Demonic or Phsycological

[larryt]

If God is omnipresent, everywhere at all times, where are these demons you people are talking about, since God is already everywhere.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi TC,

Welcome to WBs. Time and space to us is not the same thing to God. We live here on the earth and are subject to the physical world. We are told in the bible that there is a spiritual "world" that is just as real. Demons are spirits as well as angels. All we can know about the spiritual has to be revealed because it is not normally accessible to us. How God can be everywhere at once is not something I believe any of us can fully comprehend, yet because it is in the bible I accept it as the rest has proven to be trustworthy to me. This does not mean that God takes up all space because we are not God. We are separate from Him as we are individuals. We christians do not believe in a pantheistic god that encompasses everything and everything is god.

To answer the second part of your question, the demons are in people most of the time as they are desiring to affect this world for their own purposes. The only way they can do that is to control a physical body to some extent. Jesus is the only way to overcome them. He is the only way we can even see them for what they are as pure evil.

LT

[larryt]

Just so you know, BTW,

I might have been overreacting to this comment:

Again I will ask, "Why are we trying to stay here on this earth?"  Do we want to stay here one moment longer than we have to?  And if God wants us here can anything "be against us?"  We show how much we long to be with God in heaven and how much we love this world. 

 

LT

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can't tell you the number of times I was ready to end my life - by my own hand. After all, wouldn't it be better to be with God right now than to be stuck down here?

Now, I'm not saying your comment isn't sincerely about your wanting to be with God, but how many times is this an "excuse" for wanting to "just get away from it all"?

A lot of people have reasons for staying, and it's not about "loving this world" - i.e. family, ministry.

So, yeah, I'm a bit sensative to comments that sound like "just let yourself die...." - even if that isn't what you meant - it tends to come out that way.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi Neb.,

This is not about a deathwish. It is about a desire to obey God in all things. He is looking our for my best interests. As Paul submitted himself to God he recognized that though his desire was to go home it was more necessary for him to remain. Paul was not preoccupied with trying to stay here. His focus was in serving the Lord Jesus Christ and not wasting time and resources on making this life more comfortable.

And you hit something on the head. "to end my life - by my own hand." and "excuse" Neither of these have I even hinted at. It is all about serving Him.

If it is a choice between dealing with sin or going to the doctor, most chose going to the doctor rather than deal with the sin. The ONLY person that Jesus healed from anything and indicated was not due to sin was the man born blind. Just one person. And yet no one wants to admit that their problems are primarily due to sin.

LT

[larryt]

E=mc2...Energy = matter x speed of light squared....which means all matter in this universe is a manifestation of one energy. 

If you break an atom down, which is the building block of matter, you'll find electrons, neutrons and protons. And if you break the electrons, neutrons and protons down, you'll find energy. Within that energy that manifests itself as all things, there is a consciousness that decides a tree is a tree, a dog is a dog and a human is a human. I believe that the consciousness in the energy, is God. Therefore, this material universe is a manifestation of God experiencing itself. 

Yeah, I know, probably a little too deep for those who grew up believing in a God that lives up in the sky, and demons that run around possessing people.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi TB,

The universe declares the glory of God. All this matter and energy talk is not new to me. But that is all it is, just matter and energy. Where did the energy come from? The design in everything is proof of a designer. Interesting book if you can find a copy. God doesn't believe in atheists, proof the atheist doesn't exist. by Ray Comfort.

This is a christian site and if you want to know something about christianity then you can ask. You don't have to believe in demons or God if you chose. That is your choice. I chose to believe. The bible tells us about God and the spirits. The bible has proved itself to me in more ways than you can imagine.

You come across as condescending. Why don't you explain to us in a thread all about string theory if you can. Or is that too deep for you since you don't believe in God. And how about quarks, pions, neutrinos and about 20 other bits of matter that have been discovered. And they still don't understand what holds it all together. Only theories.

LT

[nebula]

If it is a choice between dealing with sin or going to the doctor, most chose going to the doctor rather than deal with the sin.  The ONLY person that Jesus healed from anything and indicated was not due to sin was the man born blind.  Just one person.  And yet no one wants to admit that their problems are primarily due to sin.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey, Larry!

Thanks for answering.

I'd be a little careful, though, about judging everyone's sickness as sin. I agree that sin does cause illness, but all sickness?

(Pssst . . . you better pray cats doesn't read this - she'll be down your throat in a heartbeat on this! )

Note: I have been through deliverance sessions (note - plural), and have been instructed on such things as demonic influence and sin influence, and I have been tormented by demons and had a demon try to take over me one time - so I do know this stuff.

But let's say you - through no fault of your own - are involved with a car accident and your leg gets broken. If you pray over your leg for healing and it doesn't get healed, do you refuse a doctor from setting your leg and putting it in a cast?

But here is something else to consider:

1 Timothy 5:23

No longer drink only water, but use a little wine for your stomach's sake and your frequent infirmities.

Why would Paul be telling Timothy to drink wine for his infirmities? Isn't that medicating?

[nebula]

E=mc2...Energy = matter x speed of light squared....which means all matter in this universe is a manifestation of one energy.

If you break an atom down, which is the building block of matter, you'll find electrons, neutrons and protons. And if you break the electrons, neutrons and protons down, you'll find energy. Within that energy that manifests itself as all things, there is a consciousness that decides a tree is a tree, a dog is a dog and a human is a human. I believe that the consciousness in the energy, is God. Therefore, this material universe is a manifestation of God experiencing itself.

Yeah, I know, probably a little too deep for those who grew up believing in a God that lives up in the sky, and demons that run around possessing people.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You are speaking up my alley! (I'm science major.)

I have often speculated things like this.

Although I don't agree with your conclusions on things - sounds a bit too New Agey.

The spiritual realm is a big mystery, and the only explanation I can figure to place it in context with is that it is another dimension. You've seen those sci-fi shows where the alternative dimension can see the "main' dimension, but the "main" dimension can only experience effects coming out of the other (the show being about discovering the other dimension and how it's affecting their circumstances.

That's kind-of what it's like.

But until you have had encounters with that other dimension, you most likely would not be able to understand or believe in its existence. That is understandable. It is the way our society is built. Our society doesn't like things it cannot control, nor things it cannot understand. So, it is disbelieved.

I know I can't make you believe that angels and demons exist.

I can ask you, though, not to make judgments on our experiences for which you know absolutely nothing of. You don't know what Larry went through; you don't know what I went through. You weren't there. I know you would like to interpret for us what we experienced based on your beliefs, but truthfully, you don't have the ability to know what really happened, as you are too far removed from the situation.

So please be careful how you judge another. Your knowledge is too limited. That's just the way it is.

[Matthitjah]

Grace to you,

After having been married to a fine woman who is a Nurse. Who was led by God to be a Nurse. Who has always wanted to be a Nurse and is a woman of Faith. After having met her Nursing friends for years and many fine Doctors for years. After witnessing a Doctor who is a very fine Doctor save my wifes life earlier this year by the hand of God and His immeasurabler Grace. I owe the Lord the Glory for this Doctors skill.

I want to add this then close this thread, which really has gone on way too long. If this Doctor who saved my wifes life, had not the desire in his heart(which God placed there) to become a Doctor? She would currently lay dead and be departed from this earth unto our heavenly Father. I would not currently be expecting with great joy a Blessing from the Fathers hand beyond all comprehension. It was due to the Fathers desire which He has Created for the whole of the Medical field, that she lives. Be they Pagan or not. For we are Created in God's Image and are filled with Good desires by the Father. Science generally was started as a way to explain God did exist. It has been hijacked just like our beloved Nation. Started with Good intentions and desires, then fallen away in the lust of mens hearts. That does not relegate the whole Medical field to sorcery or even the incapacity to desire Good outcomes. The fact of the matter is that medicine is a Good thing, although it can be overused at times. Like anything balance is in need here. Anything taken to an extreme will result in a loss of balance. Even Spirituality.

It may be the next time you go to the Doctor? That this particular Doctor could have been prepared beforehand by God, a chosen vessel for His Glory.

Many a man now lives from a battlefield in the past. Who has gone on to do great things and speak of God's very Glory. Those many men have lived on by the hand of a Doctor who was raised up by God with Medicines from the Fruit of God's very Spirit. They go on to give Glory to God.

One last thing. My Home Church right now is seeing the Glory of God fulfilled. For surely His Glory will fill alll the earth. We have a Mission in Africa. It has not had a Medical center for the last two years. Many Babies infected with AIDS have died in the Bush for a lack of Medicine and Medical Doctors and Nurse's to care for them. This dream is now becoming a reality as a team has been formed from our own Church. They have led the charge acroos America and into some Latin country's to find Doctors and Medical personell to go over on rotation. The first thing they must do however is PRAY that the Father will provide the funds to build a Medical Center in the Bush. This center will serve over 150 children as well a few scattered Tribes. Also several Mission projects an farms, including our own, in the outlying areas. God has been faithful to His Word that if we would humble ourselves and Pray? He would hear. Just yesterday a man who just got Saved donated a $40,000 vehicle to be auctioned off. It will be sufficient to start the project and will add to the burgening funds the Lord has provided. Please do not make assumptions that the Lord has not brought forth the Medical field from the Goodness of His Provision and Spirit. I know of too many fine men and women inspired by God who can prove that statement false.

Peace,

Dave