Rapture Question

[elijanoch]

First, PLEASE let's not turn this into a debate on whether there will be a Rapture or not. Thanks.

Okay, my question to those that do believe we will be raptured:

Do you think we will be raptured before the Antichrist appears on the scene, or after?

2 thes 2

6And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

1thes 4

16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

18Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

1 thes 3:13 To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.

In Revelation when is the last verse Church is mentioned in the Bible?

Now if it were at the end of the tribulation, whose going to repopulate the world for the 1000 year reign of Christ?

Beliievers get glorified bodies- 1corinthians 15

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

Isaiah 26

19Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.

20Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.

21For, behold, the LORD cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.

1 Thessalonians 5

1But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.

2For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

3For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

4But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

5Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.

6Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

Daniel and Revelation give the number of days for The Tribulation we would be able to predict Christ return and we would be ready for Him

matthew 24:36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

Would this be thief like?

Zephaniah 2: 3 Seek ye the LORD, all ye meek of the earth, which have wrought his judgment; seek righteousness, seek meekness: it may be ye shall be hid in the day of the LORD's anger.

Luke 21

34And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.

35For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.

36Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Ephesians 5

29For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:

30For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

31For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

32This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

weddings of ancient Israel

Bridegroom Comes for His Bride

When the bridegroom's father deemed the wedding chamber ready, the father would tell the bridegroom that all was ready and to get His bride. The bridegroom would abduct his bride secretly, like a thief at night and take her to the wedding chamber. As the bridegroom approached the bride's home, he would shout and blow the shofar (ram's horn trumpet) so that she had some warning to gather her belongings to take into the wedding chamber. The bridegroom and his friends would come into the bride's house and get the bride and her bridesmaids.

Seven Days in Wedding Chamber

The bridegroom would take his bride to the wedding chamber where they would spend seven days. The bridegroom's friend would wait outside the door of the wedding chamber. When the marriage was consummated, the bridegroom would tell his friend through the door, and the friend would announce it to the assembled guests. The guests would celebrate for seven days until the bride and bridegroom emerged from the wedding chamber.

Marriage Supper

After seven days in the wedding chamber, the bride and bridegroom would emerge and participate in a feast with friends and family. There would be joyous celebrating during this feast. The feast would conclude the wedding celebration.

Depart for Home

After the marriage supper, the bride and bridegroom would leave the groom's father's house where the groom had built the wedding chamber. They would go to their own home, which the bridegroom had prepared

John 14

1Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.

2In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

4And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.

5Thomas saith unto him, Lord, we know not whither thou goest; and how can we know the way?

6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

mathew 24

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

[one_christian_warrior]

PLEASE BE AWARE = 2020 VISION

Why the TRIBULATION MUST START by or before MARCH 14, 2012

YES,,, THERE IS A DEADLINE,

FOR THE RETURN OF CHRIST,

Derived from the verse in Mathew 24:34 + 33

(Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.)

(So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.)

Let me show you God

[one_christian_warrior]

if there is no rapture,

Ok,,, if there is no rapture,

Then please explain why,

is doors plural in Mathew 24:33

, and

why is it that the church is no mentioned,

past chapter 3

when all the bad stuff happens later,

after chapter 4 when God says,

COME UP HITHER

, or

why are we told that,

no one knows the date or time,

if Jesus only returns once,

at the end of tribulation,

a day that we will be able to calculate,

and the tribulation Saints,

will not only know the date of His return,

but they will no doubt be patiently waiting for it

believe me,

every believer will checking off the days,

until Jesus sets His Feet on earth again,,,

[ayin jade]

(please check over all my logic + calculations)

I SEEM TO BE ON MY OWN HERE

(I cannot understand why no one has seen this before)

Logic and calculations are flawed. You are on your own because you are in error.

Matthew 24:36 But of that day and hour no one knows, no, not the angels of Heaven, but only My Father.

Your words conflict with the words of Jesus.

[Guest]

AFTER

[Fez]

(please check over all my logic + calculations)

I SEEM TO BE ON MY OWN HERE

(I cannot understand why no one has seen this before)

Logic and calculations are flawed. You are on your own because you are in error.

Matthew 24:36 But of that day and hour no one knows, no, not the angels of Heaven, but only My Father.

Your words conflict with the words of Jesus.

I SEEM TO BE ON MY OWN HERE

(I cannot understand why no one has seen this before)

I agree with AyinJade.

The reason you seem to be on your own and no one has seen this before is because it is not truth.

Her quote above says it all.

You have still not answered my question on the welcome thread.

Tell me how you believe God has spoken to you and "made" you a prophet. What other prophecies that you have made have come to pass?

[Guest shiloh357]

PLEASE BE AWARE = 2020 VISION

Why the TRIBULATION MUST START by or before MARCH 14, 2012

YES,,, THERE IS A DEADLINE,

FOR THE RETURN OF CHRIST,

Derived from the verse in Mathew 24:34 + 33

(Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.)

(So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.)

One of the big problems is that this passage is not talking about the Second Coming. Jesus is answering this question:

As he sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately, saying, "Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the close of the age?"

(Mat 24:3)

People have assumed the "coming" being referenced is the 2nd coming, but that is not possible. At the time the disciples asked this question, they had not yet accepted that Jesus was going to die, much less be resurrected or ascend into heaven and return a second time. The idea of a "second coming" would not have been in any way in the minds of the disciples. They simply had no point of reference for that.

[Fez]

PLEASE BE AWARE = 2020 VISION

Why the TRIBULATION MUST START by or before MARCH 14, 2012

YES,,, THERE IS A DEADLINE,

FOR THE RETURN OF CHRIST,

Derived from the verse in Mathew 24:34 + 33

(Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.)

(So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.)

One of the big problems is that this passage is not talking about the Second Coming. Jesus is answering this question:

As he sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately, saying, "Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the close of the age?"

(Mat 24:3)

People have assumed the "coming" being referenced is the 2nd coming, but that is not possible. At the time the disciples asked this question, they had not yet accepted that Jesus was going to die, much less be resurrected or ascend into heaven and return a second time. The idea of a "second coming" would not have been in any way in the minds of the disciples. They simply had no point of reference for that.

Succinct as always

[nebula]

Logic and calculations are flawed.

Good point. The track record for calculating dates so far has proven to be 100% wrong.

Jesus said He'd come back like a "thief in the night." Calculating a date for His return is basically telling Jesus you don't believe Him.

[rollinTHUNDER]

PLEASE BE AWARE = 2020 VISION

Why the TRIBULATION MUST START by or before MARCH 14, 2012

YES,,, THERE IS A DEADLINE,

FOR THE RETURN OF CHRIST,

Derived from the verse in Mathew 24:34 + 33

(Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.)

(So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.)

Verily I say unto you, THIS GENERATION SHALL NOT PASS, =(die)

http://2020-vision.yolasite.com/

If we are this end time generation,

and most everyone feels that we are,

This generation started in 1967

when Israel took back Jerusalem,

and it must soon come to an end

before the year of 2020

Brother, you are setting yourself up for a great and mighty fall here. For your own sake, I sure hope that you are not leading a congregation. This is the same type of stuff that got Harold Camping in the mess he's in now.

I too, believe that we are the generation that will see the fulfillment of these things, but let me ask you one thing, if I may? What makes you so sure that an entire generation must pass away in 53 years or less? Does this particular generation not have anyone that will live to be 55 or 60? Most generations these days have people living to the age of 110 or 115 years. What is it exactly, that leads you to believe this current generation will be different?