Yet, we have to remove them from the understanding of the Book of Daniel itself for the Lord commanded Daniel to :

Daniel 12:4

[sdktlk]

You are partially correct. If Daniel could understand, then why not the rest? Yet, we have to remove them from the understanding of the Book of Daniel itself for the Lord commanded Daniel to :

Daniel 12:4

"But you, Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book until the time of the end; many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase."

Agreed. The majority of Daniel was indeed closed for centuries. But, because of the Lord's proclamation with respect of a "time" being fulfilled one would think that the 70 week portion of Daniel was opened to those who truly served God and wanted to see the Truth. They had understanding of "a day for a year" from Ezekiel, and from Malachi they knew that Elijah (the spirit of) was to come, though, in the words of the Lord they did not recognize him in the person of John the Baptist. They also were aware of the temple having been rebuilt, "even in troublous times" (Dan 9:25) By these things we can understand that they should have know what "time" it was, but they did not.

With respect to the Book of Daniel, I do not see it being closed past the advent of our Lord Jesus Christ for then He could not have expected anyone to be able to understand "the abomination of desolation," which we as believers are instructed to KNOW. With respect to it now being even partially closed it is not, complete understanding of all that is written in the Book of Daniel is available before the Lord to those who would desire to know.