These Men are Full of New Wine ?

[Guest spirit filled?]

Hi firends in Christ, and God Bless You..................

Acts ch.2:13........" Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine".

Eph. ch.5:18 " And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit".

Please share your thoughts on the above two scriptures, and thanks ahead of time for your comments.

Is it possible, that today, a person may act like a drunk (beer or wine, or whiskey) person..........and claim the Holy Spirit, is the reason, for acting this way?

Is there today, people who have been filled (the Spirit comes upon, not in, but upon),with the Holy Spirit.......Or is 'upon', the same as 'in'?

Thanks again for your comments, and answers to my questions.

May our Lord Bless you, today, and always.

[dgolvach]

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Christians are commanded to be sober

What kind of person should a true Christian be? One thing the

New Testament states is that he should be sober. He should

be a sober-minded person. For example in the book of Titus,

Chapter 2, verse 2 we read "that the older men be sober ... "

and in verse 6, "exhort the young men to be sober-minded."

What does it mean to be sober or sober-minded? Let us look at

the dictionary definition.

Sober. 1. quiet, serious, solemn, grave or sedate 2.

characterized by reason, sanity or self-control; showing

mental and emotional balance. (Webster's New World

Dictionary)

Sober-minded. adj. having or showing a sober mind; self-

controlled; sensible; reasonable. (World Book Dictionary)

Now let us present, from Roget's Thesaurus, words similar in

meaning:

Sober, solemn, grave, serious, earnest, thoughtful, sober-

minded, sedate, staid, calm, composed, sensible, reasonable,

rational, logical, well-balanced, levelheaded, coolheaded,

temperate; plain, simple, natural, unadorned, unaffected,

matter-of-fact.

Sobriety carries with it the basic idea of being under the

control of, or regulated by or ruled by, Mind, Intellect or

Reason. It also means not being under the influence of an

intoxicant --- a meaning that presumably comes from the effect

that an intoxicant has on a person in robbing him of good

sense, balance, judgment and reason.

Thus a Christian is supposed to be a certain kind of person: a

person always under the control of, or regulated by, Mind,

Intellect, Reason; serious, sensible, thoughtful, reasonable,

well-balanced, etc.

[Guest Thomas I believe]

Thus a Christian is supposed to be a certain kind of person: a

person always under the control of, or regulated by, Mind,

Intellect, Reason; serious, sensible, thoughtful, reasonable,

well-balanced, etc. this paragraph is not a quote from me. Its from the previous reply. I dont know how to do that stuff yet..

Amen

Edited October 16, 2004 by Thomas I beleive

[larryt]

Thus a Christian is supposed to be a certain kind of person: a

person always under the control of, or regulated by, Mind,

Intellect, Reason; serious, sensible, thoughtful, reasonable,

well-balanced, etc.  this paragraph is not a  quote from me. Its from the previous reply. I dont know how to do that stuff yet..

Amen

Hi Thomas,

David says that God restores the soul, our mind, will, emotions. Ask and you shall receive.

As for the "drunken." Keep in mind the culture and what middle eastern people did when they started to drink alcohol. Not falling down drunk as we imagine here in this time. The apostles were rejoicing and possibly jumping up and down for joy in the Spirit. Not stagering around as some would have us believe.

LT

[AnotherTraveler]

Acts ch.2:13........" Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine".

The presence of the Lord can be overwhelming, and when overwhelmed we often have an emotional response that can appear as unstable, and on the day of pentecost (partially quoted) I am certain that it was. They were defending what reasonably looked like drunkeness to the uninformed.

Many Pentecostals are charged with extreem emotionalism, and not without some merit, but an emotional response has NOTHING to do with not being sober minded.

Many men have dismissed the voice of their wife as she reasoned with them while also being very emotional, just because she pleaded with tears does not make her plea to be invalid.

I have seen people that were scripturally correct but spiritually cold fish, and though I agreed with the scriptures, I did not agree with the hard hearted way they presented the scriptures.

[larryt]

Acts ch.2:13........" Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine".

The presence of the Lord can be overwhelming, and when overwhelmed we often have an emotional response that can appear as unstable, and on the day of pentecost (partially quoted) I am certain that it was. They were defending what reasonably looked like drunkeness to the uninformed.

Many Pentecostals are charged with extreem emotionalism, and not without some merit, but an emotional response has NOTHING to do with not being sober minded.

Many men have dismissed the voice of their wife as she reasoned with them while also being very emotional, just because she pleaded with tears does not make her plea to be invalid.

I have seen people that were scripturally correct but spiritually cold fish, and though I agreed with the scriptures, I did not agree with the hard hearted way they presented the scriptures.

Another,

I do agree for the most part with your statement. The picture that is presented in scripture is not the same as the picture we have of drunkenness; slurred speech, incoherancy, wobbly walk, etc., as portrayed by some unmentioned charismatic preachers.(Holy Ghost bartender) What was being referenced to was the effects of a small amount of alchohol in the system. The apostles were accusted of loss of inhabition, not Bowery Alcoholics.

LT

[apothanein kerdos]

The key in this is that the disciples were filled with wine....not hard liquor. There would have been a difference. Trust me, people got drunk to the point of wobbling around, however to do this off of wine would have been EXTREMELY difficult.

Most likely the disciples were crying, shouting and speaking in other languages. Thus to those ignorant of the event, they would have seen a bunch of men walked around, shouting in a language unknown to the hearer, and crying...so drunk probably was the best way to describe it. Had it been one man, he would have been nuts...but a group....drunk.

[Botz]

larryt...

The apostles were accusted of loss of inhabition, not Bowery Alcoholics.

What you been drinking Larry??

[Botz]

I think from our own experiences of being filled/overwhelmed/baptized in the Spirit we can conclude that at times to any onlookers and non-participants we might well look drunk or on drugs...pure love directly from Heaven fed into your inner most being ...elicits all sorts of emotions and reactions.

[George]

What about this scenario?

The men who were hearing the apostles in their own language were asking one another what does this mean?

Men were there saying -- No I hear him in my language - No I hear him in my language!

Then men stood up and said looking at the men who were listening to the apostles -- What are you drunk? It's obvious I hear them in MY language!

Peter then stands up and says -- No these men are not drunk (referring not to the apostles -- but to the crowd who were hearing them in their own language) -- this is what was spoken of by Joel!

That scenario makes the most sense to me. Imagine yourself in the situation. And you heard them in English, yet the Korean next to you heard them in Korean and the Japanese guy hears them in Japanese. Wouldn't you say to the Korean -- give me a break it's obvious they are speaking English? What in the world are you drinking?

Just another way of looking at the situation,

Your brother in Christ with much agape love,

George